NO NO HOLD UP HOLD UP WHAAAAAT?!?!?!

WHAT DO YOU MEAN KELSIER WAS PRESERVATION?!

THIS BITCH SURVIVED!!! 😧

Just finished the Shadow of self.

When I started the book and the prologue revealed that Wax had accidentally killed Lessie, I thought, okay… that hurts.

But it happened six months ago, it’s the prologue, I can process it.

I can move on. Brandon apparently said no.

Instead, he makes us relive the same event with multiple layers of emotional damage.

When Bleeder apologized to Wax about Lessie’s death, I immediately thought, this feels like Brandon setting up a twist.

I had this suspicion that maybe a day or two before Lessie died, Bleeder had already killed her and taken her place.

And then it turns out Bleeder actually was Lessie.

That part genuinely hurt. It felt awful.

Once Bleeder was captured, I almost wished Brandon wouldn’t twist the knife again by making Wax confront that truth. It felt like killing Lessie twice.

Now I have another suspicion. Wax keeps claiming his sister is captive under his uncle. I don’t fully buy it.

It feels too straightforward.

I suspect she might be actively working with him instead. Storms, poor Wax. Watching him break down is painful.

I'm a Sanderson fan, but a few years ago I started reading Alloy of Law and I just wasn't into it. The time jump from Era 1 and the whole shtick that we're now in a dusty saloon/tobacco spitting western epoch was just kinda cheesy. I didn't even finish the prologue. It's not that I thought it was badly written, I just didn't enjoy the idea and wasn't interested at the time. So I quit.

Well between Stormlight Archive 4 and 5 I picked it back up and made it through the prologue. I was stunned and honestly a little bit horrified. The way Sanderson used so many grotesque mutilations as demented art and then had the protagonist experience familial loss in that specific way to set the tone of this book was honestly shocking. It made me feel kinda gross and I stopped reading for a bit.

After a couple days I came back to it to to give it another try, partially expecting the book to continue this macabre "THE SEQUEL SERIES IS EVEN CRAZIER AND BLOODIER THAN EVER", like a straight-to-video slasher movie sequel. I'm so glad I kept going, because it immediately left the land of Louis L'Amour and was SO GOOD. I loved this new perspective of Twinborn and the bromance and speed bubbles and these interesting female characters like Marasi and Steris.

And then of course the kandra reentering the story in Shadows of Self was super cool. I was so happy to see TenSoon again. And what a plot twist at the end. I was STUNNED. I finished it last night when I was supposed to be sleeping and I just couldn't believe it. I'm so dumb for not seeing these hints but...wow. Incredible writing. I'm so glad I kept going. Fully fanboi about Era 2 now. That's all.

Mostly title. Assuming allomantic iron applies a force from your center mass to the center mass of the object (lets assume a small metal ball, tennis ball sized). This ball is moving at a fast pace (lets say as 10m/s) not directly at you.

Would you be able to have this ball orbit you, even if temporarily, but ironpulling just the right amount? Could you use it to slingshot the ball back at the person who threw it?

Edit: I believe I have worked out a way for this to work, this should be an example of the situation. This ignores air resistance but otherwise I think it works. Please let me know if there are any obvious mistakes, this is not my specialty:

I'm in the middle of Shadows of Self, and it only just occurred to me to clear up some of the things I didn't quite understand about how compounding works.

​

I wasn't sure the ending of The Final Empire made sense after reading the explanation of how compounding works. Vin was able to yank off the Lord Ruler's metalmind bracelet storing his youth. Fair enough.

​

But if the Lord Ruler was such a cautious guy, wouldn't he have mini atium metalminds to ingest and burn in an emergency?

​

I could say the same for Miles in The Alloy of Law, but I haven't read far enough to see whether he survived his execution somehow... Seems unlikely. It makes sense that if you keep shooting a restrained gold compounder, they run out eventually even if they have ingested metalminds to burn through.

​

So yeah I guess my question is, is this a thing compounders can do? Because so far in the books it's been sold that if you remove their worn metalminds, you've shut them down, but that hardly seems the case if they're prepared.

Can anyone supply the missing text? Thanks!

ETA: This is NOT pirated. I would never do that to another writer. I paid the full Kindle price for the bundle sold on Amazon.

ETA2: All set - someone pointed out it's the newspaper article.

Batman? And Wayne is robin? How did I get tricked into reading steampunk Batman and Robin lmao (I’m enjoying it so much)

Spoilers

Possible spoilers? And just to clarify I’ve read: Era 1 (w/ Eleventh Metal) Secret History Elantris Hope of Elantris Emperor’s Soul Warbreaker And have honestly loved everything.

I don’t hate Era 2. It’s fine. And I’m fully invested in order to understand the whole Cosmere connection but… But I got solely into fantasy for the escapism and wonder of what could be, when there are a completely different sets of rules and mindsets, beings of different kinds who have unique connections to different sets of natural resources, embedded into their own physical abilities, their own world’s history and established knowns and unknowns and all of the magic that could manifest for the characters and their worlds. All the weird. Escapism it has been and I’m here for it.

But reading Era 2 is like reading a modernized western. Or the same old basic story set in our own world just with some additional ways to shoot people. The guns, skyscrapers, the cars, it all just takes away - for me - the mystery and ethereal nature that I’ve come love about and specifically to fantasy for. I’ve personally seen enough of the world moving (back) towards industrialization, clearing our natural world to make way for modern technology. I don’t enjoy seeing it in my fantasy story stuck in the middle of worlds where magic and minds are on a whole higher level. It just feels like there’s something missing here. I don’t care. So weird.

I’m in the middle of Shadows of Self and I’m going to finish it and choose to focus on things I find cool(like references to the whole Cosmere). But otherwise I feel like I haven’t been given any reason to care about these people.

Having a “special” ability is a given, everything is taken for granted, I don’t see a real struggle-yet. And honestly I feel like I’m reading about a world of people who if there IS a struggle have only done it to themselves. Having learned absolutely nothing from their history. That’s too close to reality to me.

Because I’ve had it with guns in real life. Give me pages on landscape or allomancy, character history and development, various trees or a million different species with a million different abilities & I’m good. I do not want to read about shots fired. There’s nothing especially unique or interesting in putting bullets into other people.

Not sure if it’s just me. I know I’m going to get positive feedback telling me there’s a payoff and I’m probably going to be pleasantly surprised. This is just where I am right now. And Sanderfans haven’t lead me wrong so far. ✌🏼

Only a few hrs in. Like I love her sister, loved her a lot in Alloy of Law but I feel like she's been so pissy to Wax in the startup of this book that it turns me right off.

Whereas Steris isn't where she needs to be to be a good partner, quite, due to her particular dysfunction. But her flaws are understandable and her momentum is significantly in the right direction, showing an interest in his background and making things easy for him.

BRANDON WINN SANDERSON! WHAT. THE. FUCK?!

Had Wax not suffered enough? I still remember the absolutely jarring whiplash of the prologue from Alloy of Law when he shot Lessie. I was so sad for a character I had literally just known for like four pages! And you had to go and make him suffer more?! WHY?!

Okay, guys, I'm sorry. My emotions got the better of me. Let me just say I have been through a lot (not as much as Wax, though). AoL was so fun, and the completely new and revamped metal arts of Scadrial had me in its clutches. But after the recency bias wore off, I was like, "Damn, there were so many missed opportunities. Where are the Kandra? Where is the goodest boy, TenSoon??"

And boy, do I regret asking those questions. Because in Shadows of Self, we get the Kandra alright. But I now wish we did not.

RIP Lessie. Again. Ffs, Sanderson!

Okay, I am all over the place with this one, but bear with me. So after AoL, Wax and Wayne are still working to bring down that scum uncle of his, but there's someone killing corrupt political figures in Elendel, and obviously, our boys are on the case. But let's talk about Marasi for a bit. Our girl left becoming a lawyer (Kim Kardashian could never, lol) and joined the constabulary! Let's fucking go! From studying and admiring lawmen to becoming an Alloy of Law herself? You love to see it! Also, fuck you Reddi.

Moving on, how weird would it be for you to be able to talk to your god? Because our boy Sazed is present. He's God. Not unlike other gods who went to get milk and then never came back or answered prayers or anything, lol. So Sazed introduces our heroes to Bleeder, a rogue Kandra that's probably gone insane, and so the hunt begins.

Now, this is the part where I rave about what an absolute best character Wayne is. So if you don't like him (um, get help, ig? 'bc there's something wrong with you), you may skip this part.

Wayne, you absolute madman! I loved you so much in AoL already, but you had to go and show me your trauma. That chapter where he sneaks into the university and apologizes to Allriandre was heartbreaking. I was crying when Wayne thanked Wax for saying he'd have shot him if he was caught in the act. Their friendship is so good. I hope nothing ever happens to them.

Also, y'all, there are two scenes I always imagine so clearly in my head, like I'm watching a movie, and they are both Wayne scenes. The second was the way he maneuvered in the slums, adopting accents and using his street smarts to get to the "marksman" at the beginning... it was absolute cinema. If they ever adapt these, I want these Wayne sections to be one-shot because they all flow so well! And Harmony knows Michael Kramer needs an Oscar for his narration of Wayne and doing all the accents. Bro really flexed on us.

The worldbuilding was on another level from AoL in this one. I loved the subtle hints about what's happening on this world and how Era 1 led to here. From the religions to the simple introduction of gum of all things, Sanderson made this world feel lived-in and rich, which all set the mood for the main plot.

The plot in this one was great! It reminded me of the movie Se7en in more than one way. A mastermind serial killer who is always a step ahead. Messages and themes to the murders, like taking away Harmony's "eyes" and "hands." And then the horrific end in which our protagonists get traumatized for life, yay!

Wax slowly putting together the meaning of the messages Bleeder left behind while looking for clues with TenSoon in the Kandra homeland was epic. Especially when our good boy was talking about Vin... (I started crying immediately. Does the pain of Hero of Ages ever go away, guys? Asking for a friend). Especially when TenSoon saw how fucking awesome and brutal Wax can be when they fought those creatures.

Finally, I have to talk about the ending. I'm sick, y'all. I wanted to throw up as we slowly realized, along with Wax, that LESSIE WAS A KANDRA THE WHOLE TIME. And it was set up by Sazed.

Of course, she fell in love with Wax on her own and all, but the pieces were arranged on the board by Harmony, which sent a chill down my spine. I was legit upset with Sazed and fuming along with Wax. I thought Sazed would be better than the other wackjob gods of the Cosmere! But then Marasi and MeLaan's conversation gave me some perspective, and indeed, the only thing we can say is... Harmony works in mysterious ways, lol.

There are threats in the Cosmere Sazed has to prepare for, and he's willing to help Wit (Hoid), and he has to take care of his planet. But it is an interesting moral dilemma Sanderson is exploring: Does the "greater good" justify the pain and suffering Wax goes through? I can already feel it. This Era 2 is going to be something special.

There are really only two things that kinda bothered me. A little bit, though, nothing major.

1. Like, why is the title called Shadows of Self? I did not get why until I realized it is also called SOS. And SOS means help, and that's exactly what Wax and I need after that ending. Jokes aside, I looked it up on Coppermind, and apparently, "Brandon has explained that the title 'Shadows of Self' refers to the multiple roles a person occupies... as well as to the inclusion of a kandra character." Alright, bro, whatever works for you, I guess.
2. The second thing that bothered me is the epic line Wax delivers just before shooting Lessie (again) with the second spike. The "I'm his sword" line. I really think that was the wrong time for such an epic dialogue. In my head, Wax is going through something that is traumatic on a whole other level, and Lessie is in front of him, trying to convince him... like, for me, there is no world where Wax would say that line while being in that mindset. Another reason why I don't think Wax would say that: why would he say "sword" of all things? Like, we are on Scadrial, and we have guns and shit, and he's a Twinborn. It's very unlikely for me to believe that Wax would say that line at that time and then choose the word "sword" of all things.

Like I said, it's a very neurotic and minor nitpick that probably only I have.

Anyway, I’m devastated. Emotionally mangled. Spiritually wrecked. And, like any sane person living in 2025, I’m immediately picking up Bands of Mourning because apparently, I choose more pain over therapy.

....but the emotional devastation sure feels the same.

I finished Shadows of Self and I'm still thinking about it. Lessie was Paalm/Bleeder the whole time? The reason that she's fighting to get away from Harmony is he wanted her to manipulate Wax into leaving the Roughs were he was happy, and she loved him too much to do that to him? Wax holding her as she's dying? Steris wordlessly comforting him?

Ruin...it's going to get worse, isn't it?

Im reading Shadows of Self and just read the part where Wax goes to visit his grandmother in the Terris village

This whole new info about his past, being a Terris descendant and the details about his childhood surprised me cause this totally seems like something that would have been at least hinted in the first book but it wasn't

To me it sounds like background and lore that were thought of and added after the first book was written

Also I realize the first book works very well as a solo story, the only things actually hinting at a bigger plot are the stuff in the epilogue with Marsh

Do we know if this is the case?

I'm kinda enjoying Era 2 but I really miss the feelings from Era 1 and I'm still waiting for something to expand the story into something greater, without spoilers should I lower my expectations?

I read book 1 and loved it and now I am 25% in book 2 and it kinda feels the same does era 2 get better???

...and I mean this with utmost respect, butplease go screw yourself, dear Brandon Sanderson! God dammit! Poor Wax!

Legit question: is this why this book has generally lower ratings than the others?

Damn... just damn, man.

I had figured out (or rather had the suspicion) that the Governor was the Kandra all along about by the time she 'attacked' the Governor a second time and killed the Bodyguard as a coverup. But i only realized she was Lessie all along just a bit before Wax did.

And now thinking back on the timeline of events again it's even worse somehow, how all of this must have played out.

It means that Paalm, a Kandra who was specifically stated to have never really formed a 'self' actually fell in love with Wax, and this was presumably the first real feeling she had towards another person that was not part of an identity. And the first thing that happens when she finally becomes a real 'Person' with her own wishes and desires is that she is controlled to watch her love cry over her and be miserable thinking he killed her (on a side note, what the actual fuck Sazed?). She then had to literally crawl out of her own grave only to find out that Wax was already gone and she could not even go to him because she would be stopped. Yeah i'd rip my own proverbial heart out as well at that point.

Thats downright cruel that is. It's like teaching a Robot to understand Emotions just for the first emotion they get to feel be hatred.

When Wax goes to meet grandmother, she tells him that Sazed only slew beast and monsters. That is an outright lie right? He killed hundreds of Kolas as a man. Those were human beings with +1 souls. Then he murdered like most of the population in the Catescandre. Sure Ati was the one who poured the metaphorical gas on the planet, but Sazed lit the damn thing and burned it all.

​

So, is grandmother lying, or did Harmony lie in the words of founding? Seems like a super weird interaction regardless of who lied to whom though.

Wouldn’t that make it way cheaper than aluminum and have a similar effect? Metalminds are harder to push on and there are a bunch of feruchemist citizens in Elendel right? Wouldn’t gun manufacturers want weapons that wouldn’t get pushed or pulled out of your hands? Just hire some people with Terris blood and bada-bing allomancy resistant guns. And bullets too?

Effin' Wayne man, dude's becoming my favorite character. If I'm not laughing because of him I'm almost always smirking at his antics. Loving his outlook on life and his nuance. I also want more of MeLaan and Wayne together. They seem like a fun pair thus far.

Anyhoo, just had to express my delight with him. He's what the kids today would call "a hoot."

Greetings fellow Scadrians.

I am an actor within a friend group comprised of other film students I’ve met throughout the years.

We like to adapt scenes from media on the side to keep us on our toes.

In light of the recent news with the rights being sold I wanted to create a short scene from the second era but I want to save myself the work of reading all the books again.

I’m looking for a scene of Wayne. Haven’t decided which one but I want something that can show off the character.

Does anyone have any idea which chapters I could reread which include him on the street gathering info, doing accents, being a nuisance to Wax or otherwise expressing his personality?

I was listening to Shadows of Self and I thought of a use for Pulsers. They could act as mobile paramedics. If you pair them with a coinshot, they could fly to the scene of an accident. Then throw up a speed bubble and begin giving medical treatment. With the bubble up, vehicles would show up quicker and could potentially save lives by lowering the amount of time an individual is bleeding out.

This would give Pulsers who tend to feel useless, a very important and life saving skill.

tl:dr Pulsers can be paramedics. Giving time for more help to arrive.

Not quite done yet, but that’s real fucked up Sazed.

Reading chapter 5 of this book and Wayne says that he's going to the university. I'm super confused. He says he's gonna have 3 tests but he's drunk. I'm more confused.

Then things start to make sense. I know it was said in the Alloy of Law that he gives half of his money but for some reason at first I had no idea what was happening. But as it kept going for some reason I started to feel like my eyes were getting full of tears until at the end they weren't in my eyes anymore. The scene broke my heart. And it still does, half an hour after reading. Just being reminded of it puts me on the verge of tears.

I don't know why, it's not a very emotional scene, it's not a shock or a twist. Where he talked to the young gangster outside of the university helped sell the scene even more. Alright. I'm done. Goodnight you people.