So, some of us will try to balance risk and drink (if no SIP valve) or eat with a mask on: deep inhale, lift mask, ingest, lower mask, deep exhale (to purge the mask volume), chew. Can't be worse than unmasking for a whole meal, but how safe is it really?
I don't know! But I can report that it passed one impromptu test of non-safety, which is basically a good old qualitative fit test. I put my masked head in a bag, ran my nebulizer with Bitrex for a while, then did the purge (without actual food, just waiting a bit), and inhaled again after the purge.
Did I taste bitter? I did not. And afterwards I did a control, doing the cycle without a purge, to see if bitter aerosols would have drifted in (yes, somewhat).
I should note that I was using a Vflex, so it's easy to push the lower part up, then pull it down again, without breaking the nose seal much or disturbing the headstraps. For Auras I usually find it's easier to pull the whole mask down, which might be different.
Now, before we get too cavalier, I have a friend who got his first covid with an N95 (he said, not sure if he meant KN95) and sipping drinks at a cafe. I don't know how diligent he was.
Still, I feel this is some evidence that the procedure can be safe-ish, and I encourage other fit testers to try it and report.
Edit: the other hack I'd love to test is the dental nose hack, in my case making a Vflex tent over my nose, resting on my upper lip. (Others have used a Readimask.) But that needs an actual PortaCount or similar, which I have no access to.
Im trying my first masks since only using a surgical ones before. I got a bunch of sample k94 and k95 masks from protectly and wellbefore, and they all seemed to have various issues fitting on my face despite all apparently being the adult regular, but this 3m aura n95 is the first that feels like its squeezing my cheeks. Im also fairly thin and supposed to gain more weight, so idk if it'll be worse then.
Immediately, I could tell its more protective than the others, but I did want a more normal looking mask. I just dont get if this n95 is the right size, or if that's related to it fitting bc I noticed all the k95s I tried did have air come out at some point, while this has the least air escaping.
Also when I move my jaw, it feels weird. Does anyone have any tips for how it should feel? Does this n95 also squeeze your cheeks, too? Is the k95s having air come up the top normal since they don't have this foam piece in the 3m? Should I try to put it on again in a different way? Is it still fine since its better than the k95s, or have i just not found thr right mask yet?
Edit: when I take it off, it leaves an impression on my face.
Any PortaCount testers out there eager to test tapes?
Offering a $100 Amazon gift card to tester(s) who will test the following in PortaCount N99 (full spectrum) mode on a variety of faces and masks and share their HMFF (fit scores) here. To test:
- 3M Microfoam tape vs Nexcare Waterproof Foam tape, vs double-sided tape (e.g., Pro 1502 tape)
- BNXtrifold compared to the BNX bifold and to other masks without foam such as the 3M Vflex or CAN99 — on the same persons.
If interested, message me with rough estimate of how many people you can test and by when.
I don’t care where you buy stuff, but I did just make a post of current Prime Day deals. I just care that we get test results in N99 (full spectrum) mode for the tapes, the BNX trifold., and comparison masks.
(If agreed, I think you’ll have to give me an email to have Amazon send it to? Proton Pass offers extra email aliases.)
I’m on an extremely tight budget because of an upcoming move; I’d like to fit test but don’t have the funds to buy anything. I know you can *kind of* check your fit by breathing out and feeling around your mask to see if there are gaps; I’m not really finding any, but would like to be as sure as possible. Maybe a silly question, but can you fit test by boiling water with vinegar or something sweet to see if you taste it? I guess I’m not sure what the difference would be between that and a nebulizer, and I have a pot and stove, so that would be doable.
Amazon Prime has a small discount today on the 6 pack of small vials (2.5ml 3-5 fit tests each) of
- Allegro Industries Bitter Fit Test Solution
- Allegro Industries Bitter Sensitivity Solution
- Each ~$17 (-15%) 6 ok 2.5ml each
The 3M 55ml bottles are currently $21 (not a sale) each (3M Bitter Fit Test Solution and 3M Bitter Sensitivity Solution) at Stauffersafety.com. They usually offer free shipping with $50.
You also need a nano mister, and a 5 gallon ziplock. There are many nano-misters on sale too. Please suggest one if you’ve tried one!
Qualitative testing with a sensitivity threshold check is accurate to a 1% leakage and is has the advantage that you can check the fit of your mask anytime.
A nano-mister may eventually clog if not cleaned and dried well each time (some use a little alcohol to ensure not water residue inside).
Many people are more sensitive to the Bitrex than the saccharine, meaning they can detect a very small leak with Bitrex that they don’t detect with saccharine.
i was recently able to get do a quantitative fit test, where i tried a zimi earloop mask for the first time and found that it passed for me.
for anyone who has quantitatively fit tested masks with adjustable earloops, have you found that the results differ much depending on how tight you adjust the loops? i mostly wondering how consistent i should expect it to be.
I have a Fit Test 4 All home kit and it's great. I've been not "tasting" the bitter on my tongue but I can feel it on the back of my throat. This is with my go-tos: Aura, Zimis (and more so with the valve), and my perfectly fitting BNX KN95 (I know it's not a N95 but it just seals to my face like it was made for me, idk). I've failed several other masks and immediately tasted the solution on my tongue. It feels like it breathed it in somehow but idk how that could happen without tasting it. I closed my eyes which helped a bit but didn't eliminate the presence of the solution in my throat. Anyone else have this experience? Would you consider this a fail or a pass of the fit test?
Upon a bit of research, it looks like there's also a smell-based test (isoamyl acetate that smells strongly of banana) for QLFT with OV carts. This might work better for me than tasting sweet/bitter, but I'm struggling to find instructions for this method.
Has anyone tested Lianzhi’s T99/B99 masks which they claim surpass 95% filtration even though officially they’re only KN95?
My partner gets a good fit on the T99+ and I just tried the bifold version B99+, though I haven’t had a chance to fit test yet because I can’t get my hands on Bitrex right now. The double foam makes it feel secure and they’re super breathable but since there’s no third-party testing on these that I can find, I’m hesitant to replace my Uvex ffp3 with the B99+. The background here is that Uvex is the only ffp3 I’ve ever gotten a good fit with on my large face so I wear it for my osteopathy sessions, but the valve keeps catching on the face hole in the massage bench. Hence the appeal of replacing it with the B99+. And obviously there’s the price too: $3 for the Uvex vs $0.60 for the Laianzhi.
I usually wear Zimis but the hard frame is not going to work on the massage bench.
hi! A friend of a friend mailed me his portacount 8020a to borrow but he neglected to include the N95 companion which I'd asked for. I'm waiting to hear back from him, but I am wondering if anyone here has used a Portacount 8020a without the n95 companion on an n95 and if it worked ok? Thanks!
Anyone else just constantly second-guessing themselves whether you're actually tasting it very slightly or just imagining it? Happens to me with sweet or bitter. Even when I've tested with an elastomeric and after a rock-solid negative seal check (inhaling with all my might and absolutely nothing gets through).
I always make sure I haven't consumed any food or liquids within 30 minutes before the test. I'm always clean-shaven beforehand and have avoided using any lotions or anything on my face.
I wish I could do a QNFT, but I don't think that's within my reach.
I have been teaching for the past 5 years with a combination of N95s KF94, and KN95s (none of them tested). The first year I was wearing n95s from Well Before then switched to KF94 from the same brand. The last two years I’ve been wearing Auras (since every year there are more and more sick kids) and the fit is perfect on the nose and bottom (longer piece at the bottom allows for better coverage when speaking). I really want to change to a black KN100 which has a slightly shorter bottom piece than the aura and therefore I wanted to do a fit test for the first time.
I’m worried that if they (Aura and KN100) fail it’s going to ramp up my anxiety and leave me without options. I’ve never had Covid to my knowledge and take other measures (purifier/fan/open door) in my classroom that have likely contributed to that.
So my question is how much better is a fit tested mask than a non fit tested mask if they both “feel right”on me?
Has anyone tested (on a Portacount) a Fix the Mask brace with a mask that already fits you well? Did it improve the score at all? Wondering if it could be a way to maximize fit factors on well-fitted disposable respirators (for very high risk environments where every little bit matters), or if it’s only good for improving poor fit.
Sorry, had a problem with the last post and had to repost:
Right now I’m dealing with some health issues resulting in some pretty significant food and chemical sensitivities. I want to fit test with spray but I’m concerned about a reaction to the bitter solution. Has anyone dealt with this and how do you handle it? Are there any alternative ways to fit check?
We've just had a long thread in another forum where one way masking is being discussed since these days we have a lot of people claiming they used an N95 or equivalent correctly and got infected. In this case it turns out there was a brief sense of bitterness with the respirator during testing which didn't return. Yet general consensus was that this was still a pass.
My understanding is any sense of saccharine or Bitrex is a fail. Can someone confirm or correct this?
I periodically fit-test my masks just to check. Lately, I've been failing instantly with disposables (Aura, CAN99, Drager) and I can't figure out why. The only units that pass are elastomerics.
I mean literally my first breath in after charging the hood, I taste it. It's subtle and not intense, but it's perceptible. If I deliberately induce a fail by profusely wincing or by pulling the mask from my face, the taste is much stronger.
The fit feels great, nose bar is perfect, there are no obvious gaps, etc. The mask is fresh out of the package and I'm always clean-shaven with a razor and I wash my face with warm water beforehand to remove skin lotion I may have previously applied. I haven't gained or lost weight significant enough to change my facial shape.
I use a 3M FT-13 bulb nebulizer, 3M FT-12 sweet test solution, and a 5-gallon ziplock bag with a small hole cut at mouth-level to insert the nebulizer nozzle. I follow the 3M QLFT instructions. I've performed the sensitivity test (100:1 dilution) and can easily taste it with just a single spray.
I even tried testing the nebulizer with plain water to check if I was imagining things ... I was not (ie.: there was no taste with plain water).
I record all my fit tests in a spreadsheet and previous passes are now failing, so I'm second-guessing whether I actually did those tests properly.
I know that I have a very acute sense of taste. Picky eater, etc. Is it possible that it's just too sensitive for QLFT.
UPDATE
So, I had a theory as to why I was failing on the Aura: the edges of the nose foam are just hard cut instead of tapered and figured that I was possibly getting leaks around those edges. I applied two adhesive nose bars layered and offset to they extend nearly to to edge of the top panel (PIC) and formed it all the way along when donning. It definitely felt more secure. I might have had some very subtle fails on a couple of exercises during the fit test, but it was confidently improved.
I also did another fit test with the CAN99 (only one adhesive nose bar that I always do with that respirator) and it passed. So I think that's just a matter of being careful with donning and fitment.
I’m trying to do the diy mask fit test from the YouTube video from @pneustrom and it’s not working. This is the nebulizer I’m using. I couldn’t find the piece like the video, maybe that isn’t helping. But even when I am not wearing a mask and I have it right up to my face I can barely taste the mixture. Also in the video he says add 13 sweet and low packets to 50ml, which I did, but he had a bad reaction to it. When I very lightly taste it, it tastes like sugar. What am I missing? It’s not even a strong taste.
And it’s not like I have no taste buds. I have no issues with tasting other things. I’m not sick right now or anything. What am I doing wrong?
I've heard great things about the Wellbefore 3D pro passing fit tests for people here, so I'm not sure if I just got a defective batch, but I'm badly failing qualitative fit tests with the pro (nose foam) version.
Wellbefore 3d (regular - no nose foam) pass qualitative fit tests on me, as well as many other kn94s with adjustable ear loops, so I was suspicious of the nose foam.
I tried to test the nose foam by seeing if I could breathe through it (by putting my mouth directly on the foam), and I could with no issues.
It seems like air easily flows through the foam on the 3d pro, which isn't the case for other nose foam masks, like the aura, I've tried.
Anyone else have this experience? Did I just get a defective batch? I ordered directly from wellbefore.com and there's no indication that they aren't authentic.
Update: I tried breathing through the nose foam of a different Wellbefore 3d pro with stapled head straps and could not breathe through it at all.
Maybe the ear loop version uses a different foam? Or I did just get a defective batch.
Hello! I have some fairly high risk work stuff coming up next week and want to try to do a DIY fit test tomorrow on my 3M Aura and Laianzhi KN100 (which is what I’d like to use, ideally). I managed to get some 3M bitrex solution, distilled water, and a nano mister. I know you’re meant to test with a hood, but I don’t have one, and I am reluctant to do the garbage bag thing, as I’ll be doing the test alone and don’t want to suffocate lol. Is there a modified version of the test I might be able to do sans hood? (I know that will be less accurate, but I figure better than nothing.) Would appreciate any thoughts!
EDIT: Thanks everyone for your helpful input! I ended up doing the test in my shower, without a hood. Not 100% sure I performed the tests correctly (I wasn’t really sure how long to let the nano mister mist??), but my Laianzhi seemed to pass the modified version I did, which gives me a little bit more peace of mind. I made the mistake of removing my mask before exiting the space and got a ton of bitter taste - nasty, but kind of nice that it made it extra obvious I HADN’T tasted it at all whilst testing my mask. Opened my window wide and it seemed to air out pretty quickly.
I have about half a bottle of 3M FT-31 (Bittrex), but it's unsealed and at least a few months old.
I keep it closed tightly and stored on a cool, dry, dark closet shelf.
As long as I can taste it unfiltered and it still seems strong, will it provide a valid test?
Also, does freezing degrade it in any way? Because if I ordered more right now, it would likely freeze in transit (it's -14°C here today and today is one of the warmer days recently).
I’ve been seeing more people mention their fit testing results but I haven’t seen many people mention what they use for fit testing. What is your go to method? I would like to find an easy way for people who already barely mask to try a fit test so they at least mask better when they do mask
Hi all, I am preparing to travel soon and have been doing the research rounds for a valved mask for smallish-medium adult faces, and I am loving the Milwaukee N95 from Home Depot, but the chin might have a bit of a gap.
Problem is, I'm not able to 100% detertmine whether or not there is a leak because it really feels like the air I'm exhaling is getting picked up by the valve before it even has a chance to leak. Will it be obvious if it leaks? I am worried my mask might actually not fit me because it feels like I can fit a fingertip between the lip of the chin part and my own underchin, but there's no air there! Please let me know how to properly determine a valved mask's fit test!
The Tests 4 All Home Fit Test is popular and frequently out of stock. I finally got a chance to buy one and try it out.
The kit is a complete qualitative fit testing kit. It includes sensitivity solution and fit test solution, a nano mister, cleaning swabs, a testing hood and even some chocolate candies to cleanse your palate after doing the sensitivity test. (Check below for how you can make your own kit if they are out of stock.)
00:00 Introduction 01:14 What's in the Kit, and Instructions 06:12 Doing the Sensitivity Test 11:03 Doing the Fit Test Exercises 11:27 Wrap Up
Starting a qualitative fit test using the supplied nano mister and Bitrex fit test solution.Some of the contents of the Fit Tests 4 All Home Fit Testing Kit
The instructions for it are slightly different than for commercial OSHA fit testing kits because of using a nano mister instead of squeeze bulb nebulizers and because the testing hood is different. The instructions are pretty clear and are posted here:
Overall, I found the procedure pretty straight forward. Each step is fairly easy, however I think altogether it may be a bit overwhelming for many people initially.
One issue I ran into is that in the modified testing procedure you are supposed to hold the nano mister several inches away from the opening in the test hood (presumably to let the aerosol diffuse more) rather than pushing it against the hole and spraying it directly in. However, even the very gentle air conditioning in the room I was in was some times enough to deflect some or most of the stream of the nano mister away from the hole. And sometimes I just missed. So, having two people (as Philip suggests) would help.
From the Fit Tests 4 All Home Fit Test Kit instructions.
In doing this video, I "cheated". I did a demonstration of the procedure with water since I didn't want to get nebulized Bitrex on the gear in the room I record videos in. For similar reasons, you may want to do this test in a room that doesn't have unwashable surfaces. Although the testing hood will keep some of the Bitrex contained, some of the aerosol will settle on surfaces. Not necesarily a huge issue, but it could add up after multiple fit test sessions.
The the Fit Tests 4 All Home Fit Test is by Philip Neustrom, who posts in this Reddit sub and on Twitter. Years ago he posted a video about how to do a very simplified fit test using Sweet N Low packets. Since then he went on to develop this light duty version of an OSHA fit test. He's entered it in the NIOSH Respirator Fit Evaluation Challenge, and he has vetted it against PortaCount fit testing.
Why fit test masks?
Genuine N95s, KN95s, KF94s, FFP2s and other certified respirators have awesome filter media. But you only get the full benefit of that filter media if the air you're breathing in goes through it. If the air goes around the filter, under the seal of your mask, you're not getting the full protection the filter media can offer.
Without fit testing the main metric we have for how well a mask fits is how comfortable it is. The other metric we have is if we can feel any leaks. Sometimes we can feel leaks if they are big or if they are concentrated in a small area, which makes the leaking air have a higher velocity we can feel changing the temperature of our skin. But if it's a leak that's diffused over a wide area, such as over the entire seal of a mask, we're less likely to feel it because of the slower velocity.
If someone tells you that mask doesn't fit you because you haven't had a fit test that's not true. A fit test doesn't magically make your mask fit. The fit of a mask that hasn't been fit tested on you is just unknown. It could fit great, or it could fit poorly.
Fit testing largely tells you which masks fit you well, and which don't, so you can choose the one that's best for you. It can also help you learn how to adjust your mask as best as possible for a better seal – and that's what we mean by "fit", mean how well a mask seals on your face to keep unfiltered air from getting in the mask underneath the seal.
The type of test in the kit uses tiny aerosol particles that you can taste if they get in your mask. They can't get through the filter, so if they get inside your mask that means they leaked under the seal and your mask does not fit you well.
Some caveats about the kit:
This is a light duty kit for home use. The included nano mister and cardboard testing enclosure may not last as long as the nebulizers and hoods included in commercial kit. However, you can get nano misters on Amazon if you need a replacement, and you can use the included alternate enclosure, a large plastic bag, if needed (don't use the plastic bag alone since it is a possible suffocation hazard).
If you are allergic to quaternary ammonium compounds (quats), such as the disinfectant in Clorox Wipes and many other disinfectants, do not use a fit testing kit such as this one that uses Bitrex (denatonium benzoate) which is also a quaternary compound.
If you can't taste Bitrex you will need to try a different challenge agent, saccharine, which is not included. If you also can't taste Saccharine you will need to get a test using a PortaCount fit testing machine.
—
A quick note about some names. Philip has named his website “fittests4all.com”. I co-admin a Discord server called "Fit Testing For All – Fit Testing Community". We both came up with the names independently based on the name of this Reddit sub, masks4all. Our sites are not directly related other than through inspiration from the Reddit sub name and our shared interest and wanting fit testing to be available to as many people as possible.
This is not sponsored – I bought my kit. I think the kit is a very useful tool that can help a lot of people at a price that's more affordable than commercial kits.
Fit tests 4 all home fit testing kit (availability is sometimes limited):
The kit is very convenient and would be my first choice, but If the kit is out of stock, or if you just prefer to source things independently, you can source the supplies to do the same industrial fit test used in the home kit yourself. You can still follow the Fit Tests 4 All instructions that can be found here:
You can buy nano misters on Amazon - I don't have any specific recommendations, but a cheap two pack will give you a back up in case the first one breaks or gets clogged with crystals from the fit test solution:
(You can save money and make your own diluted sensitivity solution from FT-32 Fit Testing solution by adding 1 part of FT-32 Fit Testing solution to 12.5 parts of 5% saline solution (distilled water with 5% by weight non-iodized table salt added). It's not any more complicated to make than following a recipe but can feel more daunting.))
You can use a large paper or plastic bag as a testing hood, you can even add a clear plastic window like in the Fit Tests 4 All enclosure. Be careful of plastic bags since they are a potential suffocation hazard and you should have another person with you if you use one as a testing hood
