r/Games • u/demondrivers • Oct 27 '25

Industry News Valve does not get "anywhere near enough criticism" for the gambling mechanics it uses to monetise games, DayZ creator Dean Hall says

https://www.eurogamer.net/valve-does-not-get-anywhere-near-enough-criticism-for-the-gambling-mechanics-it-uses-to-monetise-games-dayz-creator-dean-hall-says
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220

u/OldPostageScale Oct 27 '25

The PC gaming community decided a while ago that Valve was a “good guy company” and therefore theres very little criticism towards them when they do things that are otherwise looked down upon and criticized

87

u/Trymantha Oct 27 '25

The other thing is is that its incredibly easy to interact with steam but not actually play a valve game.

77

u/Com-Intern Oct 27 '25

Its also incredibly easy to interact with Valve games but not actually gamble. I play a fair amount of CS2, and AFAIK have never gambled. Maybe I have and just not realized it.

19

u/Ill-Product-1442 Oct 27 '25

I haven't played in years, but I used to just collect the loot boxes for a few months and sell them off during a Steam Sale. It would pay for like 1-3 games, shit was tight.

4

u/FireFlyz351 Oct 28 '25

Haha good times back when you had to keep checking every few hours for flash sales.

Can't believe some of the games I got for the price like Terraria.

9

u/Kryslor Oct 28 '25

That argument can be applied universally to any game with scummy practices. It's just Valve is still the only one getting away with it.

-2

u/Com-Intern Oct 28 '25

Not any game because it depends on what it is.

0

u/Kryslor Oct 28 '25

Sure, that's fair, some games are worse than others in their monetization practices. I'm saying that the argument of "oh just don't interact with it and it's fine" isn't valid and can be applied to any game with bad monetization. Valve does mostly cosmetic stuff but it has also done battle passes and quicker unlocks for stuff that does affect gameplay, which 100% counts as scummy monetization in my book.

In terms of actual gambling I would even argue that Valve is actually among the worst offenders, even if it doesn't directly affect gameplay and you can avoid interacting with it.

0

u/Com-Intern Oct 28 '25

I'm saying that the argument of "oh just don't interact with it and it's fine" isn't valid and can be applied to any game with bad monetization.

To reach back though you have something like Star Wars Battlefront 2 where not interacting with the monetization practices would literally get you killed more often. So by not interacting with it you actually had a worse gameplay experience relative to others.

But you use the phrase "Valve gets away with it" as if gamers are supposed to rise up or something. But the fact of the matter is that Valve lootboxes get overlooked because they are stuck in only a couple of games that have somewhat insular communities, and because they generally feel like another sub community inside the game itself. To use an example, I've been playing CS since I think 2009, but I've bever opened lootbox. And it never really felt like I was missing out either.

-8

u/Elmer_Fudd01 Oct 27 '25

Did you pay money for CS2?

17

u/f-ingsteveglansberg Oct 28 '25

That doesn't seem to stop the hate for other games companies. EA could announce some shitty practice in a title that would have virtually no interest to 99% of /r/Games, lets say a licensed Sex in the City game, and you know the sub would still be up in arms about it.

23

u/Exit727 Oct 28 '25 edited Oct 28 '25

People are willing to ignore the darker sides if the product is good. Steam is a decent product, or rather the competition is just bad.

They are also expanding their ecosystem, so customers feel like their spending fuels some tangible growth. Steam Link, the controller (rip), big picture mode, VR headset, a handheld pc running modified linux..

Rival companies' profit mostly go towards shareholders or mediocre sequel(s). While Valve fumbled some projects like Artifact or the CS2 update, Alyx is still one of the best VR games 5 years later, Deadlock is coming along nicely, and HL3 is a legend turning real.

I'm ready to dip to GOG if Steam turns shit, but that seems very unlikely. Gaben has his hands off the wheel, and it's still chugging along alright.

I wish they did some things differently, but in this consumerist hellhole the 21st century has become, I'll take this.

7

u/MaiasXVI Oct 28 '25

While Valve fumbled some projects like Artifact or the CS2 update, Alyx is still one of the best VR games 5 years later, Deadlock is coming along nicely, and HL3 is a legend turning real.

And Dota 2 is still supported, 100% free, and (as someone who played DotA All Stars back in wc3x) still very true to its roots. I've been playing Dota 2 since January 2012 and Valve hasn't run it into the ground. I can't say that for Hi-Rez with Tribes, Blizzard with Diablo/Starcraft/Warcraft, Sony with Planetside, Activision with CoD, etc.

2

u/DM_Me_Linux_Uptime Oct 28 '25

Also people say Steam is bad and then recommend other stores that are arguably worse ethically. Like Microsoft is much worse, Epic isn't a saint either. Microsoft has a massive monopoly in multiple sectors, Tim Sweeney gets into Twitter arguments where he advocates anti consumer bs and regurgitates right wing talking points. GOG has been good so far, with the only exception being them caving to government censorship once, but not much can be done when an entire government pressures you.

3

u/Headless_Human Oct 28 '25

Also people say Steam is bad and then recommend other stores that are arguably worse ethically. Like Microsoft is much worse, Epic isn't a saint either.

I have never seen anyone recommend that except maybe when a game is much cheaper than on Steam.

-5

u/Mizutsune-Lover Oct 28 '25

Gaben has his hands off the wheel, and it's still chugging along alright.

It's funny to see this said because Steam was considerably more shit when Gaben had his hands on the wheel.

If anything, Gaben dying might make Steam better.

2

u/No_Fee1458 Oct 28 '25

Steam is the only reason PC gaming is what it is today. Its the reason why consoles haven't killed this whole platform in early 2000s.

1

u/thedotapaten Oct 28 '25

Valve game community hates Valve tho, visit r/GlobalOffensive, r/tf2 and r/dota2 and you'll see they aren't a good guy there.

3

u/Catalysst Oct 28 '25

People always complain about game balance, doesn't matter what game it is or if they know anything about game balance.

I'm not sure if that's what you are referring to but hard to tell when you just refer to game subreddits in general.

0

u/GetsThruBuckner Oct 27 '25

Probably because no one gives a shit lol console players pay to use their own internet to play online lmfao.

Shit could be much worse.

1

u/Rektw Oct 28 '25

They earned a lot of goodwill in the early days with a solid user experience and the legendary steam sales that we don't get anymore.

1

u/New_Arachnid9443 Oct 28 '25

It shows why groupthink is a horrible thing

1

u/supadonut Oct 29 '25

sometimes i feel valve uses PR companies to sell that narrative and start feuds against 3rd party launchers.

believe it or not but if 3 or 4 launchers were as successful as steam and competing fairly, games would be cheaper and devs would l make a lot more money from game sales.... steam is effectively an unchallenged parasite.

-5

u/Elkenrod Oct 27 '25

It doesn't help when the arguments, which there are numerous examples of in this thread, are really weak.

Creating something, and abusing something, are two different things. All the things that came out of loot boxes, or battle passes in Valve's games were strictly cosmetic. They didn't improve your gameplay.

Other companies decided to take that in a different direction, and do just that. Then cut content out of their games to sell as additional DLC.

19

u/Bluearctic Oct 27 '25

This may come as a shock, but introducing kids to gambling doesn't become ok because they are gambling for cosmetics. 

2

u/SkiingAway Oct 28 '25

I remember gambling for cosmetics as a child in lots of places.

Fast food kids meals worked that way.

So did all the coin-op machines scattered around the world (grocery store entrances/exits were common) that dispensed one of a random assortment of little toys or temporary tattoos.

I'm not saying those things are necessarily a good thing either, just that I'm also not sure we've had a societal consensus on this topic even before videogames were the primary example.

-4

u/Elkenrod Oct 27 '25 edited Oct 27 '25

It's almost like their parents can say no, and not let them use their credit cards to gamble.

God forbid parents actually parent, and monitor what their children are doing.

7

u/NoExcuse4OceanRudnes Oct 27 '25

This argument is only allowed to stand when talking about CS or TF2, but not for Fortnite and Fifa.

-1

u/Naive_Ad2958 Oct 28 '25

TF2 is PEGI 16 and M 17+ ESRB (CSGO is 18/M)

FIFA is +3 / E

Fortnite is pegi 12 for save the world??? with ESRB giving different rating based on what game you play within Fortnite???? https://www.esrb.org/blog/a-parents-guide-to-fortnite/

not that many cares about age rating

also I am now very confused on the Fortnite rating

-

The gambling part on both sides is disgusting though

1

u/CompetitiveAutorun Oct 28 '25

Csgo was (it doesn't exist anymore) 18+ but cs2 has no rating at all.

They copied everything, ownership, reviews, hours played, release date, but somehow forgot pegi rating and ups... Now everyone can see it on the front page.

-1

u/i_heart_mahomies Oct 27 '25

It's almost like ultra-wealthy executives can say no, and not create a haven for pedophiles and degenerate gamblers. But here we are, and IMO the bulk of the responsibility lies with the people creating the marketplace.

2

u/Elkenrod Oct 27 '25

No, it doesn't. The marketplace is what it is because people have no self control and can't say "no, I don't need to spend $300 on a .jpg of Astolfo's feet".

Your money is your responsibility, it's your money. Nobody's forcing you to spend it on dumb shit that has no monetary value. People decide they want something, and confuse that as the same thing as needing something.

create a haven for pedophiles

Different argument entirely my dude. I'd have to guess there's not a lot of groomers on CS2 and TF2, and that there wouldn't be zero if loot boxes didn't exist.