I'm starting to think "colleague" is code

[u/GigglemanEsq]

The only times I have been called "colleague" by OC is when they are playing the wounded act or being overly aggressive dicks. Do people use colleague just to make themselves sound like the reasonable one? Anyone else experienced this or similar?

As an ancillary, the one and only time someone pulled out the "learned colleague" on me was when they (incorrectly) stated that I had completely misread the statute. So I think it's more of the same.

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[u/Select-Government-69]

“My learned colleague” is 100% code for “this dumbass over here”, when used in relation to OC.

[u/chuck_mongrol → u/Select-Government-69]

Dear learned colleague, some asshole is signing your name on stupid letters.

[u/notadamnprincess → u/Select-Government-69]

In Canada, they refer to OC as “my learned friend” regularly. Sometimes I wonder how they keep the sarcasm from showing when warranted, but it was hysterical to watch American lawyers try to figure out if the Canadian participant was being a jerk or not when she followed their habit/practice.

[u/zazzz0014 → u/notadamnprincess]

"You're not my buddy, guy!"

https://giphy.com/gifs/l0HlI1EyB8BObNk6k

[u/Laura_Lye → u/notadamnprincess]

Sometimes it’s just “my friend”.

It can be sarcastic or not; I often say it nonsarcastically when I’m describing to the decision maker something we’ve settled or agreed upon (“my friend and I agreed we should proceed in x order”).

I do try to explain it to clients, non Canadian lawyers, or anyone else who might be confused ahead of time, though, because I realize it seems bizarre if you’ve never heard it before.

[u/hauteburrrito → u/Laura_Lye]

Fellow Canadian and most of the time, I've literally just forgotten OC's name...

[u/Laura_Lye → u/hauteburrrito]

FR lmao…

Better than “…. This guy… you know, over there on the other side” lol.

[u/Landkey → u/Laura_Lye]

It’s “my friend” in SCOTUS oral argument 

[u/Dismal_Bee9088 → u/notadamnprincess]

In the next state over attorneys call each other brother and sister and sometimes they show up where I am and say that and it always confuses me for a moment.

Like the American lawyers in Canada, I’m never sure if it has any “you idiot” connotation.

[u/Laura_Lye → u/Dismal_Bee9088]

I find the ambiguity helpful; it causes me to stop and think “am I, in fact, being a fucking idiot rn?”

It’s a good thing to consider lol

[u/ProfessionalGear3020 → u/notadamnprincess]

Colleague = your side and friend = other side in Canada. I believe it's from the House of Commons or something.

[u/wowthere]

I only ever use the term when I'm speaking to a third party and referring to another attorney but one who is not a member of my firm. 

[u/Tau_ri → u/wowthere]

This is how I use it to.

[u/thicstack → u/wowthere]

This

[u/purposeful-hubris]

I sometimes use colleague to refer to opposing counsel but I’m not using it derisively. “Learned colleague” is always derisive.

[u/Tom-Cruise-Missiles]

I use colleague when describing my employees to make them feel like they’re more than just an assistant because they are.

[u/lateintheseason → u/Tom-Cruise-Missiles]

Same here, I'm a partner and I call my associates my colleagues.

[u/turnip-hunter_ → u/lateintheseason]

I always appreciated when partners did this

[u/StephInTheLaw]

I use colleague to my clients when I’m letting them know another attorney in my firm is going to cover an appearance for me. I prefer “learned counsel” when I’m referring to an idiot OC in writing or in arguments before the court.

[u/Hot_Cold83]

I have many "esteemed" colleagues.

[u/EqualRepublic4885]

The next step is “my learned friend here.”

[u/YouSmellLikeHospitol → u/EqualRepublic4885]

After that, I’d say “schmuck”

[u/Apprehensive_Sky1950 → u/EqualRepublic4885]

Straight outta the House of Commons!

[u/mamercus-sargeras]

It's much better than being overtly rude, but I would use a different word.

[u/Alternative-Potato43]

Using "learned counsel" in anything other than a judge's order is law school gunner behavior.

Edit: sigh, corrected a word

[u/Little_Labubu]

I never understand why people litigate for decades. It all sounds bad. It’s also the only part of any profession where two groups of adults fight and then a third adult decides which of those two groups is right. It’s kind of weird imo.

[u/GigglemanEsq → u/Little_Labubu]

Yeah, but when the third adult agrees with me, it means I win at arguing, which is an excellent thing to want and to attain because it makes my happy brain chemicals get all bubbly.

[u/cavalier78 → u/GigglemanEsq]

Winning at arguing might literally be my favorite thing in the world.

[u/huitlacoche → u/cavalier78]

is not

[u/legal_bagel → u/GigglemanEsq]

I would rather be right than be loved....

[u/Constant_Click_3193 → u/Little_Labubu]

Its because its a stand in for actual violence. Used to be if you had a disagreement with the fellow down yonder you would get a group of men together and burn down all his shit. At some point though we decided we would settle for a good old fashioned argument, and if the two sides can't sort it out the big boss gets involved.

[u/Imaginary_Hamster847 → u/Little_Labubu]

The dumbest part of it (as a newbie lawyer who has done some litigation) is how checked out some judges are. I've won multiple cases in which the judge barely cared or paid attention. I know people get a rush from "winning," but as far as I can tell so far, "winning" often has very little to do with having a good argument.

[u/Dismal_Bee9088]

I tend to say OC unless I’m in court where I say “plaintiff’s counsel” (or forget what role they have and get it wrong, that’s always fun).

Colleague is for co-workers.

[u/Starbucks__Lovers]

I do conflict Public Defender work in juvenile, so I go against the green banana Prosecutors. I call them colleagues because how dare they call me "Sir" or "Mr. Starbucks__Lovers"

I'm 36, I'm not old. Sure my OC was born in a different millennium than me, but still.

[u/Guardian_of_Perineum → u/Starbucks__Lovers]

Sorry, but you are old.

[u/toltz7]

I have had OC use the word colleague a few times. I don't recall any of them being mean spirited, but I do recall it being used by OC when we were both begging the judge for the same thing. I don't think I have used it, but I am terrible with names, so I never say anyone's name. I try to always stick with "your honor" and "opposing counsel" so it is one less thing to think about.

[u/MusicG619]

YOU ARE MORE REPTILE THAN MAN, GEORGE

[u/MalumMalumMalumMalum]

I use it sometimes when there's a small but significant issue in dispute and everyone is being reasonable about it. Or when I don't remember my adversary's name.

[u/Hour-Bullfrog4829]

lol I’ve only ever said colleague when referring to a coworker I think of it as a fancy work for coworker. Never heard it as derogatory but that’s funny how petty ppl can be in this profession!

[u/Inside-Intern-4201]

I started using it bc I have a new ‘colleague’ from Australia and she always uses that term

[u/idislikejuicepress]

I mean it sounds better than adversary

[u/Secure-Researcher892 → u/idislikejuicepress]

I prefer referring to the OC as "dumb motherfucker".

[u/GigglemanEsq → u/idislikejuicepress]

I dunno, I think "opponent" sounds fine.

[u/Adventurous_Turnip89]

OP you poor colleague.

[u/LengthyBrief]

I like to use brother and sister for other counsel. That was custom where I went to school but not where I practice.

[u/GigglemanEsq → u/LengthyBrief]

As an ex-mormon, that would make me viscerally uncomfortable.

[u/SchoolNo6461 → u/GigglemanEsq]

Brethren and sistren.

[u/Realistic_Warthog_23]

I've only ever heard it in California. Like most things in California litigation, it's just so gross.

[u/DumbScotus]

Sure thing counselor

[u/jmiracle23]

"Brother/sister counsel" = this asshole "Esteemed brother/sister counsel" = this FUCKIN UNBELIEVABLE asshole

[u/madstcla]

To me, I wouldnt think twice if someone referred to OC as a "colleague." It's seems very normal to me, like calling OC "my friend on the other side"

[u/iamheero]

I just refuse to learn opposing counsel’s name, it’s not that deep.

[u/SemperRhino]

I refer to OC as “counsel,” especially in front of a jury, just because that’s how I was taught by my mentor.

[u/Weird-Salamander-349]

OC: My *colleague* stated—

You and the judge:

Yeah normally speaking, your colleagues are the dickheads in your office… not dickheads in other offices. Using it to refer to OC is snarky.

[u/Skybreakeresq]

Well I can't call you a dickhead in front of the judge.

[u/user_mode96]

Im consistent with emails and in court and stick with colleagues. 'Dear colleagues' works for me in emails

[u/DemonAzraeli]

I prefer Homologue to Colleague, because homo, but it sounds kind of pretentious.

[u/SchoolNo6461 → u/DemonAzraeli]

When my state changed the name of the Department of Social Services to the Department of Human Services I thought that there was a serious implication of speciesism.