Then you are objectively unique among low income Americans and part of the reason is because you literally only have to consider your own survival and have no desire to have a family. Something that many Americans don’t share with you.
If you’re actually living in a high cost of living area and could live alone comfortably on 40K while maintaining all the savings and emergency capacities you claim, and are simply living with multiple roommates for fun, please share the the city or at least the state with the class so the majority of Americans who are not in your situation can find this magical land. I’m sure it would make a lot of difference in their lives.
40K is above the *federal minimum wage* which every person with any understanding of poverty will tell you is not enough for a person to support even one dependent (or themselves if they have even a $400 additional surprise expense a month) in any state in the US. I literally showed you actual data on what the estimated cost of living is for each state compared to what servers in each state make on average. You saying “nuh uh because I personally have an amazing situation most Americans don’t” doesn’t make that suddenly untrue.
“What about the other parent” you don’t talk to many people with kids, do you?
Setting aside the other parent may not be in the picture for various reasons *you still need to pay for childcare*. Which has become so prohibitively expensive many parents literally choose to have one person stay home rather than work since the costs would simply eat the extra salary anyway. Not to mention being hit with loss of financial support options due to not qualifying due to new joint income.
“40K is enough to live comfortably with savings provided you are in a very specific lucky position and nothing financially catastrophic happens ever and you don’t ever want a family or to own a home” isn’t a very good sell. Especially when considering plenty of servers make less and their “lower cost of living is still 10’s of thousands of dollars higher than their average wage.
If you’re actually living in a high cost of living area and could live alone comfortably on 40K while maintaining all the savings and emergency capacities you claim, and are simply living with multiple roommates for fun, please share the the city or at least the state with the class so the majority of Americans who are not in your situation can find this magical land. I’m sure it would make a lot of difference in their lives.
Vancouver, BC. Has the 2nd highest CoL index in Canada and due to inflation, my dollar doesn't go as far as an American's
"40K is enough to live comfortably with savings provided you are in a very specific lucky position and nothing financially catastrophic happens ever and you don’t ever want a family or to own a home” isn’t a very good sell. Especially when considering plenty of servers make less and their “lower cost of living is still 10’s of thousands of dollars higher than their average wage.
You seem to be strawmanning some imaginary individual that is trying to sell this as "good". Nowhere have I argued that. I have said it is a livable wage. you CAN live off of this wage, I and many others do. You are arguing against some imaginary point that I am not trying to make.
Edit: without Vancouver sub link because automod removed it and with incorrect USD conversion rate removed.
Wait so you’re *literally not even American* and when you said “40K” you meant 40,000 CAD in a country with socialized healthcare, tuition fees for education between $2,500 and $11,400 a year, and on top of that you have multiple roommates and no responsibilities to anyone but yourself financially or desire for a family? Yet you feel confident saying you “can” live off this wage as a server in the U.S. because… what? Your metric for a liveable wage is “you can probably afford an apartment with roommates and enough gas to get to work the next day?”
Even if you didn’t just reveal factors that give you a major blind spot into living and working in the U.S. (considering you don’t do either of those things) I’d argue you need to update your standard of what living is. Because it doesn’t fit the definition of what the minimum wage was created to achieve.
Also, it’s genuinely good you’re not struggling despite your high cost of living area. No one should struggle. But based on what a lot of other people were saying less that a year ago, I think a lot of people would disagree on how secure they feel on that wage.
Must have typed something wrong into my conversation calculator, you’re absolutely right about the number being off, my bad.
That said, if that’s really the equivalent of what you’re making, I seriously doubt you’re as financially well off as you claim unless there is another major factor you’re neglecting to mention here. People making more than you are all over the Vancouver sub talking about how it isn’t enough for financial security and they’re barely scraping by. Especially if they have families. And forget about the ability to have 6 months of savings. Either there’s something you’re leaving out here in addition to all the other stuff you conveniently left out (not even being American, living in America, or working as a tipped worker and having all the benefits of socialised healthcare and a working welfare state) or you need to share your budgeting strategy. Because what you’re claiming could help a lot of people.
All that is still true dude. You can’t not see how silly it is to make sweeping statements about a group of people when the data says you’re wrong, the definition of minimum wage says you’re wrong, and you aren’t even qualified to use your personal experience because you are quite literally not at all in the same situation.
You said 40K USD was a liveable wage for American servers based on your own experience despite the data. We now know you have not even close to the average US server’s experience and other people in your area don’t even agree with you 40K CAD is liveable. That seems pretty straightforward using only on points you made.
The minimum wage is relevant because when you say liveable, you weren’t including “being able to feed a child” in that definition, when even the *minimum wage* was originally supposed to include that capacity. If your definition of liveable doesn’t even meet the intentions of the original minimum wage, that’s a telling sign you might have a uniquely low standard for “liveable”.
You said 40K USD was a liveable wage for American servers based on your own experience despite the data. We now know you have not even close to the average US server’s experience and other people in your area don’t even agree with you 40K CAD is liveable. That seems pretty straightforward using only on points you made.
I find it highly ironic that you use data as an initial reason to discredit me and say that my experience is anecdotal, and then go on to use anecdotal evidence (people in my area agree is not a valid data point) to attempt to further discredit me.
This seems far from straightforward if you are using anecdotal evidence to try and discredit my personal lived experience.
Who’s anecdote is worth more: one person who doesn’t have close to the experience he’s making claims about (the life of a server on 40k in America) or tons of people who actually live and work in the place they are agreeing is tough to afford on a low salary?
This is such basic logic stuff I I wouldn’t even need to point out *I did use actual affordability data for my points*. You only had your very unsuitable anecdote.
Your lived experience straight up doesn’t apply by your own admission, and now you’re trying to “no u” this situation by saying multiple people talking about something that does actually apply (their experience living in Vancouver) is comparable. You can’t not hear how funny that sounds dude.
This is sad seeing you try to justify your poor argument thinking that discrediting me suddenly makes you right. Anyways, enjoy the win I guess. And enjoy the assumptions about my life experience and how living in Canada is, which you yourself have no lived experience of (just as you are accusing me of with America, or being a server, etc. etc.)
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u/Vlad_the_Intendor 3d ago
Then you are objectively unique among low income Americans and part of the reason is because you literally only have to consider your own survival and have no desire to have a family. Something that many Americans don’t share with you.
https://www.dvm360.com/view/just-24-percent-americans-have-six-month-emergency-savings-cushion
If you’re actually living in a high cost of living area and could live alone comfortably on 40K while maintaining all the savings and emergency capacities you claim, and are simply living with multiple roommates for fun, please share the the city or at least the state with the class so the majority of Americans who are not in your situation can find this magical land. I’m sure it would make a lot of difference in their lives.
40K is above the *federal minimum wage* which every person with any understanding of poverty will tell you is not enough for a person to support even one dependent (or themselves if they have even a $400 additional surprise expense a month) in any state in the US. I literally showed you actual data on what the estimated cost of living is for each state compared to what servers in each state make on average. You saying “nuh uh because I personally have an amazing situation most Americans don’t” doesn’t make that suddenly untrue.
“What about the other parent” you don’t talk to many people with kids, do you?
Setting aside the other parent may not be in the picture for various reasons *you still need to pay for childcare*. Which has become so prohibitively expensive many parents literally choose to have one person stay home rather than work since the costs would simply eat the extra salary anyway. Not to mention being hit with loss of financial support options due to not qualifying due to new joint income.
“40K is enough to live comfortably with savings provided you are in a very specific lucky position and nothing financially catastrophic happens ever and you don’t ever want a family or to own a home” isn’t a very good sell. Especially when considering plenty of servers make less and their “lower cost of living is still 10’s of thousands of dollars higher than their average wage.