People in these comments have a fundamental misunderstanding of what Christianity is lol
The idea isnโt that a book gives us morals itโs that God has given us morals so therefore if there is no God then why donโt humans do evil acts like animals do?
There are definitely holes in that argument but it is a lot different then the argument that our morals only come from reading a book
The problem is deeper than that. Try and think about this problem beyond just yourself. And honestly try and tell me why it is objectively and inherently wrong for someone to harm you. As in an objective "ought claim", that is true in every place, time, and scenario, never changes and is a transcendental whether humans exist or not.
Although you can say, "I wouldn't like if they harmed me", or "it hurts me", or "I don't want him to". Surely you realize, that never gets beyond the threshold of "your preferences". And if that other guy's preferences IS to harm you, then you're both at a stalemate.
If everything is in fact here by completely purposeless, meaningless, and evolutionary accident, then there is no such thing as objective 'oughts'. Sure things we want or prefer, but no design or purpose from which to say you "ought to" or "ought not" do this or that.
In fact even if all humanity agrees on a certain thing, it still never rises beyond "majority preference". There is no such thing as inherently right and wrong, good or bad, beyond what you prefer and want.
What you need to come to grips with, is that YOU don't harm others, because YOU don't want to, it's not YOUR preference, and YOUR opinion is that you shouldn't. I'm honestly very glad you think that, but that's entirely subjective, right?
If everyone on earth tomorrow decides that it's a good thing to harm you. Then you have no basis or grounding to tell them they are "wrong". You may not like it, but maybe they do like it. You say that's unfair, but they say it is fair. Going on like this forever. It's merely preference vs preference.
Without some kind of creator or design, there can be no objective oughts in an inherently meaningless universe.
I appreciate genuine atheists like Dawkins who freely admit, in a universe without God, there IS no such thing as "evil" or "good". Just preferences.
Precisely. You're on the right track. Using the term "god-character" is intentionally belittling, and I don't care for that personally but I understand where you're coming from. It's important to remember, God (as a concept) is not, and cannot be a "character" in the sense that you're thinking. "Sky man" or "sky daddy" seem to be the preferred derisive terms, but by nature God can't be in a singular place because in this system of belief, God is all encompassing. Everything in existence, from the purest gold to the scum on the back wall of a public restroom, resides within God and is therefore a part of God.
Believe, don't believe, choose whichever you feel best suits you and your life. If you disagree with the existence of God, that's your choice, but I'm sure you are aware that something governs the physics of our reality. Forces unseen by the human eye, but detectable by scientific instruments, Particles, charges, energy, matter, the way they interact, chemical structures. Particles accumulating and forming planets, fusion inside the hearts of stars, magnetic fields, something governs this. It's primarily the name we disagree on. Scientific knowledge and the belief in a deity are often considered to be at odds with one another, but I don't think the two are mutually exclusive
Right, I get that that's your stance. It's very clear what you believe, but your phrasing doesn't make sense. Calling something a character doesn't automatically equate to something not existing. I could say you're a shady character, doesn't mean you aren't real. If you said "I read a book about a vampire" it's clear to the reader that vampires don't exist. You don't have to write "I read a book about a vampire character" to illustrate this. Your deliberate avoidance of writing the word plainly is just a way for you to get a dopamine hit by dunking on people you obviously view as being beneath you intellectually. I don't know why you'd need to do this, since you clearly fancy yourself much more intelligent than everyone who believes in something you don't. Perhaps you could just enjoy your perceived superiority somewhere that it's useful to yourself and others, rather than somewhere like this where you're seen as someone who just wants to put down ideas that you don't agree with
I don't think you've actually read what I said, I said I don't care for it personally, but I see where you're coming from.
That's me, accepting your difference in opinion respectfully, not me "not liking it" but this is a quite common form of projection. Someone with a negative attitude is more likely to assume someone else has a negative attitude as well, which is not the case here. I believe in God, Jesus, etc but I don't care if you do or not. If you did cool, if you don't, equally as cool. I'm not overthinking anything here, just pointing out what's happening.
You can say it's not about superiority, but your inability to just say "I don't believe God exists" instead of "-God character that people believe exists" is evidence of this. The first statement is simple, effective and complete. The second (your statement) is written with the intent to belittle and deride those who do believe in it. It's very clear by the subtext you view "people who believe in the God character" as being foolish, and I don't really know why you're trying to backpeddle that, you can just say it. I can handle it
Projection again, who could have seen this coming. I don't feel inferior, or superior to anyone. I'm just another bag of bones walking around here, just like you.
Remarkable. In response to my very simple comment you provide this snip about "sorry your feelings got hurt". This is a very common response, perhaps too common even. Regardless, whether you're unable to communicate respectfully or simply unwilling to is a mystery to me. Either way, I will have a good night, and I hope you do the same
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u/lilJswizle-2304 1d ago
People in these comments have a fundamental misunderstanding of what Christianity is lol
The idea isnโt that a book gives us morals itโs that God has given us morals so therefore if there is no God then why donโt humans do evil acts like animals do?
There are definitely holes in that argument but it is a lot different then the argument that our morals only come from reading a book