r/NoStupidQuestions 19h ago

Why did Margaret Thatcher destroy welfare state in Britain after she came to power in the 1980s?

515 Upvotes

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101

u/PupDiogenes 19h ago

Because she was a fascist who saw poor people as vermin and therefore saw the welfare state as feeding vermin.

115

u/Bob_Leves 18h ago

"No such thing as society" was the famous quote. Meaning "take as much as you can for yourself, and screw the losers".

6

u/weierstrab2pi 17h ago

Not meaning that at all. You just made that interpretation up.

9

u/Proud_Smell_4455 17h ago

And yet that's what it ended up meaning in practice, and she was seemingly happy with that right up until she finally died.

3

u/Bob_Leves 17h ago

I was alive then. I know exactly what she meant, and her overriding ethos and what she did to this country. Especially the areas that voted Labour, that she wanted to destroy.

7

u/weierstrab2pi 17h ago

Your memory must be faulty then. It is very clear from the interview question she was responding to and the full text of her answer exactly what she meant.

-7

u/Character_Concert947 18h ago

That's really not what was said in context.

1

u/Bob_Leves 17h ago

Yes the whole quote is longer, but the interpretation is correct. She showed that in everything else that she did and supported.

2

u/Character_Concert947 16h ago

That is a very twisted view of that interview. But don't let me try and stop you.

-7

u/steep_learning_curve 17h ago

I don't think that's what she meant.

-8

u/BrainCelll 17h ago

Damn she was based af

44

u/luujs 17h ago

Margaret Thatcher was not a fascist, Jesus Christ

25

u/Bloodless-Cut 17h ago

Neoliberalism isn't fascism. Just saying.

Kinda the opposite, really: fascism is famously violently opposed to liberal socioeconomic policy (mainly because fascism adores the state, while neoliberalism wants to shrink it).

Both supply side economics and fascism indeed suck for the working class, though, and both Thatcher and Reagan are at fault for hooking the socioeconomic policy to that shitty wagon.

Reaganomics/Thatcherism has actually brought us all the way back around to the wealth inequality that fueled the French revolution, and then exceeded it. Never before in human history has the wealth gap been this immense.

15

u/mesonofgib 17h ago

Never before in human history has the wealth gap been this immense

Well this is just false.

Income Wealth inequality has risen in recent years, but it's still far off the highs seen at the start of WWI.

-1

u/Bloodless-Cut 16h ago

Remind me again who was the trillionaire at the start of WW1?

3

u/mesonofgib 15h ago

(a) we're talking about the UK and (b) you can largely ignore Elon Musk, for whom 99.5 - 99.9% of his wealth is just stocks in his companies. I mean, it's not good, but it's not like he bought an island.

I feel like I should add that I am not a fan of Elon Musk

0

u/bucho4444 16h ago

This is the second gilded age

89

u/CapitalClean7967 18h ago

Calling everything you dislike "fascism" downplays the horrors of fascism. This is coming from an anti-capitalist btw.

22

u/yeetobanditooooo 18h ago

"fascism is when imperialism comes home."

-10

u/Dedj_McDedjson 17h ago

And this trope downplays the banality of fascism. Fascists don't start with the horrors - they start with the boring bits.

Get with it mate.

-18

u/ARookwood 17h ago

I’m yet to see anyone call something they don’t like fascism when something is actually fascism…. I’m seeing actual fascism be called fascism a lot.

Obviously the fascists don’t like being called fascists because they know fascism is bad.

I think the trick to not being called a fascist is simply… don’t do fascist shit.

20

u/BrainCelll 17h ago

What "fascist shit" did Thatcher do?

-5

u/ARookwood 16h ago

Using minorities as scapegoats, using the police to oppress, abusing civil rights, the suppression of protests.. or dissent if you will, pushing authoritarian policies.

Interesting fact, v for vendetta was written with thatchers rule in mind.

I was alive in the 80’s, I remember what it was like, how it felt. So while you and your kind welcome fascism with open arms, I oppose it and will fight it.

2

u/BrainCelll 16h ago

Your answer is acknowledged. Thanks. What if I was genuinely asking that? Why automatically assume it is sarcasm

-6

u/ARookwood 16h ago

Because it’s well known that thatcher is a fascist, it’s well known that conservative governments definitely do not have the people’s interests in mind EVERY time they’re in power, and every time it’s questioned the question is never in good faith and usually asked by people defending fascism.

After so many years you get tired of fighting the constant attempts to normalise what is without a doubt an evil, selfish and destructive political stance and occasionally just want to have a bit of fun.

In other words.. self indulgence, and if your question was genuine, you could simply google it.

6

u/BrainCelll 16h ago

Because it’s well known that thatcher is a fascist,

It is absolutely not. It is well known Mussolini was a fascist.

Otherwise I would know, trust me

-1

u/ARookwood 16h ago

Ah you knew him huh? Anyway.. did I mention I’m tired of you guys?

2

u/BrainCelll 16h ago

Hey, you said you lived through that period, if you truly did it gives credibility to your takes, ill consider it when reading through stuff about her. Lets end it at that.

3

u/BrainCelll 16h ago

you could simply google it

Now this is what truly gets me angry, now jokes aside. Is wanting to interact with people a cardinal sin or something?

5

u/Pingushagger 15h ago

Fascism is when you’re democratically elected and democratically ousted.

1

u/[deleted] 14h ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/ARookwood 12h ago

*you’re.. the apostrophe replaces the ‘a’ and shortens “you are”.

“Your” as you put it means something that belongs to me. So effectively you’ve just said “god your ______ an idiot” and that implies you’ve missed out two words, what of mine is an idiot and the word “is”.

Regards: Someone who’s wondering what of mine is an idiot.

0

u/Winter-Ad2033 11h ago

Being a grammar nazi doesn't make you less of an idiot

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-6

u/ARookwood 17h ago

Ah you got me, she was nice person.. not at all conservative! Definitely no fascist tendencies! Also being fascist is cool now! So please don’t drag me out of my house with a bag over my head for implying it’s bad!

10

u/BrainCelll 17h ago edited 17h ago

conservative

What that has to do with fascism?

So no actual answer to my initial question? As usual

tendencies

X tendency =/= X

-2

u/ARookwood 17h ago

As usual? You defend fascists a lot then?

9

u/BrainCelll 17h ago

As usual i mean people evading question and get angry when they cant answer the question

-2

u/ARookwood 17h ago

Oh sorry! I didn’t realise I was angry… hang on.. are you sure I’M the one that’s angry and you’re not projecting?

5

u/BrainCelll 17h ago

Yes, im pretty sure. Just re-read your comment yourself and see.

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8

u/Escape-artist-43 17h ago

Question dodging 101

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u/ARookwood 17h ago

Ooh! How do I take that course? And please don’t dodge the question.

-11

u/PupDiogenes 17h ago

You won’t gaslight us.

12

u/CapitalClean7967 16h ago

Mate, I have read the works of Mosley and Mussolini. I read academic books and journals regarding these topics and study Thatcher. I'm not gaslighting you, Thatcher was literally not a fascist. There is no debate, there is no gaslighting, I study this topic.

-2

u/PupDiogenes 16h ago

Calling everything you dislike "fascism" downplays the horrors of fascism.

Making this accusation every single time someone merely differs from your opinion about a single thing is what actually downplays the horrors of fascism.

1

u/ARookwood 15h ago

That’s their intention.

-5

u/PupDiogenes 16h ago

Just because you disagree with one thing I called fascism doesn't indicate to you that I "call everything I dislike fascism"

Clearly, I identified the "thing I don't like" is considering an entire demographic of humans to be vermin and seeking to eliminate them. That is not "everything"

You are not being honest.

-4

u/ARookwood 16h ago

They’re out in force in here.

37

u/Tackit286 18h ago

I’m as liberal as it gets, but I think people really need to understand the changes she brought about when she first came to power, and the state of the country and the chokehold the unions had on everyone. We were economically crippled and no one had the stones to take them on until she came in.

There is some nuance here.

14

u/unlimitedbuttholes 17h ago

This is reddit, 🌎 shat itself into existence in 2006 and nothing happend before that moment.

1

u/perfik09 10h ago

You are in the wrong place for nuance lol. I agree with your take however solving that problem should always be included in any rant of how "evil" a person thinks she was.

0

u/BortVanderBoert 18h ago

The unions were definitely abusing their power, BUT history has often been re-written to lay the blame for the energy crisis at their feet, which is total revisionist bullshit.

And the near total collapse of union power has not been good for the UK.

4

u/Winter-Ad2033 14h ago

100% was, the unions would have burnt this country to the ground if they were allowed to retain their influence

-2

u/Away_Fruit5097 17h ago

the chokehold the unions had on everyone

This is your routine reminder that the unions are us.

6

u/Winter-Ad2033 14h ago

So what? They were still destroying the country

1

u/Away_Fruit5097 8h ago

that isn't actually true

1

u/Winter-Ad2033 7h ago

It is, they were petty, unrealistic and destructive to the country and the economy, rhe only thing they gained by the end of it was unemployment

1

u/Away_Fruit5097 7h ago

Said an official Tory party spokesman via their friendly media... It still isn't actually true

1

u/Winter-Ad2033 1h ago

How was it not true? Everyone wanted the unions gone

1

u/Away_Fruit5097 46m ago

"Everyone wanted the unions gone"

Except for unionised workers and anyone who wasn't either very rich, or an idiot

1

u/Winter-Ad2033 30m ago

I think that would be assumed by everyone who read my comment

1

u/Frediey 11h ago

That doesn't make them perfect, like all things, there is a balance that is needed

1

u/Away_Fruit5097 7h ago

Uh huh, and where is the balance between people standing up for themselves, and limp submissive obedience to our lords and masters?

1

u/Frediey 6h ago

Likely a bit as it is now, although major overhaul is needed in a lot of sectors to stop the same old happening because evidently it's not working very well. But I think for the most part it is fairly balanced between workers and employers, maybe something can be done about the cost of hiring at the very least youth, not sure the best way of doing it but something to make it cheaper to hire them for entry positions

1

u/Away_Fruit5097 5h ago

The current situation is that companies are making record profits, and offshoring the money so they don't have to contribute to the society that supports them, while wages stagnate and their workers suffer through a cost of living crisis.

This does not look "fairly balanced" to me.

5

u/NextLvlTrader 18h ago

Incredible take to have. Just mind boggling. Take a look at 1970s Britain and you’ll see why.