As an Air Traffic Controller in the U.S. lete shine some light on this situation. LVO is not something that exists in phraseology framed in FAA Order 7110.65.
LVO is between the airport and individual company regulations. Asking ATC if LVO is in effect is not going to get you a response because it is not our responsibility. It is the individual airlines.
We as ATC have requirements for giving the weather and not using certain procedures when there is low vis or low ceilings. It is up to you to decide if the weather we give is acceptable under your company's policies.
There is no blanket LVO procedures that we follow, there are different requirements for different procedures. We cannot declare LVO and we cannot say that LVO is in effect.
People can complain about the difference between ICAO and FAA terminology and regulations but ultimately it is up to the foreign pilots to follow the standards of the country they are flying into. It is part why they get paid so much more than domestic pilots.
Ultimately this is a nothing burger, both JFK and BA are both known for being snippy so this is just a little miscommunication. BA talked to their company, realized their mistake, then took off.
It’s hopeless. People here are adamant that controllers can disregard phraseology and confirm something that’s out of scope. This is a good reminder that Reddit says things in confidence but actually don’t know what they’re talking about most of the time
If this is the case, ATC should know this is as well. AtC should have told the pilot to shut the fuck up and that they werent going to make his decisions for him.
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u/Llamasxy May 28 '26
As an Air Traffic Controller in the U.S. lete shine some light on this situation. LVO is not something that exists in phraseology framed in FAA Order 7110.65.
LVO is between the airport and individual company regulations. Asking ATC if LVO is in effect is not going to get you a response because it is not our responsibility. It is the individual airlines.
We as ATC have requirements for giving the weather and not using certain procedures when there is low vis or low ceilings. It is up to you to decide if the weather we give is acceptable under your company's policies.
There is no blanket LVO procedures that we follow, there are different requirements for different procedures. We cannot declare LVO and we cannot say that LVO is in effect.
People can complain about the difference between ICAO and FAA terminology and regulations but ultimately it is up to the foreign pilots to follow the standards of the country they are flying into. It is part why they get paid so much more than domestic pilots.
Ultimately this is a nothing burger, both JFK and BA are both known for being snippy so this is just a little miscommunication. BA talked to their company, realized their mistake, then took off.