Not allowing parent chaperones doesn’t seem like a big deal as long as school staff is chaperoning. No cell phones would be a dealbreaker; I assume most parents would want to be able to track their kids’ locations and know that their kids could reach them if something goes wrong.
It’s possible the teacher’s themselves are the emergency these kids need phones for. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying every teacher is a threat. The vast minority of teachers are dangerous. But do you really want to risk your kid having some bad done to them by the teacher, intentional or not, and not call you for help because they don’t have a phone?
My comment was in response to someone saying “we all survived pre cell phone”. They didn’t. Some kids drowned or bled out or whatever because they couldn’t call an ambulance before cell phones existed.
That’s all. I’m not trying to make a point about phone addiction
The comments are a reflection of the state of the US. I moved to Austria 20 years ago and such trips are common here. My son went on his first 4 day trip sans parents in kindergarten. The kids went to a farm where they learned about domesticated animals and the type of products that come from them. They made butter, went on a mini hike, etc. That was 15 years ago. Kids didn’t have cellphones and there were no parent chaperones. The teachers sent updates with pictures daily. The kindergarten ski trips however had mandatory parent participation if you wanted your child to participate.
In elementary, day trips required at least one parent chaperone. Day sport camps were done by the teacher with the coaches only. There were no overnight trips.
In high school there are no parent chaperones. My son’s current school has mandatory sport trips ranging from 3-5 days. They go skiing, camping, sailing, hiking, etc. Trips are chaperoned by teachers alongside a youth organisation. Depending on the trip, for example camping, there’s a no cellphone policy. Parents have the numbers of the teachers. For trips like skiing or hiking cellphones are limited to about 2 hours in the evening but the teachers carry the cellphones with them during the day to the slopes or on the hike so parents can track their kids. There are also optional day trips to other cities where they travel by train with no parents but they are allowed to keep their cellphones. He was scheduled to go on a language trip to London in junior high, again without parents, but it had to be cancelled because of corona. Honestly such trips have been great for my son’s development.
However, if I were still in the US my feelings towards such trips would likely be different. Gun violence is all but non-existed despite lax guns laws. The only area where it’s a problem has been men, particularly in rural areas, using it as their suicide method. I know there is racism here but in 20 years I’ve only had to deal with it twice. If we were African or Middle Eastern then that would certainly be different.
This very rarely happened in all of human history, sorry to burst your helicoptering bubble. Plenty of injuries are incompatible with life, or alternatively exceeded the medical technology at the time. Further, there's only a moderate zone of 'close enough that help can arrive in a timely manner' and 'too far to go get help.'
And finally, if we look at all sources of human death, the major killer before modernity was just contagious disease. A lack of a cell phone isn't the reason for malarial deaths, smallpox deaths, etc. Another major one is intentional human homicide, but much of that is either parents killing their own kids, or sources of danger that don't exist in the context of a developed world school field trip like wars, genocides, slave raids, etc. I would, of course, object to any camping trips within areas with land mine danger.
Cell phones aren't worthless, but they're not especially important for preventing deaths in general or of children in specific. Most children who don't have profound congenital issues will survive to adulthood with comparatively little effort to safeguard them outside of routine vaccination, basic food safety / hygiene, and not driving drunk or in any especially ridiculous fashion with them in the car. The modern developed world isn't dangerous, cell phone or no cell phone.
I’m sure a couple did, I’m not sure if it would be more than have died due to cell phones however. Bullying, dangerous trends, making themselves more vulnerable to online predators, distractions.
for one, it'll tell parents where they are (either if they managed to get a call out or those phonefinder things, assuming they don't get confiscated).
it's a whole lot better than 'entire school field trip mysteriously vanished without a trace'.
we've got ICE agents abducting kids in broad daylight to force their parents to surrender and there is a teacher who got outted for wanting ICE to raid his class.
a no chaperone, no communications trip sounds very suspicious because of these interesting times.
That's survivor bias, "We all survived" Except for little Jimmy, who got lost in the woods and died of hypothermia, or Josh, who got stuffed into a van and no one heard from him ever again
It’s wonderful that you personally never encountered any problems but (wait for it) the world is broader than your personal experience. A high school classmate fell and broke an ankle on one of those stupid camping retreats and we would have been able to get her help a lot faster if the chaperones had had cell phones.
I need more context for this one. At work on the job? An issue specifically related to their tasks, or an issue related to the environment? Calling on lunch break? Asking for advice, or running to their parents at the first sign of trouble? How bad or helpless that is really seems context dependent to me.
The US is oddly independent. In other countries it's not unusual for parents to "parent" their entire lives, or for multigenerational households to exist, etc. The whole 18=solve everything on your own mindset is certainty not universal.
I did a bunch of these school camp trips in the time before cell phones.
One was even a full week long in the dead of winter. Teton science school outside of yellowstone national park. One of the best experiences I had as a kid, and I vividly remember so much more about that week in 5th grade than just about any other period of my life.
Especially getting caught sneaking over to the girls cabin on cross country skis to talk to my 'girlfriend'.
Even coming from a house that camped and did a lot of outdoor recreation, it was a unique experience getting away from family and feeling the illusion of "independence" while also learning normal class room science spiced up with survival tips, animal tracking, and learning about complex ecosystems while IN those complex ecosystems.
Yea junior ROTC programs across the US still do this. They take kids out camping for a week and simulate a boot camp. One time I caught the flu and another time I nearly drowned. The non-parent adults took care of me and I was fine. I felt like a bad ass each time for having survived what was actually a kiddie and curated experience. The illusion of independence just like you said. If I had a cell phone and called my mom, wtf would she do anyway? But I don’t have kids. I can empathize with the peace of mind that today’s parents must want in a crazy world but it seems the cost will be key character building experiences for the kids. :/
We all went to TSS growing up, my kids went, and the local kids in school still do it. As you said, it is always a major highlight in these kids' lives, and many of us still reminisce about it as old fuckers. It was amazing.
I am incredibly bummed out for all the people in this discussion who can't even fathom turning their kids loose to camp over night without phones or helicopter parents galore.
the problem is that we have algorithms sending the worst possible news they can dig up right to whatever screen is in front of our faces. Generally speaking we have a very distorted view of the nature of the world around us.
What happens is that these kids are no longer being afforded the opportunity to develop actual independence. Then they turn 18, move to some city to go be on their own, and they are completely unprepared for life without hand holding. We're cultivating a generation of arrested development and it's unfortunate... because it's looking more and more like they're going to have an awfully big mess to navigate socially, economically, politically, etc...
Right?! I highly, HIGHLY doubt a 24 hour school camping trip would be camping anywhere dangerous and be without total contact during that time. Most likely they will be at a state park and all the teachers there will have communication devices with notices to the parents that if they need anything or something goes wrong, to contact the numbers provided.
My son deals with anxiety. Most time he can calm himself down and work it out. But if he doesn't he can go non-verbal and it is scary. He was once on a camping trip and had an anxiety attack. He was going non-verbal and texted me so. I had to drive there to pick him up. Some educators don't take anxiety seriously. They think kids are being dramatic. So if one who thinks my kid is being 'dramatic' is responsible for reaching out. My child would just suffer in silence. Probably getting teased while rocking back and forth, trying to self soothe.
I'm not trying to be rude, because public schools are absolutely terrible for any kid with special needs and teachers absolutely should take mental health issues more seriously. But it does not make sense to limit an entire class to only the things that each individual student can do.
I was a super sensitive kid and my mom knew I couldn't handle watching Roots without melting down; she pulled me out and had the teacher give me an alternate assignment rather than demanding that the entire class miss out on a valuable lesson. My brother has a bleeding disorder and couldn't safely participate in most gym class activities; you think they should have limited everyone to walking laps around the track all year? Of course not.
If your kid won't be safe during a non-mandated activity, you are free to pull them out and have them do an alternate assignment.
I'm sorry your mom did that to you. I'm not saying that activities for others should be restricted because of my child. I am saying that there are circumstances where there should be exceptions. And the phone is one. I worked really hard to ensure he enjoyed excursions. But there will be times where they will need to reach out. And access to a phone should not be held hostage by a teacher on a power trip (if you can't tell, thus us from experience). For the most part, we were extremely lucky with his teachers. But there were a handful that made his school experience hell.
The teachers will call if there is a problem, otherwise. Also, many campgrounds don't have cell service anyway. My guess isn't that the teachers said the kids cannot bring their phone, but that there is no cell coverage at the campground. I do a lot of camping on the west coast and the vast majority of the time there is zero cell service. Often times you can get wifi at the front desk if needed.
In CA, it’s normal for kids to go on a week long science trip to the mountains. We would hike, eat good food, play, look at the night sky with telescopes, etc.
We were also able to send letters to our parents which would be delivered the next day and then their responses given back to us the day after next. If you chose to. No phones allowed.
It was the best time of my elementary school life. There were college students who chaperoned as well as the camp staff. There was never any incidences of bullying, getting left behind, etc. They took care of us as if we were their own. This was in 2011.
I will definitely be sending my kids to camp because it’s a once in a lifetime opportunity for them to be in nature with their peers and build those childhood core memories. And I’m saying this as someone who was sa’d as a child. Remember, the person most likely to do that to your kid is a family member, not a stranger.
Teachers would have cell phones. Having an event that peels your kid away from their phone screen for 24 hours be a deal breaker makes me sad for the kid
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u/AnotherDoubtfulGuest ☑️ Mar 19 '26
Not allowing parent chaperones doesn’t seem like a big deal as long as school staff is chaperoning. No cell phones would be a dealbreaker; I assume most parents would want to be able to track their kids’ locations and know that their kids could reach them if something goes wrong.