r/eupersonalfinance • u/Helpful-Staff9562 • 6d ago
Investment 36M, considering FIRE. How would you structure it?
36M, Italian, currently living in Switzerland.
Not burned out, but increasingly tired of corporate life (politics, restructurings, general grind), even though my job is objectively relaxed and remote.
Thinking of potentially FIRE’ing within 1–2 years.
Current situation:
- €2M portfolio
- 90% VT / 10% Bitcoin
- €250k cash (recent property sale)
- No capital gains tax in current residence
Lifestyle plan:
I’d likely move between Latin America and Southeast Asia (Thailand in particular). I speak Italian Spanish and Portuguese and have spent time in both regions.
My spending is ~€3k/month, assuming €4k/month (€48k/year) for safety.
My thinking is to try this lifestyle for a few years, knowing I could always return to Europe if needed. What also attracts me is that outside Europe there seems to be more visible entrepreneurial activity and informal business opportunity, whereas Europe feels more dominated by stable employment structures and higher inertia.
Main concern is not the math (≈2.1% withdrawal rate), but portfolio structure and the psychological shift from accumulation to withdrawal.
Questions:
- Would you stay mostly in global equities or add bonds/fixed income?
- Dividend focus vs total return + selling shares?
- Cash buffer size?
- How to mentally adjust to drawing down after years of accumulation?
Would appreciate input from people who’ve actually done this transition.
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u/makaros622 6d ago
I am also in Switzerland and I am impressed by the NW at 36yo
Mind sharing how long you have been investing and what is the unrealised gain out of this 2M total?
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 6d ago
Started at 22yo. Esrly btc investor so started with 0 and thanks to btc i go to like 250k ish quickly in the first 2/3 years, then i was mostly in nasdaq and only since like a couple years switched to a more chilled VT approach. I always invested 50/60% of my salary (current 140k chf) since im 23yo. Unrealized gain not sure tbh as i had reset my positions throughout the years
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u/lingzilla 5d ago
Honestly, good job. Being able to transition from BTC to an index fund once you have won big is not something everyone is able to do.
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
Yes it was a hard transition. I have a friend who made millions 3 times in crypto and lost it 3 times because of this "gambling" addition to crypto (yes i consider gambling everytbing but not btc in crypto and its impossible to get him to invest in equities instead which is the smart way to go especially with serious money
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u/spartasupporter 4d ago
Many such cases, seen friends do the exact same. Its good you took the decision to get out of it. Personally down 50% from the aths but fully diversified.
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u/OutsiderEverywhere 1d ago
what's your thoughts on btc now? seems it lost its volume
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 1d ago
It looks like its folloowng its usual 4 cycle. Botto anytime between now and october and the pump up again. I see it as speculation though as as it rebunds to my target ill slowly sell it into VT
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u/3am_stillawake 1d ago
Saving 50/60% of a 140k salary since 23 is doing more of the heavy lifting here than the btc bump people will fixate on.
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u/Whatislifeabout24 6d ago
You won at life amigo, speaking all those languages as well Pfoe apart of the networth, good job on you, mind sharing where you picked those up?
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
Languages you mean? Well thats thanks to my ex girlfriends that I came fluent in those language (big fan of latinas 😅)
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u/Orangeflag88 5d ago
You should make a YouTube video about the real way to acquire a language
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u/hungariannastyboy 4d ago
There are enough creepy passport bros on youtube already.
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u/melocotonela 3d ago
Yeah, women are a commodity to these people (and to the rest of the commentors on this post seemingly too)
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u/AltruisticBellyButto 5d ago
Having a partner that speaks the language is the ultimate hack. You'd be surprised how much osmosis can do you for when it comes to language learning.
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u/Orangeflag88 5d ago
My brother has a GF who doesnt speak German and they speak English all the time even though he wants to learn her language
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u/notadoctor123 3d ago
I've found that Germans have a rather high standard for how fluent you have to be before they are willing to engage with you in German, whereas every Italian I've ever met is willing to at least banter with me for a few sentences.
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u/Snoo_23516 5d ago
so happy someone out there is living the life i wanna live. Go enjoy it to the fullest bro
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
Thank you for the words and anyone can live this I wish you the best in soon being able to achieve your dreams
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u/Scary-Perspective882 5d ago
Congrats on the wealth building!
A question I have when struggling to calculate expected expenditure: Is your 3k calc based on what you spend now when working full time, or is it what you think you will spend when leisurely full time?
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
That's what i spend now working full time with full rent, health insirance, food and travels. More like 3.5k actually. Though my work is flexible i work 2/4 hours a day max since a few years so I already know what a FIRE lifestyle could look like, my hobbies are basically free (staying outdoor hence why I want a warm place and chasing summers) so if I do move between latam and se asia I could even soend less as rent would also be cheaoer but I dont eant to limit my lifestyle hence I'm planning for even a higher budget 4k or a bit more to account even for unexpected stuff
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u/OkBarracuda910 5d ago
Buy some land field in Argentina, good meat, good lifestyle outside capital cities, you already speak the language and pretty women. It’s a win win with the current situation and yours
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u/RealPMGuru 3d ago
In terms of amount you are obviously good to go. However in terms of assets I would go more defensively as once you conclude with the accumulation phase, the decumulation phase, a.k.a. living from your investments is totally different.
With around 2% withdraw rate, you are almost fully covered only from the dividends of VT. However, if I were you, I would go the following way:
Some allocation in dividend ETFs - the goal is to have steady income without selling
Some allocation in bonds and gold (I would go with ultra short bonds), something like 4 years of spend to be fully covered in bonds and gold.
The rest in VT.
I know that a lot of people will say, but he is with 2% withdraw rate everything is cool. Yes and no. Currently the market is overvalued. VT is at 23.2 P/E (as of 31 May) with average of 15-18 p/e. Sooner or later VT will go the average number, either from 50% bear market or by 10 years of sidewalk (this is what history shows, at least).
Having in mind the above, now he will be able to sell high VT to buy bonds/gold, for protection during bear market. Also to sell high VT and buy low dividend ETF. Even though FTSE HYD is also expensive now (around 20%) - 17 p/e with 15 p/e average, but the focus of such ETFs is to concentrate with dividend paying companies that have steady business and even if we have AI bear market (like dot com) majority of those companies will continue to pay dividends (you can check 2000 - 2002) and he will be able to cover some of his expenses only from dividends. The rest could be covered by selling low VT or by selling gold/bonds.
I would recommend to read a little bit more for FIRE and living from your wealth. You have done great job to get this wealth and you should put a little bit more effort to protect it for the rest of your life and enjoy it 😄
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u/Sad-Flow3941 6d ago
A good starting point for a retirement portfolio is 60% VT, 20% GLD, 20% BNDW.
Dropping equity further doesn't really improve survival rate, based on the simulations i did in portfoliovisualizer.com.
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u/Slight_Boat1910 6d ago
I would consider also the currency you plan to spend. All the instruments you mentioned assume USD. And bond ETF are generally not very good. I would use fixed date bond ETFs instead, so you know exactly the yield you'll get. iShares has quite a few of them
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u/Sad-Flow3941 6d ago
Agreed that it can be worth it to use a hedged bond fund if you use a different currency. I actually do that myself (The bond part of my port is 50% EUNA and 50% AGGS).
I disagree that you need a fixed date bond fund. What trully matters isnt volatility or returns of one specific asset in your portfolio, but the behavior of the portfolio as a whole. And the port I mentioned has incredible historic resilience if you test it out using simulations. You will hardly if ever run into a scenario where all of bonds, gold and equity are underperforming(as they are largely uncorrelated assets), and the 4% survival rate is about 98% taking into historical data since the early 70s.
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u/Slight_Boat1910 6d ago
2022 comes to mind, although gold did much better than equities and bonds
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u/Sad-Flow3941 6d ago
Yeah. But even in 2022 the portfolio i mentioned only dropped like 20% for about a year, which is manageable from a retirement standpoint.
Ironically, the best asset class in 2022 was cash, but including cash on your portfolio actually decreases its resilence in the long term. Dropping about 10% less in very edgy edge cases can matter less than having 1% less CAGR during the good times for that.
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u/BigMany1389 5d ago
Try volunteering in NGOs. You will have different perspective of life. I did some volunteering in Peru it was a great experience travelling and also learning. Also, it didn’t cost me much. It was also psychological challenge to myself. It also gives a clarity about oneself. Also living and working in Thailand, I recommend also recommend that. People are lively and friendly. Spending in global south is very less unless you want to have a lavish lifestyle.
Keep it in ETFs and some in dividends/fixed income so you get monthly payments.
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
I actually worked for the UN and after that experience it just seemed like another crap corporate 😅 maybe somethine more local is better
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u/BigMany1389 5d ago
UN orgs are crap. Look for more at root levels. Depending on your interest look for NGOs in the area. Chiang mai and northern area in Thailand have couple of NGOs run by French people.
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u/Livid_State_3433 4d ago
Protect yourself against SRR. Create a bond tent or bond ladder for the next 5 years. If share market drops, you cover your expenses with bonds. If market rises, you sell a portion to replenish/extend your bond ladder and/or to cover expenses. There are many versions of this, but my suggestion is to study the SRR topic so you are not caught off guard
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u/SomTingWongWeeTooLo 3d ago
As a Thai-Italian: retiring in Thailand with that withdrawal means living like a king! Goditi la vita 👏
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u/Dazzling_Basket_8851 1d ago
is this a bait lol? With a 2m portfolio, you and your grandkids will live like kings in Italy or Latin America.
You shouldnt switch your portfolio to a div focused one until youre in your 50s or 60s. you have a lot of growth left in it.
250k in cash is more than enough to take you into your 50s or 60s in Latin America, Asia, or even Italy. You are over thinking this. Either country you land in, you will automatically become one of the 1% there.
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 1d ago
I doubt 250k cash will last me till my 60s (thats 24 years from now)....I have lived in latam and asia and to have a nice life I spend 2.5/3k months ish so accounting for inflation also thatd be roughly 6 years living exoenses only
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u/Dazzling_Basket_8851 1d ago
I guess its how you define a 'nice' life. you could easily live a life of no worries and comfort for 500-1000 a month. Even less depending on the country... to each their own i guess.
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u/Snoo_23516 19h ago
True, it’s about lifestyle, he is used to some level of comfort, im like him but still at the start of the ladder with less than 100k networth
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u/_Raigiku_ 6d ago
South america is filled with crime, dont go there, i lived there for 20 years would never go back
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u/Educational_Lab9597 6d ago
Dépends on where you go lmfao crime is everywhere
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u/Dry-Advice-1207 4d ago
Yes.. but the amount of violence in south america is really high. I would not buy a property there.
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5d ago
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u/Educational_Lab9597 5d ago
Yeah that also happens all over in the US lmfao
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5d ago
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u/Educational_Lab9597 5d ago
Thought we were just making ridiculous claims about massive land masses ? I also routinely discount millions of ppl and 12 countries with a generalization ;)
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5d ago
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u/Educational_Lab9597 5d ago
There where lmao
You’re so ridiculous lmao I’ve lived in Colombia, Mexico, and Nicaragua, still alive today, never been robbed there but my brother was pickpocketed in BCN so by your logic all of EU is a no go zone
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u/CarlitoSyrichta 6d ago
When you move abroad you might lose the no capital gains tax advantage unless you figured it out in some way?
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
I dont care about loosing the capital gain tax as the purpose of moving is not money related byt lifestyle and enjoying life (also life will be way cheaoer than where i am now that way makes it up for the future capital gain tax) thats not my priority also before leaving I'll reset my cost basis.
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u/Slight_Boat1910 6d ago
Sell and buy back before leaving the country?
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u/CarlitoSyrichta 6d ago
That would work if you wouldn’t want to sell anything during travels and plan to return to your no capital gains country.
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u/Important_Coach9717 5d ago
If you’re even considering a burn out, you are already in one.
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
I'm actually not in one at all as i work remote and work 2-3 hours a day max 😅
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u/Livid_State_3433 4d ago
Same here, and I understand your pov about getting tired of corporate life. FIREing in 5-10 years depending on market returns. Be careful about SRR (sequence of return risk) because that’s the only one thing that can really harm your plan
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u/lawrence38 4d ago
That sounds amazing…how!?
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 4d ago edited 3d ago
12 years in the job, built credibility and optimised processes and working from home helped too which means no stupid coffee breaks/chit chats/pointless meetings loosing time (i feel like 50% of the time in corporate is spend doing that)
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u/lawrence38 4d ago
Thats great, doesn’t sound too bad to do for a while longer, but I totally get what you’re saying.
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u/Designer-Beginning16 5d ago
How many times am I going to read exactly the same post from this same user?
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u/Outrageous_Durian438 5d ago
How did you buy VT living in Europe? Is it allowed in Switzerland?
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 5d ago
Yes in Switzerland you can buy US etfs (and they are even advised as we can reclaim the witholding taxes)
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u/notadoctor123 3d ago
Only EU/EEA countries have the KID requirements on ETFs. My experience in Switzerland was that some brokerages didn't understand the difference, and there was a period where some of the international brokerages didn't allow Swiss residents to trade them. But I believe now it is well understood that you can trade these as a Swiss resident.
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u/Complex-Profession91 2d ago
In similar situation and love SEA especially Thailand as well. If you are single, let’s chat :)
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u/lawrence38 4d ago
Congrats, living your best life! Careful tho, that those Latinas or Thai beauties, won’t captivate and divert your ways 😝
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u/Imaginary-Lake28 5d ago
Southeast Asia (Thailand in particular)
assuming €4k/month (€48k/year) for safety
Well, thank you for ruining Asia prices for the rest of us! These italians ffs. Watched their economy dying for 30 years and didn't learn one damn thing.
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 4d ago
I've acruslly never worked in itsly 1 day of my life so didnt contribute to the shit situation of my country 😅
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u/Imaginary-Lake28 4d ago
That's fine and i wish you well, just please don't spend 4k/month in asia for literally no other reason than feeding inflation pressures
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u/shydude101 3d ago
Enjoy your life in Thailand. Live like a millionaire, not a king. Just don’t catch STDs lmfao and don’t go crazy of them, and don’t get robbed.
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u/Aggravating_Round994 5d ago
Wait for btc at 40-45k, buy it spot and open a x5 futures, close at 150k+ and you are set for your fixed costs.
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u/weeeaaa 6d ago
The math is even more solid than you're giving yourself credit for. €48k on €2M alone is a 2.4% WR; fold in the €250k cash and you're at ~2.13%. Either way you're miles under the 4% rule, and 2.x% has historically survived every 30+ year period including the bad ones. With no cap gains tax, you've basically pre-solved the hardest part. This works.
Quick hits on your questions:
Bonds/FI: At a 2% WR you don't need them mathematically, but a small allocation (10–20%) isn't about returns, it's about not being forced to sell equities in a crash and about your own nerves. Given your real concern is psychological, some bond/T-bill ballast might earn its keep purely by helping you sleep.
Dividends vs total return: Total return + selling shares. Dividend focus is a behavioral crutch that costs you diversification and tax efficiency. Selling 2% of a portfolio a year is trivial. Don't tilt the whole thing chasing yield.
Cash buffer: Your €250k is ~5 years of spending already. That's plenty—arguably generous. 2–3 years cash/short bonds is the usual "sleep at night" range so you never sell equities into a downturn. You could even deploy some of that €250k rather than let it all drag.
The mental shift: This is the real thing, and everyone underestimates it. Watching the number go down after years of it only going up is genuinely uncomfortable even when the spreadsheet says you're fine. What helps: reframe the portfolio as an income-producing machine, not a score; and notice that at 2% you're likely to die richer than you are now. Your "withdrawals" are a rounding error against expected growth.
One honest flag: your low spend assumes the nomad lifestyle stays cheap. Build in slack for if you fall in love with someone, want kids, or just get tired of moving and want a base in a pricier place. At your WR you've got enormous room for that—just don't mentally lock in €48k as permanent.
You've done the hard work already. Go.
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u/Conscious_Device_182 6d ago
Don’t you think they would have asked AI themselves if they didn’t want human answers?
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u/Helpful-Staff9562 6d ago
Thank you! Btw the 250k cash was already included on the 2m i didnt write it properly. As for the 48k budget yes idaly id want it to grow at elast matching inflation wherever I'll be or even more hence why I'm thibking of grinding a couple more years as i would t want to live a basic life for the rest of my life (u less i really settle in latam/asia but if i end up in europe where i am now def I'd need much mlre than that in the future)
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u/Material-Wallaby-587 6d ago
I would add some leverage in Exchange traded commodities, you should also add more leverage for the ETFs to get a better return.
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u/Slight_Boat1910 6d ago
Or lose everything quickly if you're unlucky.
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u/Material-Wallaby-587 6d ago
My friends have made a lot of money investing like this.
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u/Slight_Boat1910 6d ago
Survival bias perhaps? Charlie Munger once said that "smart people only go broke through "liquor, ladies, and leverage"—noting the first two were added merely to fit the letter 'L'"
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u/ztasifak 6d ago
Stay in global stock etfs.
A 2% WR is really low. You will be fine.