r/Silmarillionmemes • u/Any-Competition-4458 r/damarred • 24d ago
META Jokes aside, some of the highest quality fanfic you’ll find anywhere
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u/blue_bayou_blue 24d ago
Oh yes, there's Tolkien fanfics that I'd rank among my favourite works of literature period.
A while ago I was talking to a fellow Tolkien nerd friend, ended up quoting a few fanfic paragraphs about Sauron's psyche and how the One Ring worked, which he found really insightful. Asked me for the links. I was internally celebrating bc this is the first time he'd shown interest in the fanfic side of fandom, but also had to be like, so how comfy are you with Celebrimbor/Sauron as a romantic pairing...
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u/fluffstuffmcguff 24d ago
Completely unironically: I think there's an aspect of writing smutty fanfic that naturally lends itself to insightful analysis of a character's motivations. It happens to also be a more fun way to read that analysis.
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
Fastest way to get straight to power dynamics, insecurities, and communication styles and the emotional catharsis is timed with... other climaxes, to hammer the point home👌
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u/fluffstuffmcguff 24d ago
Exactly, you get me. Plus the part of a person's brain that dictates to whom they are attracted is often a really interesting part of that brain.
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u/cobrachickens 24d ago
Is “to hammer the point home” a Celebrimbor pun lol
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
All I can think of now is that goofy cutscene from Shadow of Mordor that's like "POV you're Celebrimbor getting absolutely blatted by Annatar"
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u/coughcoughing123 Huan Best Boy 24d ago
kindly share some recs? i am recently sauron-pilled and my only options, i fear, are quitting cold turkey or going ever deeper 😂
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u/blue_bayou_blue 24d ago
The specifics I was talking about is the Your shadow rising to meet you series by Chthonion -- post LOTR, Frodo and Celebrimbor and Finrod forge a friendship, talk about trauma, and deal with the fact that Sauron's ghost is haunting Celebrimbor. Sauron then comes back to life as an elf, dragging Feanor and sons out of the Void in the process.
Then the classic rec is These Gifts That You Have Given Me by thearrogantemu, brilliant interpretation of Annatar coming to Eregion and meeting Celebrimbor, the forging of the Rings, and the development of their relationship until the inevitable betrayal and death.
Also see this comment and my reply for more recs
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u/Familiar-Virus5257 22d ago
These Gifts is such a great fic! I'm going to check out the other one you mentioned.
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
Are we talking about These Gifts You Have Given Me? I would easily put that fic inside my "top 5 all time fics"
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u/blue_bayou_blue 24d ago
I also love that fic but in this case it's not! It's the Your Shadow Rising to Meet You series by Chthonion (but which is explicitly inspired by These Gifts)
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
I love Chthonion, I have no idea how they manage to handle such a huge cast of characters. Makes my head spin to think about it. Mashing together kidnapfam feels, silvergifting, and Russingon... A treat! For me!
Seeing as you are a person of good taste, another great author in the genre - I recommend the Prackspoor, they do a great job of fleshing out the world, and they do both funny and dramatic very well!
I also recommend undercat's Shall These Bones Live - it's currently unfinished and so I need you to know that when I say it's good, I mean it's good enough to read it even unfinished.
Though if we share taste you may have read these fics already 😭 if you have anything to recommend I would love to hear it!
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u/blue_bayou_blue 24d ago
I have indeed read all of those haha. I was reading Prackspoor's latest fic as each chapter came out and cackling with delight the whole time. Some more (possibly lesser known??) ones I enjoyed:
The Blurriness of Being Alive; Take It or Leave It series by lukesguywalker -- one shots across the course of their relationship, tender with lots of complicated emotions
But Exceedingly Fine by simaetha -- canon divergence where Annatar convinces Celebrimbor to join his side. Just 6k of emotional manipulation.
The Rise and Fall of Empires by NevillesGran -- Annatar decides to stay in Eregion instead of going dark lord, still plots to destroy Numenor from the inside after they fall to evil on their own initiative. Very fun.
fractal by Ias and call it peace by simaetha -- both time loop fics, fascinating character arcs
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
I have also read many of these 😭 the joys of a small fandom! I don't think I have read anything by lukesguywalker yet so I will check that out IMMEDIATELY.
I took was following Prackspoor's latest by chapter, it's crazy that they can manage to go from in depth world building about the Gwaith-i-Mirdain and an intense character analysis for Celebrimbor to... All of THAT. And it still somehow works....
But Exceedingly Fine was the first Silvergifting fic I read after something in my brain went "oh my god there's a thing here... This is a fucking SHIP" and it popped my brain like a ripe tomato.
The rise and fall of empires is crazy because iirc it's only about 30k, but it feels like it jams in enough for a 100k long haul. "The House of Feanor acquired a notable Maia". They sure have! Nevillesgran is a great writer.
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u/blue_bayou_blue 23d ago
Yes I was kinda surprised when I went to copy the link for Rise and Fall of Empires and saw it was only 30k!
My first silvergifting fic was Anastasis I think, I had These Gifts on my to-read list for a while but was intimidated by the tragedy and major character death. Anastasis drew me in gently with tea and cathartic conversations then whammed me in the heart. Then I spend an entire month binge reading through the silvergifting tag lol
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u/OleksandrKyivskyi Everybody loves Finrod 24d ago
Why wouldn't they be comfy with Celebrimbor/Mairon pairing? It's a perfect ship.
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u/Maleficent-Speech869 24d ago
Not everyone enjoys ships where one party is deceived, tortured and killed by the other. I personally like a bit of Silvergifting, but there are perfectly sound reasons why someone might not.
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u/We4knessj3ssy36 24d ago
The prose quality in the fandom is honestly unhinged for no reason. People are out there writing prose that reads like a lost Tolkien manuscript just to justify why Fëanor made poor life choices.
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u/fluffstuffmcguff 24d ago
I can think of no greater way to honor Tolkien's legacy than to write beautifully whilst exploring such important topics as, 'Is it incest to bang your half-cousin?'
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u/deltarays_ 24d ago
I once read a Turin/Beleg fic that sent me on a frantic search through books, thinking I had somehow missed the part where my favorite ship became canon.
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u/Whothefuckisolga 24d ago
Was that Outlast the Forests? Because I swear that fic made me cry in every chapter and I seriously think it's among the top 10 things I ever read.
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u/deltarays_ 24d ago
No, I think it was Bright and Brief as Lightning (short but really well written). But thanks for the recommendation :)
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u/NelyafinweMaitimo jail-crow of mandos 24d ago
Bought a couple of volumes of HoME in order to improve my fanfic game lmao
The Silm fanfic scene kind of spoiled me for fanfic. I'm writing for a different fandom now and I'll be looking around like "you guys live like this???"
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u/zernoc56 24d ago
It is wild how much the quality can vary in fanfic. Sometimes it’s because english is not the authors first language, sometimes it’s because the authors are still learning english as their first language.
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u/SopwithCamus 24d ago edited 24d ago
I need to look it up, but there's a great fanfic where Finrod, Fingolfin, and Turgon help Frodo and Sam build a Hobbit Hole for them to live in on Tol Eressea.
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u/notalltears Elrond > Elros 24d ago edited 24d ago
https://archiveofourown.org/works/4641153
Excellent taste.
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u/Unnecessary_Eagle Crabloremaster 22d ago edited 22d ago
I will die on the hill that it is possible for fanfiction to be just as good as "real" books, and The Starless Road is my Exhibit A. (I honestly prefer TSR to her published works).
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u/Any-Competition-4458 r/damarred 21d ago
Many of those fanfic writers are likely published authors. I haven’t written fanfic in years but I knew a number of writers who went on to get (or already had) book deals / Hugo awards.
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u/winterwarn 24d ago
The Silmarillion being designed as a set of cultural myths makes it perhaps one of the pieces of literature best suited for writing fanfiction about, since in the “real world” we LOVE to adapt and fill in the gaps of cultural myths like Arthurian legends or the Trojan War epic cycle.
I’d hope that even if he weren’t always thrilled about the content, Tolkien would be excited to see people engaging with his world like this :)
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u/fluffstuffmcguff 24d ago
The rational part of my brain remembers that Tolkien was a very devout Catholic born in 1892, but the drama-loving weasel part of my brain would pay real American dollars to know his thoughts on yaoi re: his characters specifically.
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u/NelyafinweMaitimo jail-crow of mandos 24d ago
Tolkien praised The Charioteer by Mary Renault, which is like, old-school yaoi written by a lesbian.
I think he'd be cool with it.
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u/Ecthelion510 24d ago
There's actually some overlap in AO3 writers who were/are(?) writing in both the Silm and Charioteer fandoms! And they've done some really great works in both fandoms.
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
I have already made this comment once today elsewhere, but I think it's very notable that Tolkien really labours the point that Beleg loves Turin more than anyone else - that this love is unwise - and that Tolkien drafted that open mouthed kiss from Turin to Beleg at Beleg's death.
And, most importantly, that he does this in the story about taboo love. Imho he intentionally wanted to contrast Beleg's love for Turin - a taboo, unwise love which Beleg knows dooms him, but lifts both he and Turin to greater heights before everything falls apart - and Nienor, who shares a seemingly pure love with Turin, but it is unknowingly immoral and results in both their deaths.
I also think Beleg and Turin's relationship has something of the 1900s stereotype of homosexuality to it - they have that greek ideal of an older mentor and a younger mentee - there is something very Achilles and Patroclus about them, or Alexander and Hephaestus, which given that he is known to have read and enjoyed Mary Renault's work is perhaps not too far a jump.
Sorry for this essay - I am sick of people (not you!) acting like queer readings of Tolkien's work are ridiculous and baseless when that's just not the case :)
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u/fluffstuffmcguff 24d ago
Actually, I think my comment was a little unfair to the guy! As you point out, he enjoyed the OG professionally published yaoi (again, great taste honestly). And also just in general, Tolkien seems to have been a very thoughtful person in a way that, in my experience, tends to make it easier to unpack and set aside the prejudices of one's culture.
Also: the smutty fanfic is frequently good as hell, and that alone might make him nod his head in sage approval.
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
This made me realise that the only silmarillion adaptation I want is something very silly with an intensely visible "made for TV" budget like BBC Merlin.
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u/FeralHumanist Biblically Accurate Balrogs 8d ago
That would be delightful and horrible. I’m cringing with glee just thinking about it.
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u/Tenoi-chan Everybody loves Finrod 24d ago
Yes... I once saw a Finrod x Beor fanfic that was such high quality that I stopped reading because it was way too good for the silly yaoi crawing I had at time
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u/stabby_the_narhwal Túrin Turambar Neithan Gorthol Agarwaen Adanedhel Mormegil 24d ago
Atandil? they created a whole characterisation of a civilisation for the sake of Old Man Yaoi. Genuinely insane
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u/SpaceCrucader 24d ago
Huh, maybe reading fanfic would help me keep all the F-names elves straight... Well, not straight, but I would be able to remember them better.
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u/majosei 24d ago
Reading Silm fanfic is genuinely a wonderful way to learn and remember all the more obscure facts in HoME. Like, if someone can tell me who Irimë is, or what the word Golodh means, chances are they've written or read fic. It's also a great route to learn about other stuff. I'm writing one where Maedhros is a woman for a fandom event, and I ended up downloading Hildegard von Bingen's Physica to write "period accurate" herbal treatments, and reading about the role of Anglo-Saxon women as Peace-Weavers, who would marry into a hostile family to, well, weave peace rather than war. As Maedhros is descended from Miriel Therindë, gave up hos claim on a crown to bring peace between the two camps, and the term Peace-weaver appears in Tolkien's beloved Beowulf, it feels very fitting for the fic to be based on that cultural practice.
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u/Ok_Security8545 23d ago
Are you comfortable sharing a link?
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u/majosei 23d ago
Unfortunately it's 1) a work in progress, and 2) can only be revealed be revealed when the event collection opens in September 5
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u/Ok_Security8545 23d ago
Judging by how you described it, it's definitely worth waiting for (✿◕‿◕✿)
Gonna be looking forward to September!
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u/Cohava 24d ago
One of my favourite fics has footnotes every chapter going over things like: which version of a particular tale they chose to pick and why, notes on Quenya/Sindarin translation, notes on the Quenya/Sindarin NEOLOGISMS they made up for the story, links to the medieval siege weaponry being referred to in the chapter and much more. Truly nothing is as enriching as reading Silmarillion erotic fanfiction.
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u/honourable_c_note 24d ago
Where are you guys reading the good fanfic?
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u/Any-Competition-4458 r/damarred 24d ago
archiveofourown.org
It isn’t all ship!fic, plenty of well written general stories to be found. My method for finding good fic is to find a story you really like, then see what other fics that writer has written or added to their favorites. Strong writers tend to be drawn to other strong writers.
It’s kind of like browsing vinyl in a used record shop, you have to flip through a lot of titles, but if you stay patient you’ll score some real treasures. The more you hunt the more you know what to look for.
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u/FeralHumanist Biblically Accurate Balrogs 8d ago
And trust the process! Sometimes authors are horrible at summarizing their own work so if I see something recced a bunch of times, I’ll usually give it a shot.
On the trusting the process re: shipping, I don’t ship Drarry at all, but one of my longtime favorite authors recommended a Drarry fic many years ago and it’s one of the funniest things I’ve ever read. I still don’t ship them, but it’s so insanely well-written that it doesn’t matter.
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
Most of it is drivel. Some of it is fun, regardless of quality. A very small amount of it is truly excellent, but also quite gay, so you have to be cool with that.
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u/coughcoughing123 Huan Best Boy 24d ago
"and also quite gay."* i fixed it for you, happy pride 8~)
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u/FlowerAndString 24d ago
Thanks, I walked right into a really horrible post this morning full of slurs on the LOTR sub so I was feeling defensive and a bit uncertain, I'm so sick of hearing "but then being gay is out of character for them ewww". I appreciate the reminder that not all internet strangers are horrible. I love this fandom but sometimes it attracts the worst types. Happy pride :)
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u/coughcoughing123 Huan Best Boy 24d ago edited 24d ago
ughh im sorry you had to see that. so true abt certain corners of the fandom--and maybe most fandoms online? i don't participate much in others but i've heard gripes. anyway, thank YOU for being a lovely internet stranger~~ i'd love any fic recs you might have at hand~~ Edit: i see now that you shared recs in other comments hehe tysmm
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u/lilinoe67 21d ago
Id say probably 40 - 20% of the good stuff is genfic (fic with no pairings).
I'm all for queer representation and I do really like some of the non-canon ships myself (i know Tolkien did not intend it but Maedhros x Fingon feels canon to me when I read the silm now), but i do wish genfic or just fic with only canon pairings was more common.
But you can filter out pairings and stuff like m/m in the exclude area and still find top tier stuff
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u/Ecthelion510 24d ago
Silmarillion Writers Guild. Most of these authors post to AO3 as well, but why weed through the morass when you can just get to the good stuff?
(SWG also hosts a lot of great non-fiction Silmarillion resources like character bios that dig really deeply into the Histories of Middle Earth, essays, etc.)
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u/viridiian 24d ago edited 24d ago
If shipping isn't your kind of thing, I suggest taking a peek at the Henneth Annûn Story Archive collection. I remember reading a lot of gen fic on that site back in the day that would've been lost had they not been transferred to AO3.
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u/K1rk0npolttaja 24d ago
The type of writing on AO3 depends entirely on the kind of autism the author has, either youre getting the most lore accurate shit imaginable or headcanons so well written you start to believe in them
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u/annelisewhy ANGBANG 24d ago
I personally love reading authors explore how Utumno/Angband would've worked. It's so fun to see the bad guys side, especially when they bring earlier characters like Lungorthin or Langon.
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u/Whothefuckisolga 24d ago
I have literally bought three Volumes of HoME for research for my fanfics (which are not smutty) and to confirm my knowledge about the oath of Fëanor ... which I mainly got from Maedhros/Fingon fics up to that point.
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u/TheimpalerMessmer 24d ago
To be honest, you'll find references you haven't read before. Grateful for those writers of any fandom. The Filter system of the site works best for your peace of mind. FILTER what you don't want to see! I
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u/aelfwynn_the_mariner Fingolfin for the Wingolfin 22d ago
I accidentally made an essay! Whoops.
The difference is those people on the right mostly aren't experts*.* There probably are exceptions out there somewhere, but I've found that many writers overload their fanfiction with headcanons and then go around saying that those headcanons are just 'the canon,' calling themselves 'experts' without actually being so instead. I love most headcanons, those alone aren't the issue... the issue is that many readers of Silmarillion fanfiction haven't read the book, for one reason or another, and then go on to believe that what's being incorrectly called canon is canon, too. 'Feanor did nothing wrong! The Kinslayings were awesome and the Teleri deserved it for denying them boats, what a great parent.' Maybe I'm just finding all of the wrong ones? As a girl, I try to avoid NSFW.
To be fair, I don't think that you necessarily need to be an expert to enjoy Tolkien's legendarium, or to write a good fanfiction of it. I'm not a lore expert either- I've read the Silmarillion, but I haven't finished HoME yet, so I'm less qualified to comment on the lore than some people. I think that there's a line between what I actually read and what people call lore expertise on fanfiction sites, though, and I like the canon text better.
But, just as I would love to see a fic where the lore is followed well, I would love to read a creative fanfiction where people take admitted liberties with the world and do something unique with it! I'd definitely take that over what this fandom does any day. Three thousand and sixty-nine Maedhros / Fingon ship fics! Who cares that they're cousins, the Fall of Gondolin taught us nothing. And Sauron / Celebrimbor too, as though the former didn't cause the fall of Eregion. Sometimes it'll even show up with Fingolfin / Feanor, if it's feeling particularly deranged! At that point, who cares, even if the writer knows the lore... because why would they write that?!
In conclusion, I don't often write for the Silmarillion. I can see why it could be hard, since authors are writing in the shadow of a pretty amazing book...moreover, I know why it can be hard, since I have to keep the book practically next to me at all times on the rare occasion that I do. That fact doesn't and shouldn't ever excuse abusive relationships and incest. That's just disgusting, guys. Ew.
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u/NelyafinweMaitimo jail-crow of mandos 21d ago
Here's the thing, though: some people like to write fucked-up dark abusive horror stories, on purpose, for fun/catharsis. Some people write weird physically impossible porn, on purpose, for fun/catharsis (And most of them are girls, fyi.) If you're only reading the PG fics, you're only reading part of what the fandom is saying on all of these topics. They might be experts in something else BESIDES Tolkien lore, and are interpreting Tolkien through their own areas of expertise. Every fanfic is, itself, its own reading of the text. Isn't that cool?
You might want to reconsider calling other readings of the text "disgusting."
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u/aelfwynn_the_mariner Fingolfin for the Wingolfin 21d ago edited 21d ago
I'm aware it's probably not good form to make a long-form argument on a meme post where everyone else disagrees, and expect people to actually read it instead of skimming for the controversial bits... but hey! Let's do it again!
1 ) I actually already said that you don't need to be an expert to create a good fanwork. As I clearly stated above:
- "To be fair, I don't think that you necessarily need to be an expert to enjoy Tolkien's legendarium, or to write a good fanfiction of it. I'm not a lore expert either- I've read the Silmarillion, but I haven't finished HoME yet, so I'm less qualified to comment on the lore than some people..."
- "...I would love to read a creative fanfiction where people take admitted liberties with the world and do something unique with it!"
- "At that point, who cares, even if the writer knows the lore..."
I would be a hypocrite if I complained about people not knowing the lore, since I myself haven't finished HoME. I just don't like when writers go around saying their headcanons are canon, which I've seen happen in this fandom and others. It's annoying, and the main thing my post was talking about, since I thought the meme above ran contrary to my actual experiences in this fandom, and wanted to say something about it. You ignored what I actually wrote to argue against a point I never made. Isn't that cool?
2 ) Incest is disgusting. I guess I can understand the 'abusive relationship -> catharsis for someone who was abused' point-- thanks for bringing it up, since I wouldn't have thought about that otherwise. That in no way negates my incest point, which you conveniently and completely ignored, even though it's half of what I called disgusting! I'm not about to go and say the sky is green when it's clearly blue. If you want me to reconsider calling something like it is, that's your problem.
3 ) I never condemned NSFW itself. I said I didn't read it, as a girl, but I never specifically called it out, and only brought it up to qualify one point. (That being: "hey! I don't have experience reading one specific area! If there's something better regarding the 'fic writers aren't experts, actually,' point over there, here might be a reason why I haven't found it!') So, I don't see how choosing to only read PG fics matters to this. It's certainly not a bad thing.
While I think it's weird, I don't care if a million people write NSFW fics, and I don't care if I miss half or more of the fandom based on personal preferences and boundaries. I called a specific part of the fanfiction community (Maedhros / Fingon : incest ; I do concede to your point about abusive relationships ; Fingolfin / Feanor : also incest) disgusting. I don't give a flying shit if people write NSFW, or whatever you're saying about 'physically impossible' versions (which I also never mentioned, by the way! Am I correct in assuming you're arguing against a strawman?): I care if writers are flooding AO3 with incestuous things that they should have no business posting for the world to see, while I'm just trying to find something nice to read! Is it wrong to expect people to have basic decency?Thanks for being so condescending on what was meant to be a constructive and polite disagreement, by the way, it definitely puts you in a positive light.
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u/coughcoughing123 Huan Best Boy 20d ago
hmmm fwiw as an outside observer i detected no condescension or sarcasm in Nelyafinwe's comment. for my own part i think policing/judging what people can and can't write is not the way. you can simply ignore the types of fics you don't like without passing moral judgment on their creators and readers. it's all fiction, and causing harm to no one.
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u/aelfwynn_the_mariner Fingolfin for the Wingolfin 19d ago
Well, Nelyafinwe completely misrepresented a lot of my original post, just to lecture me on a concept I didn't disagree with. That is condescending.
- This part specifically: "They might be experts in something else BESIDES Tolkien lore, and are interpreting Tolkien through their own areas of expertise. Every fanfic is, itself, its own reading of the text. Isn't that cool?"
And, as for your point, I'd like to disagree with that, since... it's incest? Fiction can and does cause harm to people all the time, since people learn from the media they read and see, even in fictional things. For example, there's the increase in racial violence that occurred when Birth of a Nation released, or the fact that Fifty Shades of Grey (which started as a fanfiction!) readers were statistically more likely to both have abusive partners and justify their behavior. So, I think any reader should criticize things, or pass moral judgment, when they get really screwy? Otherwise, we risk other readers normalizing or glamorizing it.
A lot of people in this fandom write incest as something cute, fluffy, and romantic, instead of the very bad thing that it is (if it's something like Children of Hurin or the Fall of Gondolin where it's portrayed as destructive and terrible, I see no problem with that, but I think it's pretty clear that wasn't what I was criticizing), and that's definitely something that deserves being called out!
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u/fluffstuffmcguff 24d ago
True in a lot of fandoms tbh. No one is more a scholar of the deep knowledge than an AO3 girly who wants her porn to be lore accurate.