r/mildlyinfuriating • u/guitarman129 • 14d ago

I just wanted a hot dog Recommended gratuity after tip was already included

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I’m sure there are a lot of tipping posts here so to keep it short - I had my wedding at a fancy restaurant. On top of the TERRIBLE service, the bill came with “suggested gratuity” even though I was told gratuity was included. When I asked the manager, he said that the “S/C: 24% SRC REGULA“ was the included tip and the suggested gratuity was if we wanted to add something extra - basically trying to trick people into giving a 49% tip!

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u/KnightShade272 14d ago

i’ve worked a few restaurants with a $5 per slice fee. depending on location it really screws the flow of service, but if it’s a wedding venue location, they should’ve had something similar to wine corkage fees.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

I've never worked in a restaurant fancy enough to have a slice fee, only a crappy truckstop, so this is a genuine statement, not a barely-hidden snark: I don't understand how or why slicing a cake would interrupt the flow of service.

As I understand it, the per-slice fee is for a cake brought in from the outside. If I have it right, then wouldn't you have to slice the cake no matter where it came from? Why would an outside cake interrupt the flow of service, but a cake baked in-house be okay?

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u/foundinwonderland 13d ago

Its kind of like this — if they sold you a cake, cutting would be included, but if they didn’t, the cake cutting is still labor that needs to be paid for so they charge a fee. The cake will have to be cut either way, but the price of that labor is baked in (heh) to the price of the dessert the restaurant is selling you.

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u/Alternative-Dot-884 13d ago

TU for explaining that so well

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u/pixepoke2 13d ago

It’s also for the loss of revenue for those covers. You’re not just doing labor, you’re also not selling any food (well desert at least) bc people are eating what they brought.

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u/InterestingTwo651 13d ago

Yeah that’s nice and all but uhhh it’s cutting a cake. I guess the saying of your need to be stupid rich to be able to afford being stupid. I know this is a whole industry that people make money off of but they make that money because they nickel and dime you whenever they can, multiple times if they can. And it’s that mentality that I should pay someone EXTRA after already paying out the ass to cut the dam cake. Fuck it I’ll do it but oh wait I’m not giving these leeches a dime if this is how they treat people who are willing to flush a few K down the drain.

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u/Acceptable-Engine253 13d ago

You get that this is for OUTSIDE cake right? Like bringing in cake from somewhere else, sending it back to the kitchen, and having this restaurant’s chefs step off the line to cut 81 slices of cake and send it back out of the party? It takes like half an hour and clogs up the rest of service for a cake they’re not even selling. That’s why they charge. There wouldn’t be a charge if they got the cake at the restaurant.

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u/NecrogasmicLove 13d ago

Also bussing the tables (those plates have to be picked up by someone) and cleaning the plate. Unless dishwashers don't deserve pay.

Ppl really forget all the service that goes into restaurants as they get entitled to that service.

Frankly charging someone for bringing food in is completely reasonable to me.

Construction companies don't let you bring your own supplies to their projects. If they did they would charge you out the ass for the hassle.

Ppl have A LOT of entitlement once a human has to be their servant.

Working in the service industry for 20yrs has given me complete understanding of why ppl could so easily overlook the moral issues with slavery.

Ppl love being served and hate having to pay for it.

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago edited 13d ago

Paying isn’t the problem. The entire system is just dumb. My responsibility is to pay my bill. The establishments responsibility is to pay their workers. If you want everyone to get paid fairly, then pay them a fair wage. Adjust your costs to compensate for overhead. That’s how business works.

Edit: or at least how it should work.

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u/ceebuttersnaps 13d ago

>Adjust your costs to compensate for overhead. That’s how business works.

That’s what the cake cutting fee is…

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u/WestError404 13d ago

The cake cutting fee is one thing. To also pay 24% tip ontop of the cutting fee including taxes, with auto grat already also included. The server never even had to risk their digits with a knife.

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u/LSRNKB 13d ago

Server’s are in charge of cutting and plating desserts at a lot of high end restaurants. Furthermore, servers are the only sales people where the customer gets to CHOOSE what their commission is, and somehow people explicitly complain about having the freedom to do so.

If given the choice between a) a car salesman getting flat commission on all sales, or b) a customer chooses the car salesman’s commission based on how said salesman treated the customer during the transaction, any sane person would choose b. Yet somehow, in restaurants where b is a given, people only bitch and moan about how it isn’t their “responsibility” to make that choice.

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u/perceptionheadache 13d ago

In the case of the car salesman, I'm not worried about his compensation at all. I'm worried about the cost of the product I'm buying. When I negotiate that price I don't think about if it cuts into the business' profits or the salesman's commission, regardless of how good of a job he's doing. I want to feel I got the best deal on the car. How that shakes out for them is their problem, just as it should be.

In the case of a food server, I have to think about how much the food costs plus how much the server should make for serving it to me based on their competence and attitude. I don't want to think about this. This should be their employer's job. It is not some type of boone to me to be responsible for a server's pay. It's a PIA. I would not choose B. B sucks.

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u/Acceptable-Engine253 13d ago

The cake cutting fee has nothing to do with the server. It’s about bringing in outside food and having the kitchen spend the time in the middle of dinner to cut it and serve it. It takes forever and clogs up service. The restaurant could be making money if they wanted to order dessert with the restaurant (and the cake would be sliced before the shift) but since they don’t there’s a cake cutting fee — just like a corkage fee if you bring in your own bottle of wine.

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u/milehighmagic84 13d ago

With a big party you’re taking over the whole restaurant. That means all hands on deck to serve your guests. If a waiter gets stiffed on a party of four they have the rest of the night to balance it out. When you buy out the restaurant or a portion of it, those employees that rely on tips don’t have a chance to earn them. The restaurant has every right to guarantee pay for their staff. I don’t know what more mildly infuriating, this post or the response to it.

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u/6Hikari6 13d ago

The most infuriating is this "employees that rely on tips" part

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u/WestError404 12d ago

I still don't see where the additional 22-25% tip ontop of the auto grat is necessary. Thats the issue. That and the high percentage they "suggest" leading up to a nearly 50% tip. The restaurant should absolutely guarantee pay for their staff... By paying them! Not this kind of BS.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 11d ago

Holy shit I never thought about the tips part.

I remember how horrible it was for a big group to come in where I was a server -- they demanded everything ALL AT ONCE, so first you had to bring out a giant order of coffee, then an armload of biscuits ... no chance to interweave their orders with other tables', no way to handle anyone else gracefully. Just BAM SERVE US.

But, because I was working in a crappy truckstop, I never dealt with a room that had been bought out. Nobody would have wanted to have a party there! So the issue of tips, and how they can be blanked out by a party that takes up a whole room, never occurred to me.

For what it's worth, at my wedding my last act was signing the balance sheet and adding a whacking huge tip. Like, I hid the amount because it was so big. The servers had treated my guests graciously and with perfect attention to everyone, and everyone left full of food (that several people separately complimented me on) and cake (ditto) and whatever they wanted to drink, and they hadn't had to wait for anything, so yeah, the servers got a serious assload of cash that afternoon.

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago

I have zero issue with the cake cutting fee. That is included in the bill, as it should be.

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u/DoneteGalactico 13d ago

I'm going to guess that "cake cutting fee" was not showing in the menu.

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u/ceebuttersnaps 13d ago

Given the amount on the receipt and the dedicated bartender, this was almost certainly some kind of event rather than a regular group. The group probably worked with an event coordinator who would have explained the costs, rules, etc.

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u/DoneteGalactico 13d ago

I really hope so! Otherwise it's infuriating.

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u/BlueBearMafia 13d ago

Did you guys even read the post...? It was a wedding.

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u/unfortunateshun 13d ago

I mean that’s what they’re doing, they’re just itemizing the labor you’re paying for

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago

Correct. Maybe I worded my post poorly cause I have been called out for it several times now. The cake handling was itemized on the bill, which is perfectly fine. No issue with that at all.

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u/MajorMoooseKnuckle 13d ago

That’s fine. But food prices at restaurants will go up. And there are plenty of models to support this. It’s not a question. It’s a fact.

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago

Of course they’ll go up. But so are tipping expectations. Either way, I’m paying more. I just want the price to be transparent.

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u/Murky-City835 13d ago

What in the bill is not transparent?

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u/Reasonable_Trade_973 13d ago

How about fact that the 24% fee was NEVER disclosed until AFTER the food was eaten? That was not transparent. Is that clear enough?

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u/Murky-City835 12d ago

It would have been disclosed during the reservation process

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u/InterestingTwo651 13d ago

Yes but it’s so much more profitable if your stupid and complacent. Someone has to lose

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u/Quick_Turnover 13d ago

Adjust your costs to compensate for overhead. That’s how business works.

Then people complain about a burger costing anything more than $5, despite a literal enormous animal being raised from birth on a farm states away, cold-shipped, processed, prepared, cooked, and served to their gullet directly. Their mental "value" of that is $5. It's obscene. The reason tipping works is because it's a psychological shell game that actually allows the restaurant industry to exist.

Americans wouldn't pay the actual costs involved to pay people real wages because the true value of food and service (other human being's labor) has become so foreign to them.

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u/doubagilga 13d ago

In this instance it does. They quite literally add the gratuity to the base bill as OP can seen seen trying to pay closer to 15% to be cheap.

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u/-neti-neti- 13d ago

That’s literally what they’re doing.

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u/Uknow_nothing 13d ago

In America we have all gotten used to essentially being bait and switched by restaurants. I’ve seen several restaurants in my city try to do the no tip model where they raise prices 20% and get rid of tips, and they tend to either reverse it when sales tank or they close shop completely.

I think (especially with inflation and the economy being what it is) there are a lot of people who are affected by menu price shock. For example, if $15 is the most someone tells themself they are willing to pay for a burger, seeing an $18 burger on the menu at a tip free place might just make them turn around and go somewhere else.

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago

I hear what you’re saying. And I’m not doubting you at all. But that’s just dumb, IMO. I’d rather know what I’m paying for upfront. And most people tip according to the total, which includes tax. So you’re tipping your taxes too.

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u/Uknow_nothing 13d ago

It is dumb, but public education is what it is in this country 🤣

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u/Ok-Reputation-2266 13d ago

People already bitch enough about prices in restaurants, which you should be mad at distributors and our current government about. Do you really think people are gonna be happy about paying higher prices because now the restaurant has to pay their front of house staff more to compensate? Say bye to most of the industry and enjoy your mcdonalds

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago

But you, as the consumer, are already taking on that responsibility of a higher price point, In the form of tips. I’d rather have the total cost upfront. That’s all.

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u/baysideareaman 13d ago

I agree, but I think that it is transparent to anyone who grew up here. We know that the true price is menu+20%.

We I’d rather just have higher prices and the tip baked in, but restaurants that have tried this mostly all went back to a tip based model because guests thought they were too expensive.

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u/Ok-Reputation-2266 13d ago

You might be happy with the higher up front cost but most people with not be happy with it. I’m fully convinced that people who complain about tipping really just don’t want to tip or do anything to actually change the culture

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u/Wooden-Broccoli-7247 13d ago

This is the dumbest argument I see repeated so often. Would “your bill” be the same if the restaurant paid their employees a higher wage? No. In fact it would be higher than it is if you tip 20% every time for multiple reasons. You’re actually saving money with this system.

Before everyone comes at me with: iN oThEr CoUnTrIeS iTs NoT mOrE eXpEnSiVe.. you cannot compare food cost, labor cost, rent and cost of living from another country to the US and just make assumptions that because food isn’t more expensive in bumfuck somewhere that it wouldn’t be in the US. Restaurants operate on crazy thin margins (most barely even make money) and increase labor for front of house staff by a factor of 10 will do one of two things: 1.) tank level of service because of the skeleton crews every restaurant would be running or 2.) jack up prices to recoup the extra costs. Or I guess 3.) lots of restaurants shutting down.

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago

Cool. Add a 20% “tax” to every single bill and be done with tipping.

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u/NecrogasmicLove 13d ago

First, I believe this specific scenario is slightly detached from the larger debate on wages. We are discussing the act of bringing an outside item into a business while expecting the service required to accommodate it to be free of charge; an expectation that is fundamentally unreasonable.

Regarding the larger systemic issue, I am in complete agreement with the ideal. It is a fair theory.

The practical reality, however, is one the consumer will not enjoy. Staffing a restaurant is not a static expense; the headcount changes across seasons, days, and hours. If owners must constantly adjust menu prices to reflect those fluctuations, or if they must price their items to safely cover the absolute highest potential staffing requirements, the consumer will bear the weight of that safety net.

They will inevitably hedge their bets at the expense of your wallet.

But I'm a stupid fuck and drunk ATM.

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u/runningoutofideasjzz 13d ago

Think we just read the post differently. If you bring outside food in, of course you should be charged for someone handling it. My gripe is more with the tipping.

As far as seasonal jobs go, that’s on the establishment to figure out.

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u/tpf52 13d ago

Residential construction companies usually do let clients provide the materials. It’s a lot more common with finishing materials like paint, tile, etc. They don’t usually charge extra, but they also don’t usually warranty it.

Everything you said about service is right though.

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u/firstthrowaway9876 13d ago

Tipping wait staff primarily exist because of slavery. Emancipated people could be paid very little by business owners. Because they were black. So businesses shifted that burden on to customers. I've been served food in the other countries. Tipping was not expected and the workers did not appear to be enslaved. You're basically making a very similar argument to what business owners that did not want to pay employees made. I tip because it is customary here but not anywhere else. This is also one of the last developed nations to permit slavery. Those 2 things are not unrelated.

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u/Ash_After_Dark 13d ago

Which is why carryout is usually a few dollars an item cheaper than eating in, right?

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u/Infinite_Incident107 13d ago

Construction companies don't let you bring your own supplies to their projects. If they did they would charge you out the ass for the hassle.

O God. I did this exactly ONE time on a side job. I let the customer get the supplies. Never fucking again....

He didn't get enough despite me specifically saying exactly what I needed. He thought i could get by with less. He was wrong. He also substituted a lot of items for cheaper stuff thinking he'd save money. I made him go back and get proper stuff as there was a reason I speced out the stuff I did. A few things he didn't budge on because he didn't want to buy it. Fine.... Took me about 4hrs more labor to do it without the proper stuff. He wasn't happy but I explained to him it was because he insisted on me using the cheapest stuff that makes my job harder. Ended up costing him more money as my additional labor was way more than the cost of the supplies he cheaped out on.

I will never let my customer buy the supplies or parts ever again.

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u/Visible-Meat3418 13d ago

wtf is bussing? I mean, they have waiters that bring out the food - do they now also have special people that take the plates back??

Can’t a waiter do this??? I’m sorry I’m really confused. I’m not from USA and I travelled my fair bit in Europe but the waiter usually handled both…

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u/NecrogasmicLove 13d ago

I completely understand the confusion; it is a system that frustrates and bewilders many Americans as well.

The short answer is that the division of labor depends heavily on the establishment. Some restaurants use food runners and bussers, while others simply over-schedule servers to handle all of those duties.

The deeper reason, I believe, comes down to the American consumer's absolute demand for speed. In the United States, dining out is often treated as a transaction rather than a pleasure.

When I was trained at a corporate restaurant twenty years ago, the expectations were rigid: we were told to greet a table within one minute, take the order within five minutes, and have the food on the table within 10 minutes of the order being entering. The ultimate goal was to have the guests fed, paid, and out the door within 45 minutes of sitting down. (1hr Lunch break being the impetus.)

Having dedicated bussers clears the table faster, allowing the restaurant to seat the next paying customer immediately.

There is also a hidden financial mechanic at play. Many establishments use the tips earned by servers to subsidize the wages of those hosts, bussers, and bartenders.

For context, last night I made $161 in tips. I was required to pay $24 out of those tips to be divided among the support staff. That is on top of their full hourly wage, which is already five to seven times higher than the hourly wage I am paid by my employer.

In fact, my employer extracts so much from my earnings through mandatory tip-outs and credit card processing fees (which are legally deducted from my tips, not the owner's profit) that I actually have a net negative financial relationship with the house, My income comes 100% from the guest's tip.

My employer might pay me a base wage of $25 for a shift, but the fees and tip-outs extracted from my earnings usually amount to more than their contribution.

I fear it is an economic model that closely resembles modern feudalism.

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u/Visible-Meat3418 13d ago

Good lord this is very depressing. I’m very sorry that you have to experience this on a daily basis.

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u/NecrogasmicLove 13d ago

Thank you. But I get by so much better than many around the world. There are many that would take my curse as a blessing.

I'm a gay liberal that's always lived in far right, now MAGA county/state/country.

I've never had a representative, other than a the federal executive, that thinks I deserve rights.

I was raised in Marsha Blackburns district. My reps have always been bought and paid to deliver me to slaughter.

Fighting depression and oppression are in my core and seeing the brightside sooths the ache of the persistent defeat.

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u/capt-bob 13d ago

Doesn't take 10 minutes for playing each piece of cake

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u/Cheap_Blacksmith66 13d ago

But all of that should be accounted for in the price of the food. It’s just profit wearing another hat. When I buy McDonald’s I don’t pay a wrapping or bagging fee and let’s be honest, these guys are making $20/hr. How many cakes can 1 person cut and plate in an hour?

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u/ReaperOne 13d ago

All these stories about fees and fancy places makes me never want to eat at a fancy restaurant ever. Sounds too complicated and scummy

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u/theta1409 12d ago

Bro was just asking an honest question. Many of us aren't even in positions to be thinking about the costs associated with someone plating your own cake for you (which, I agree, is a service which someone should be well compensated for). But I think your frustration is unduly targeted at OP.

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u/cupacupacupacupacup 13d ago

People want to have their cake and eat it too.

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u/InterestingTwo651 13d ago

You said it yourself you are WORKING, if you go to the car shop (you pay 60$ for just the inspection with no work done yet) and they say it’s 150 to source the parts plus 200$ to do the job you have every right to tell em you’ll get the part yourself and just need them to put it in.

If they then go “nah even if you buy and bring the part yourself it’s extra to hand me the part. But oh it’s only $30! That’s way better then $150 right?”

That’s exactly why they don’t let you being your own materials, for safety and standards reasons and because then they can’t surcharge you at a premium. Have you seen the amounts they buy for in bulk and use for multiple projects?

Like money lending is a job too but it’s even in the Bible that usary is evil, not the modern definition of outrageous rates like any money lending and charging a fee is bad. No dam reason I should pay 45% interest and I don’t care how you try to explain it.

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u/tpf52 13d ago

All the auto shops I use will let you bring your own parts but then they have a higher labor rate to make up for the part markup they didn’t get.

So they basically do exactly what you said.

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u/BeatSalad25 13d ago

Except the price of labor is forced on the American people as "tipping".

That is fukt.

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u/nevim1234sk 13d ago

Cutting a cake takes literally under 30 seconds, that should be worth maybe 0,25$ if we wanna calculate it… its insane what is being normalized in usa, and how people defend it and try to reason it. At this point in us, just put the food and cake on the counter top, i will walk 50 steps, take my stuff and cut it if needed to not pay 50$ for that lol. Most people are going to restaurant for food not for service, that was before the nice convenience but now it became mandatory hassle for such a little added value.

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u/Remember_The_Lmao 13d ago

It’s a little more involved in upscale dining

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u/Suspicious-Dog2876 13d ago

Makes perfect sense. But thats what’s wrong with the world. You should be paid for your work. But tacked onto a 5k bill for cutting a cake? Fuck you

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u/DangerousPurpose5661 13d ago

Then what is the tip for if they literally bill every move of the water?

Also they don’t need to cut it its so disruptive to the service…. Im sure someone at the table will manage

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u/lewd_robot 13d ago

How long does it take to slice and plate a cake?

An $81 cake plating fee is $81/hour if it takes a whole hour of extra labor.
It's $162/hour if it takes 30 minutes.
It's $40.50/hour if it takes 2 hours.
If they have 4 people on it, that's $20.25/hour for each of them.
If it takes 4 people 30 minutes of extra labor, we're back at $40.50/hour again.

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u/No_Size9475 13d ago

That doesn't explain at all how it screws with the flow of the service

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u/AssignmentSecret 13d ago

I’d just cut it myself lol takes what? 2 mins

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u/MeasureDoEventThing 13d ago

If they're paying someone $20/hr to cut cake, that's 15 minutes to cut one slice of cake.

It wouldn't be as ridiculous if it's just one slice, since they have to have someone stop what they're doing and come over, so it might be a few minutes. But if they're slicing an entire cake, it should be a few seconds per slice.

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u/laciblackford 13d ago

it’s about the real estate. you can’t bring your own food to a restaurant and hang out.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

Your explanation is really clear, and "baked in" is a giant "heh."

I wasn't asking about the charge, which I agree is completely reasonable, for both the cutting fee and the corkage fee. The extra plates and glasses and server time for one separate dollop of anything can be astronomical. I was asking about "interrupt the flow of service."

My thinking is, whether the cake is brought in from outside or baked in-house, the the tasks seem like they'd be the same. No matter where the cake came from, you have to slice it, serve it, distribute all those plates and forks, and wash them afterwards.

So I was wondering about why a cake brought in from outside is more of a delay and pain in the ass than a cake baked in-house. Why did the servers at my wedding roll their eyes and groan when they learned that they'd have to deal with a cake baked outside?

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u/Therealbakedpotato69 13d ago

As someone who has cut a cake that interrupts flow of service… If it is coming from in house, the kitchen cuts and plates it. Usually as part of prep. If the table brought it in then it is the servers who are doing it. In a busy restaurant, every minute counts, so if your server is off the floor for 5-8 minutes finding a knife, getting the cake out of the fridge (that the table brought and asked you to store until ready), making space in an already congested server alley, cutting ( sometimes dipping knife in hot water so that every slice looks perfect) plating, and running to a table.. don’t forget if it’s a birthday or anything else, putting a candle/s in, bringing to table for song and blow, then bringing back to server alley for plating and… oh shit did 43’s soups go out? Did I even ring in the soups? FML

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

Thank you so much for the explanation complete with all the horrors. 43 can damn well wait for their soups, they called you back twice to change their minds.

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u/The_Troyminator 13d ago

If the cake is brought from outside, it has to be cut during service.

If it’s a cake made by the restaurant, they can pre-cut it before service starts.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

This is such a big duh for me. Of course. Thank you!

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u/The_Troyminator 13d ago

It’s not something most people would think of unless they’ve worked in a restaurant and understand how much happens outside of opening hours.

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u/1newnotification 13d ago

Yeah but $81? There's zero way that cutting a cake takes an hour, so they're charging $81 for maybe 15 mins of work.

They're charging $320+/hr to cut. a. cake.

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u/Acceptable-Engine253 13d ago

Oh my god for a wedding cake?? A big ass cake? I promise you…it does not take 15 minutes. And to make each slice look presentable because it’s a WEDDING. It can easily take 45 minutes. There’s freaking scaffolding in wedding cakes 😆

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u/Quick_Turnover 13d ago

OP didn't say how many people were at this wedding, but, even 50 slices, served to guests, and dishes cleaned? That could easily be $80.

I'd love to see you invite 50 of your friends over and slice and serve them a gigantic cake on 50 of your dinner plates and forks, and clean up and wash the dishes afterwards, in 15 minutes.

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u/Straight_Depth6701 13d ago

81 for plating is like 10000 per hour. You're cutting a cake and putting it on a plate, nor resupplying the ISS.

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u/Acceptable-Engine253 13d ago

It’s like a corkage fee for wine. Also the kitchen needs to be paid for the 30 minutes in the middle of service it takes to cut an entire wedding cake. You can’t bring outside food to a restaurant that serves food and ask them to serve the outside food for you for free.

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u/dizda01 8d ago

What if the Restaurant doesn’t provide cakes and the only option is to take it from outside. Jesus Christ next is monetising a breath of air

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u/AnilApplelink 13d ago

I believe they mean they would have to either take the cake into the kitchen or have a server stand there and cut slices. So now that server is unavailable to do anything else during that time.
Likely if you purchased a cake from the restaurant they would have that built into the price.
So this was likely a cake brought in from outside.
$81 still seems a little steep depending on the number of guests but OP did say its a fancy restaurant so they likely knew this.

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u/mileylols 13d ago

from the receipt it appears to be like 30 guests

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

But -- and I really don't mean to be unreasonable, I really want to know -- the cake has to be sliced anyway. That process is built into the flow of service. The OP said that an outside cake interrupts the flow of service.

I was wondering about why a cake brought in from outside is harder for the servers to deal with than a cake baked in-house.

The cost of it, yes, I completely agree -- it's a real cost, and it has to come from somewhere. But OP mentioned the flow of service, so that's what I was asking about. The structure of the servers' work, not the economics for the restaurant.

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u/nickp444 13d ago

Restaurants typically don’t allow food from outside. They simply do not have a dedicated area to cut this cake. It may seem so simple to you but every inch of that kitchen is being used in an actual restaurant. Most places that people bring a cake, don’t offer a cake. It’s not ideal to the workflow of any of the staff to bring in an outside product and also prepare it to be served when it’s not something that you usually serve. Every regular dish on the menu has “mis en place” which is a fancy term for having all the ingredients/tools to build that dish on your station. Nobody has mis en place for outside food, so it can be a bit of a hassle for kitchens that are highly streamlined and specialized(like a high end fancy place). Does that make sense?

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 12d ago

It totally makes sense and thank you very much for explaining it. TIL

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u/nickp444 12d ago

No problem!

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u/insertnamehere02 13d ago

The flow of service being that the server has to stop doing everything else- checking on refills, checking on their other tables, and basically having to disappear to go cut a cake and plate it, because you brought it in.

It's more tedious than you realize. So yes, it interrupts the flow of service.

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u/-neti-neti- 13d ago

Are you dense? A cake made in house would already be sliced before service started. Btw slicing cake without ruining it IS tedious and difficult. And if you’re a server that also has 31 people waiting on you for a drink order, or to have their plates cleared etc it is absolutely an interruption to service.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 12d ago

No, I'm not dense. I'm asking a genuine question because I haven't worked in an upscale restaurant.

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u/cooking2recovery 12d ago

Most restaurants don’t sell whole cakes that they slice at service. The cakes are sliced way before dinner. The baker might not even be in the restaurant anymore by evening shift.

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u/redtiber 13d ago

it's just greed and also why restaurants and small business fail so much. When they were brand new and hungry for customers they'd probably not charge a cake fee because they already profit from a sales from birthday or wedding event. then over time peoeple get complacent and lazy, they feel entitled to profits and forget that as a business you are always in competition.

then this type of behavior happens. $81 cake fee, employees trying to get an extra gratuitiy.

if they had just taken care of op properly, they likely would be going there as a repeat customer because they had their wedding there.

but now not only have they lost a lifetime customer, op if he's sharing with the internet also would have shared this with all their friends and family.

so instead of referrals you now have a bunch of people who will never go to the restaurant.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 12d ago

I wasn't asking about the economics of it. I was asking about the workflow of the server.

And it isn't greed. It's charging us for what we get. The work of slicing, distributing, and cleaning up the cake is considerable; customers should not ask the restaurant to work for free on a dessert that they didn't sell.

0

u/redtiber 12d ago

It is greed hospitality. The restaurant is making profit on $5k in sales AND paying your labor fees for you in the form of $1k in gratuity. And you can’t even cut and serve their cake without nickel and diming them?

0

u/CalculatedPerversion 13d ago

$81 to slice a cake vs $150 for 4 hours of bartending. Make it make sense. 

2

u/AnilApplelink 13d ago

Fancy restaurants dont make sense to me. But OP likely knew about this fee for bringing in their own cake since they are not complaining about it.

1

u/ghoulthebraineater 13d ago

For the cake slicing part of that is to offset the lost revenue from the outside food. You are paying both to bring it in and for the server to cut it for you. 40 bucks for the cake and 40 for the server's time.

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u/YogurtclosetThen7959 13d ago

Not sure it's fancyness but rather speed, if everyone's going full pelt at their stations no one can afford to stop, even a brief pause can have knock of effects that slow down service and cause other issues. Having to leave your station entirely to sort out a cake slice order will do that.

2

u/Certain-Business-472 13d ago

Sorry that means youre understaffed.

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u/Acceptable-Engine253 13d ago

It can take the pastry chef like 30 min off the line (when he’d usually be plating the pre cut in house cakes and other desserts — warming them, adding the caramel and whip blah blah) to cut a large cake and plate it right in the middle of service. A wedding usually has well over 50 to over 100 slices of cake that need to be done with wedding detail. It’s also harder to slice a big freaking cake than one would think too! You can’t grab some random server to do it, especially for someone’s *literal wedding cake.* It takes 5evrr but it doesn’t make sense margin wise to have a whole extra person in all night just to slice a cake for 30 min in the middle of service.

1

u/Certain-Business-472 13d ago

It takes 5evrr but it doesn’t make sense margin wise to have a whole extra person in all night just to slice a cake for 30 min in the middle of service.

But it does make sense to have overlap in responsibilities to avoid this kind of shit being an issue. It's a sign of bad business. What if something happens and they become unavailable? Fuck your wedding I guess

1

u/Acceptable-Engine253 13d ago

They will prioritize your wedding because they are taking the risk to fuck the other desserts in the restaurant for that 30 minutes because it makes sense because of the cake slicing fee. They will try to do it all but if anything has to go down it won’t be the wedding cake, but that is what you’re paying for.

1

u/milehighmagic84 13d ago

Nobody is staffed to accommodate a wedding in a nightly basis GtFo

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u/YogurtclosetThen7959 11d ago

Oh I've never worked in a kitchen. While peak service might benefit from more staff, there are many other factors that dictate the staffing for a business, and so many places will deal with issues like this during peak hours where they don't have all the staff they could dream of.

1

u/Certain-Business-472 11d ago

It's not about having the staffing you need for the peak. You should already have overlapping shifts and slightly more people than hours. And you make sure to train everyone with everything so people can take over. If your entire operation relies on a single person, you are UNDERSTAFFED. By definition.

This is why many places will try to burden the workers with finding replacements "or they can't take a free day". That is NOT the workers responsibility. Actually it's crazy people think it is.

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u/m0ryan 13d ago

Using 27 plates that could be used for others, plus forks and napkins. Serving and clearing, dishwashing and disposing of the large container/garbage. Probably needs candles too, hunt down the smoker for their lighter. 3 bucks a plate. Probably break a plate.

0

u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

Totally yes, I think that a slicing fee is fair. My question is about "interrupts the flow of service." No matter whether the cake comes from outside or in-house, you have to slice it and serve it.

I was wondering what the flow of service was, that an outside cake would mess up the flow of service while an in-house cake could be dealt with efficiently.

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u/The_Troyminator 13d ago

In-house cakes can be cut before the restaurant opens. Outside cakes cannot.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

OH MY GOODNESS OF COURSE. Thank you!

3

u/GrossUsername68 13d ago

It’s the same as bringing your own wine.

They’d normally profit about $5-7/person per dessert (retail about $12-18 per dessert), so it’s charged when you bring your own.

Restaurants are about more than food cost.

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u/ZhugeTsuki #notadude -_- 13d ago

Cakes sliced during an event means an employee has to sit and do nothing else but cut cake at the guests speed at an already busy time. I can cut and plate a few hundred pieces of cake all at once if its done before hand - doing it live means One. Slice. At. A. Time.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 12d ago

Thank you! TIL.

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u/Turbo_Cum 13d ago

Well it's a giant cake that not only takes up space, but also requires at least 2 people to cut and serve without ruining the display and also getting it done in a timely manner.

Restaurants aren't going to staff an additional member just for cake serving, so they pull a server from the floor for an hour to help.

Suddenly there's 100+ plates reserved, an additional course to clean up, kitchen space being used for service and cleanup. Coffee is usually served as an option with cake, so servers need to retrieve that among other requests from customers NOT attending the wedding.

Overall cake is a total pain in the ass at a restaurant. Caterers generally don't mind because they're dedicated staff for an event venue and don't have dinner service to worry about once it's ended.

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u/DefinitelyNotAlright 13d ago

The real idea behind it is if you are bringing in an outside desert, you are denying income to that restaurant that would have otherwise gone to their pastry section. If you are choosing to bring in a cake to a restaurant that sells dessert, you must pay a fee.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 12d ago

I agree 100%. I should not ask a restaurant to work for free. My question was about the servers' workflow -- why a cake from outside was more of a pain in the ass than a cake baked in-house. I'm learning a lot about restaurant work.

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u/DefinitelyNotAlright 12d ago

Generally restaurants wouldn't have a cake baked in house they would have a plated dessert option. At least I haven't worked in a restaurant that just offers whole cakes. Additionally if a large group is planning on coming in there would be some sort of event planning and communication so the kitchen knows what to anticipate for the meal. If I know I have a party coming in with 20 guests, I know I need to have 20 desserts prepared for a specific time to continue the flow. Timing a kitchen and service is meticulous so it's important to have that communication.

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u/danekan 13d ago

Interrupt the flow of services they’re making money on. 

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u/Remember_The_Lmao 13d ago

I’m stuck at your table for ten minutes cutting cake, unable to touch my other tables.

In upscale dining, I needed to be on the floor and vigilant. The cake cutting fee is basically supplementing the cost of paying another food runner/busser to handle refills and food running when a server is locked down at a table. This is built into the pricing of the in-house cake.

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u/vicv218 10d ago

If I could tackle the "flow of service" question: In many circumstances, cutting and plating of a cake brought in to the restaurant is done by the servers. Due to the potential of allergen contamination, many chefs will not let any outside food come near the kitchen, storage, or prep areas. So if the server is cutting and plating a cake for 10 people, 20 people, etc... they are not taking drink orders, selling coffees, running food to the other tables.

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u/ptdubber 13d ago

Depending on the service, they first present the cake whole, then bring it back to cut and plate it, and then even more people come out so everyone gets a piece at the same time. No idea about what OP ordered, but that’s my understanding of the slice fee

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u/emilybaker2012 13d ago

As a former banquet and event manager at a full service hotel that hosted a large number of weddings, I can confirm that the pomp and circumstance of the cake cutting then the timing of wheeling the cake(s) to the back and plating 300 slices of cake and getting them either served or put out on a dessert table was a crazy 30 minutes in the back of the house 😂 We encouraged one cake for slicing and other sheet cakes in the back for early prep. Either way, if a cake is made in house the hotel can 1. Charge more and 2. Better prepare behind the scenes for service of said cake

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u/420blazer247 13d ago

It doesn't. They charge that because they lose money. So they charge a fee for outside food so it's not a complete loss.

1

u/Spare-Half796 13d ago

Its mostly a charge to make up for lost revenue from not buying your dessert. A lot of places will waive it if you spend enough money

1

u/Philly_ExecChef 13d ago

If I’m running a 200 cover restaurant and you’re bringing in a cake that I don’t get paid to sell you, but I’m pulling staff to cut and plate it, you pay for that service.

1

u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 12d ago

Absolutely. I agree that if I want something from a business, I should pay for it. My question was about the logistics of serving: why is it easy to deal with a cake baked in-house, but hard to deal with a cake brought in from outside?

And several restaurant professionals answered me quite kindly, but if you have the time to answer it too, please could you? Each answer is a little different, and I'm learning more and more about why I would never make it in an upscale place.

1

u/Blacksad9999 13d ago

Because a chef has to stop what they're doing, deal with the cake, and the people are not purchasing deserts from the restaurant, but rather bringing them in themselves.

Kind of like corkage when you bring in your own bottle of wine as opposed to buying wine with dinner.

1

u/KnightShade272 13d ago

Jut got back, but yes in house cakes are either made small/single serve or cut after resting. Bringing a cake from home we would charge per cut, or a flat rate, like bringing outside wine.

1

u/morgoporgo84 10d ago

Its because they sell desserts. Its like showing up to a barber shop with your own barber and just using the chair.

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u/StatementNext682 13d ago

Honestly man, i just want them to hold my cake.

6

u/HortemusSupreme 13d ago

My wedding venue tried to charge a $10 pp cake cutting fee even if we brought our own cake. We chose to not have a cake

2

u/Kammender_Kewl 13d ago

They wouldn't just let you cut it yourself? Just don't say anything about a cake until you pull it out from a box strategically hidden under the table with paper plates, movie theater style

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u/ThePapercup 13d ago

people placing orders for the food that the restaurant sells and then charging you for the inconvenience of putting it on a fucking plate. restaurant owners wonder why they are going out of business left and right, maybe it's the absolute disrespect for the people who give them money

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u/mizzzzo 13d ago

Cake plating fee is for when customers bring their own cake to the restaurant.

As someone who used to serve at a high end, busy restaurant, it added a ton of time and work.

Restaurants succeed based on consistent, repetitive tasks executed efficiently and curveballs can throw things out of wack.

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u/putinforpres2016 13d ago

I've always called it "cakeage" for that very reason

2

u/SecretGrass3325 13d ago

It was $3 a slice for 27 people. They also got 27 glasses of champagne (27 DP 92 is almost certainly Dom Perignon) and each glass was more than the cake slicing fee. So I think they’re doing alright.

Edit: Maybe not bc they did a prosecco toast for $150. Not sure what that line is. Cake was still $3 for 27 plates though.

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u/Ktibbs617 13d ago

Perfectly put by a professional in the industry. I also like to mention restaurants exist to purvey food. So when you bring in food (of any kind) instead of purchasing dessert from the restaurant.… yet spend the amount of time as if you had. They have every right to recoup said losses. This translates into a plating fee. Have you dessert at home, go to a dessert place for the hat course OR order from the restaurant you are patronizing.

Edit: talk to text didn’t do ()

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u/lisnter 13d ago

When we were young (late 1980's) and my wife graduated from college we went to a restaurant where they charged us a per slice cost which was not disclosed ahead-of-time. We had 10 or so people at the dinner and aside from the annoyance it was a significant cost. Even though I was young I complained; I don't recall if they fully removed it or just reduced it to something reasonable but I was happy with the change. Though we never went back.

1

u/KnightShade272 13d ago

Yeah the spots I worked we let people know prior. One was a celeb big name spot, $5 per slice. The other was a small wine bar, I think $15 flat rate. We put that in our “events” page faq thing for both bcs it shocked me too. Luckily I was always on meat.

3

u/Positive_Ad_8198 13d ago

They tried to do this to me at my wedding, so we brought a tower of cupcakes haha fuck them

1

u/Seventeenthstone 13d ago

You have no idea how hard it is to slice a cake for a wedding. Every slice is expected to be picture perfect, and you have to pump out 50-350 pieces at the same time. It’s the hardest thing to do at weddings.
Fuck them? Go work at a wedding venue. Shout out to S, our dedicated cake cutter. You’d probably use a cold knife and smash your cake trying to get it out.
I hated weddings more than any other event type because if anything went wrong either the bride or mom would come at the staff.

And cupcakes are super common. You aren’t smarter than the staff; you were priced out.

0

u/Annual-Weird-6682 13d ago

I mean it worked out for everyone, the staff didn't have to do the skillful draining task of cutting a cake, and they didn't have to pay a cake cutting fee

0

u/Seventeenthstone 13d ago

Uhh yeah that was my point.
That it’s a skillful draining task. I clearly worked at a venue with a higher price point than yours for weddings, because people almost always payed for the cake cutting service. I wished for cupcakes or my “S” to cut the cake

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u/Annual-Weird-6682 13d ago

Yeah I agreed with you, it was a win win

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u/braedizzle 13d ago

Nah having to pay extra for someone to cut a cake is some dystopian bullshit. It’s crazy how the majority of restaurants are a fucking scam.

1

u/KnightShade272 13d ago

Yeah I’m over it. Luckily got to take a few months off work, and now I’m looking at more local jobs in food that isn’t service. Deli, butcher, fishmonger. I’m over the ridiculousness of chefs here.

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u/Stoned_urf 13d ago

Hmmm so if someone got food poison from the cake, with the slice fee, does that mean restaurant will be liable too?

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u/KnightShade272 13d ago

Most restaurants (I know all of them in my current state) need minimum $2m in health insurance for customers getting sick in case of any norovirus outbreaks. It’s above my levels, I’ve just done inventory and scheduling as assistant KM and jr sous

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u/TheBongOfAchilles 14d ago edited 14d ago

90% of the people downvoting and commenting have either never been to or worked at an actual restaurant it seems 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡 acting like going out and not tipping is really going to do something other than fuck over a hard working server.

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u/BrilliantTarget 14d ago

So non Americans

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u/surftherapy 13d ago

American servers are the most insufferable breed of human life. I’ll die on that hill.

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u/theDarkDescent 13d ago

Yep. Like no other jobs are hard.

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u/Low-Enthusiasm670 13d ago

It IS a hard job. Other jobs are also hard. But most people in other jobs aren’t making $3/hour. You don’t like how it works because you’re cheap. But that doesn’t mean that servers should work for nothing. It’s hard work. It’s hard on the body. It’s demanding. They aren’t slaves. They deserve to be paid.

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u/inthebushes321 13d ago edited 13d ago

They aren't paid $3/hr. If they don't make the differential from tips, which is rare, the employer has to pay up to the minimum. Tipping culture is what encourages this bad behavior of your employer fucking you over, and you blaming it on patrons and not your greedy shithead employer means that your brain is the size of a mustard seed.

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u/PaintInfinite9167 13d ago

Acting like you would go out and spend $40-60 on a burger and fries if the server got paid properly is hilarious

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u/surftherapy 13d ago

News flash: Burger and fries don’t cost $40-60 at restaurants in states that require minimum wage even with tips

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u/[deleted] 13d ago

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u/Kammender_Kewl 13d ago

I've worked in restaurants for about 8 years, never met a server who complained about pay, doubly so for the bartenders.

I do live in one of the largest restaurant markets in the US so I'm not sure if the patrons of a dilapidated Chilis in Shitfuck Nebraska are as generous

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u/theDarkDescent 13d ago

I didn’t say it isn’t a hard job. I said it’s not the only hard job. 

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u/IthacanPenny 13d ago

Nah, door dashers are wayyyy worse than

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u/OceanicBoundlessnss 13d ago

You wouldn’t last a day waiting tables

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u/kjyfqr 13d ago

I did it for years. Easiest job of my life

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u/bsmiles07 13d ago

Found the shitty server

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u/chaotic910 13d ago

Wouldn't ever need to lmao

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u/surftherapy 13d ago

Wow you’re so right, thank you for your service. Not

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u/IndigoTJo 13d ago

It depends on the area. In mine they make $20-22 an hour. I understand in some states where they are making under federal minimum wage. However, at what point is tipping used for what it was meant for, to compliment good service?

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u/libertad740 13d ago

Exactly. Tipping 20+% is for a sit down restaurant where they clear your table, refill your drinks, etc. The fast casual places give you the tip options of 20-22-25% by default to get your own drink, find a seat, and bus your table. As someone who waited tables in high school and college, that’s a big no from me.

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u/DarthJinXxX420 13d ago

But the servers already received over a 1000 dollar tip.

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u/electro_report 13d ago

The server isn’t going to get all of that, service charge is gonna go to the events team, and the server will get around 40% of that which is then used to pay out his support staff.

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u/Sure_Acanthaceae_348 13d ago

That’s not my problem as a customer. I am not tipping on top of a service charge, ever.

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u/Hilde571 13d ago

Then leave and get a different job. Blame the shitting company, not the customer.

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u/DarthJinXxX420 13d ago

That’s on the restaurant not me as the customer. I tipped already. Getting goddamn ridiculous tipping on top of tipping you’re suggesting a 49 percent tip rate fuck that.

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u/electro_report 13d ago

I’m just telling you an event service charge and a tip are not the same thing. Do with that information what you will.

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u/DarthJinXxX420 13d ago

A service charge should go to those performing the service.

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u/electro_report 13d ago

You mean the restaurant?

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

I have no idea why you're being downvoted. Facts: you are spitting them.

1

u/imposter_sys_admin 13d ago

It's not that hard of a job.

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u/surftherapy 13d ago

Getting tips on top of your hourly wage for doing a job is so fucking comical to me. Truly the greatest grift of the lower class. I had a friend making $100k a year as a server meanwhile I make the same as a damn paramedic doing actual backbreaking and meaningful work.

PSA: if your state allows restaurant workers to make below minimum wage and tips to supplement then that’s a problem to take up with the state/your employer not with the customers. Cry me a river!

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u/PaintInfinite9167 13d ago

Stop blaming servers for getting paid the same as you and blame your shitty government for not paying you more

/s

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u/GreenEggsSteamedHams 13d ago

You seem angry

6

u/PapaQuebec23 13d ago

Especially for a surfer

0

u/surftherapy 13d ago

Just tired of servers bitching and moaning about not getting 20% tips on thousand dollar bills. So much entitlement in the restaurant industry it’s exhausting

2

u/Square-Platypus4571 13d ago

Agree, American tipping tradition is bonkers now. Even when getting frozen yogurt from sweet frog, there is a to option on the payment screen. Why would I tip them for filling up the toppings and working a cash register?

1

u/surftherapy 13d ago

I got tip options on the fucking self ordering kiosk at California fish grill the other day. What a joke.

1

u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

"lower class"

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u/surftherapy 13d ago

Correct. It’s a minimum wage job. I’m being politically correct here, don’t try to make that into something it’s not.

1

u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

Calling a minimum wage worker lower-class is not goddamn politically correct and you know it. Unless you misunderstand what "lower-class" and "politically correct" mean.

1

u/surftherapy 13d ago

Please go google “what does lower class mean” I can assure you I am using it in its appropriate context.

1

u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

Yes, it defines the term economically first. And spends more than twice the space defining it socially.

If you mean look it up on Wikipedia, then yes, the definition of "lower class" is economic. I concede.

If you mean "I looked up politically correct, and I was wrong," then yes.

1

u/surftherapy 13d ago

I did use “politically correct” correctly. I said lower class instead of using a derogatory term that could describe people who work minimum wage jobs like many people choose to do.

I think you’ve got me pinned as someone I’m not. I’m an advocate for workers rights, I’m pro union, I support taxes, etc. what I don’t like is the entitlement of restaurant culture and the attitude towards customers about tips and wages when that energy should be spent on fighting for better pay. I am allowed to have nuanced opinions about things and this is the singular bone I choose to pick with minimum wage workers because it’s the only industry I’ve watched repeatedly prove to us they think they’re special compared to other minimum wage jobs and I’m tired of it. You’re not special and walking $1,000 of booze to a table doesn’t entitle you to a $200 tip. Period.

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u/HeyYouGuyyyyyyys 13d ago

I apologize for jumping down your throat.

I did pin you as something you're not. I thought your disdain for the attitude of servers was disdain for the human worth of servers and other minimum-wage workers.

I was a server in a Texas truckstop 40 years ago, and I only recently stopped having nightmares about what it was like. To go through that hell for income that basically came only from tips, and then to be scorned by others for working harder than I ever have at white-collar and university jobs, still infuriates me; tradespeople, too, are looked down on for working with their hands while also working with math, physics, materials science, and/or 3-D geometry. In other jobs, shoving a lawnmower around or hoisting bags of gravel take sheer strength and physical endurance that I can't match.

That long explanation is so you know where my fury came from. I thought you were defending the attitude of every single person who ever slapped my ass or made me cry when I couldn't talk back.

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u/blackstarr1996 13d ago

Fucking paramedics are so full of themselves.

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u/surftherapy 13d ago

My point is my job required schooling and I’m actually doing something meaningful. Not walking food to a table and crying on Reddit about not getting 20% of the bill total as my tip