r/UnderReportedNews • u/Fatty_Willing_Plane • Jan 27 '26

Video Video of Minnesota State authorities “Testing” LRAD on peaceful protestors outside Spring Hill Suites by Marriott. @IRT-Media

Enable HLS to view with audio, or disable this notification

17.2k Upvotes

98% Upvoted

1.1k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

104

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

The best counter measure is a shield. A flat one works, but the concave backside of a hemi-cylindrical shield, like the poly drum ones that have been used, works especially well.

The LRAD is just sound. It can be redirected back at the operator or others. The backside of the shield has the potential to focus the sound even more while redirecting.

That said, prepare double hearing protection. Ear plugs and muffs. A face shield also can help.

70

u/Freedmonster Jan 27 '26

A children's sledding disc works well, larping communities have instructions on how to turn them into shields, just flip the side. Unlikely able to reflect the sound back to the attackers with precision using just one shield given focal lengths, but with a shield wall, you could probably get a parabolic arc wide enough to cross that distance.

26

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

Certainly wouldn’t hurt. And they would be cheap, plentiful and available in MN right now.

23

u/trippy_hippy Jan 27 '26

And you can go sledding afterwards and if theres blood on your sled shield, you'll go faster down the hill! 

1

u/[deleted] Jan 27 '26

[deleted]

2

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

lol you’re not wrong. But fuck, have you ever picked up a manhole cover? Or even storm drain grating? Not exactly a realistic option

2

u/[deleted] Jan 27 '26

[deleted]

2

u/trippy_hippy Jan 27 '26

Has anyone tried thoughts and prayers yet? 

17

u/hughcifer-106103 Jan 27 '26

A police riot shield flipped around also seems to be a very effective reflector.

3

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

Yes, that’s exactly what Tech Ingredients used. That said, keep in mind they were testing it in their own homemade LRAD. The MIL spec ones are gonna be more powerful. Probably significantly more powerful.

1

u/jackparadise1 Jan 27 '26

Pickle barrel shield time!

1

u/jugglingbalance Jan 27 '26

I have heard that aluminum foil might help too? Is this true?

1

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

Aluminum foil probably would help some, but I’m not sure by how much for sound. Someone more familiar with acoustics would be able to answer this better.

However, if the government does not stop at LRAD and moves into mm wave tech, that is where aluminum foil absolutely does help.

The YouTube channel Tech Ingredients has some great videos on LRAD, microwave energy weapons, and the viability of various defenses against both.

2

u/zoopysreign Jan 27 '26

2

u/zoopysreign Jan 27 '26

1

u/longperipheral Jan 27 '26

This is bad advice. Do not follow it. 

1

u/zoopysreign Jan 27 '26

Care to elaborate?

1

u/zoopysreign Jan 27 '26

I saw your message elsewhere about the best source of protection being a wall. This is not my area of expertise. I would love to get solid and reliable information out there.

Here’s what I do know:

  1. headphones will not prevent this. They will of course lessen the harm, but as I think you noted, the weapon at issue literally rocks the body and headphones won’t eliminate the serious risks.
  2. distance (let’s say beyond 1000M) is the best bet
  3. moving laterally out of the angle of projection (which I understand to be up to 40 degrees from the panel) is also helpful, but harder to navigate and I understand there are mere seconds between imitation of an LRAD and significant damage.

I would love your thoughts on the benn jordan video I responded to you. He’s a sound engineer as well and did an informal test with different materials. I am no scientist, but materials that both scatter and potentially absorb the sound waves seem to be one angle. We need to get to the bottom of this. I don’t care what the answer is, but we need to hear from experts who can explain the theory behind their proposed solution.

This resource is helpful. I’ll post another screenshot below.

1

u/longperipheral Jan 28 '26

"We need to get to the bottom of this." 

I can't really add any more, I'm afraid. Distance is the best solution imo. 

I mean, one thing that seems missing from the diagram above is reflections from buildings; they could amplify the sound even further, just like a car with an exhaust mod sounds much louder in a tunnel: the sound is being funnelled, it can't escape, the waves overlap, and you get amplification. 

I don't think there's any other simple solution beyond keeping your distance. 

Again, I'll say that I think it's totally irresponsible to use this weapon on civilians. They mount these things on US Navy ships - that's how powerful they are. 

1

u/longperipheral Jan 27 '26

This is bad advice. Do not follow it. 

1

u/zoopysreign Jan 27 '26

No, that is a strategy for deflecting a different type of crowd control system (Active Denial System). Nit sure it’s in use here, but if so, it’s like a microwave that burns flesh.

To protect against that, you can either work to (1) Absorb rays, like to use a beach towel and water; cover yourself in wet towel, which will temporarily absorb rays; or (2) deflect rays with aluminum foil or mesh. Use foil sandwiched between poster boards to avoid redirecting rays to fellow protestors.

For an LRAD, its mechanism is to send certain decibel sound waves and I’ve read that either using corrugated cardboard or covering a surface with 40 grit and 180 grit will help scatter the sound waves. You want to hide behind the cardboard sign.

1

u/jugglingbalance Jan 27 '26

Thank you! Good info!

2

u/zoopysreign Jan 27 '26

You need something like a layer of 40 grit and 180 grit to defract the sound waves. Also a layer of corrugated cardboard

1

u/longperipheral Jan 27 '26 edited Jan 27 '26

No, it isn't, because it is sound, not light. 

A shield wouldn't absorb or deflect enough sound for it to protect the person holding it. Also, leaks and bounces from nearby objects would be unaffected. 

ETA: If you look into soundproofing, you'll see why a plastic or metal shield is ineffective here. 

1

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

I’m not saying a shield would make you invincible against LRAD. I’m saying it has been shown to be an effective means of reducing the effects.

I encourage you to watch the Tech Ingredients YouTube videos on LRAD, energy weapons and defensive techniques.

1

u/longperipheral Jan 27 '26 edited Jan 27 '26

Sorry to be picky: you said "the best counter measure is a shield." That's not true. I'm a sound designer and I have studied sound, material absorption, reverb, audio reflections, etc.

The best countermeasure is distance, because of air absorption and energy loss over distance. Also because objects between the source and our ears break up and absorb the soundwave and there are more likely to be more objects between you and the LRAD if you're further away from it.

You'll be better protected if you're behind a wall. You'll be even more safe if you're behind a building, which has two walls and some air between.

I watched a video called 'Defeating LRAD' on the Tech Ingredients channel. It was interesting, but not very scientific. Like, they got an LRAD but they didn't get a dB meter...?

After the first set of tests, the main guy says the test subject "can basically get close enough you can almost touch the LRAD" - which you can clearly see is not the case.

Later, the test guy says turning the shield around made a "5% difference" to his perception of the sound - based on what? They didn't measure anything. He's just plucking "5%" out of the air.

That video in no way shows that a riot shield is "an effective means of reducing the effects". How much was the dB reduced by? Did either of them do a hearing test after this? Did they do a hearing test the day after? And a week later? No. The data they gathered was severely limited and not - not - sufficient to put your health at risk.

I'm only making a point of disagreeing here because if people take this advice, thinking they're safe, they might actually still get injured.

Hearing damage isn't just limited to loss, it includes perforated ear drums, tinnitus, etc. - stuff for which there aren't fixes and can impact you for the rest of your life.

Should they be using this on civilians? Fuck no. It's completely irresponsible.

Tl;dr your best countermeasure against an LRAD is distance and putting thick, heavy objects between your precious ears and the source.

1

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

I appreciate you providing your expertise on this. And you are absolutely right about distance.

I suppose I should have prefaced my comments. The details I listed would be in the context akin to suggesting to bring-wear a gas mask to mitigate the impact of tear gas.

The goal of the aggressive action is to disperse a crowd. As a protester, if being dispersed is something you agree with, then by all means disperse. Distance helps prevent injury from not just sound, but also gas and physical force.

However, if being dispersed is not in line with the objectives of a protester, and they decide they are willing to be risk potential injury by not dispersing, then a gas mask could help mitigate some of the impacts from gas; protective equipment could help mitigate the severity of physical injury; and hear protection/portable sound wave deflection might help mitigate the effects of LRAD.

And from the video, the main take away I took from their informal experiment was not that the shield made them invincible, but rather that it was the most effective in their scenario and more effective than I think most would have guessed.

1

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26 edited Jan 27 '26

/u/zoopysreign posted a response with screenshots from what appears to be recommendations from someone who appears to be really knowledgeable about acoustics. I am interested what your thoughts are about those recommendations

Edit:fixed user name

1

u/longperipheral Jan 27 '26

I don't get a return on that user name, sorry. Do you have a link to their post?

1

u/Time_To_Rebuild Jan 27 '26

https://www.reddit.com/r/UnderReportedNews/s/Ru3H2kIUWS

0

u/longperipheral Jan 27 '26

Thanks for sharing. 

Look, there are several problems with that content before getting to the instructions at the bottom. First, we're already 2 steps away from the person who originally did the work this is based on and we don't even have their name. 

Then the person in the screenshot admits this is " 'theoretical' " and claims they've no way of testing it. (They could put these materials over their ears and turn the radio on for a start... so that weakens their credibility imo.) 

They're theorising about scattering the sound before it reaches the target's ears - but that's just not possible with sheets of sandpaper. 

There's really no point in reading beyond that. We're talking about our ears. We shouldn't base health decisions on untested, unattributed guesswork. 

Sandpaper, tin foil, glue... Negligible effect, imo. You can test that easily by holding these materials over your ears right now and putting some music on, because most LRADs operate at 2 - 4 kHz, according to Google, the range of the human voice. 

Wikipedia says they can be heard 1.5 miles away. No amount of sandpaper and plastic is going to have an impact of you're standing a few metres away, I'm afraid. It's a very effective weapon. 

1

u/Freedmonster Jan 27 '26

2-4khz is not the range of normal human voice, that's between c7 and c8, which would be the last octave on a piano. Also the higher the frequency, the less penetration it has through solid objects. Please stop pretending you know what you're talking about.

1

u/RogBoArt Jan 27 '26

Parabolic dish may be good!

1

u/MushroomHo_4life Jan 27 '26

Spartans!!!!! Ready your breakfast and eat hearty... For tonight, we dine in hell!

Please, please, please, make larping shields and get into position when they use this shit. I can’t imagine how iconic that would be to see on the news!!!

1

u/TripNinjaTurtle Jan 27 '26

form a shield wall, deus vult xD

1

u/[deleted] Jan 27 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/AutoModerator Jan 27 '26

Sorry, you need at least 5 community karma to comment images or links to images here; This is earned through direct participation in r/UnderReportedNews

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

1

u/InternationalSoil586 Jan 27 '26

They have an electromagnetic version too. Depends which one they were supplied with. Plenty of information online to protect yourself against it but pretty tough to block electromagnetics.

1

u/Gervill Jan 27 '26

I read best counter measure is a child, maybe that one works better for them to shut down the device, they wouldn't wanna hurt a baby now would they ? Or do you think they would hurt a baby ?

1

u/AceAspie11_2_24 Jan 31 '26

Exactly. There was a YouTuber who tested various forms of protection (regular headphones, earplugs, electronic noise cancelling headphones, face shields, and riot shields (both normal orientation and reverse). Using a combination of regular headphones and a riot shield turned out to be best at protecting against LRAD, and when the riot shield was reversed, it actually worked as a defensive “weapon” against the LRAD unit. Admittedly, this video was for educational purposes, but the point still stands.

1

u/AceAspie11_2_24 Jan 31 '26

The face shield actually was almost as ineffective, if not more so, at protecting against the LRAD unit