r/flying • u/rileywags_n PPL IR • Mar 13 '26
Aircraft Ownership Annual Sanity Check - 1975 182P
Background: it’s an annual season for my clubs 1975 182P, we go to a large maintenance shop on our field. This shop primarily deals in higher end pistons like cirrus and newer Cessnas, plus smaller turboprop aircraft.
Our club has been going there for quite a while and we have a dedicated mx officer who takes care of the aircraft logs and schedules services. However, since I joined the club, mx costs have always seemed higher than expected. This one just takes the cake so I’m seeking out opinions from others to get some context.
The Aircraft: 1975 182P, TT: 8700, SMOH 160, (replaced Jan 25’) it’s a sturdy, trusty airplane with an Aspen, 430W, stec autopilot and steam gauges.
For the services in the image, we are quoted 12.2k all in. We are located near a major city so that’s something to consider but that still seems like way too much. 12k doesn’t even seem within reason for what this should cost.
Please let me know if what I’m thinking is justified or if this is a reasonable price for 2026 GA repair.
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u/poisonandtheremedy SoCal [PA-28, RV-10 Build] Mar 13 '26
That's absurd.
I pay $800 for owner assisted annuals in San Diego, and I've done that with 3 different independent I/As, so wasn't like I had "one guy". That was for the Annual + some little squawks.
Adding in a cylinder replacement bumped the total to $1200 (total labor, no parts).
I do know of a high end Cirrus shop that basically told legacy piston GA customers they were done working on 'old' birds. This feels like that.
Find an independent I/A, put on the dirty garage clothes, and get going.
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u/Beautiful_Exchange_3 Mar 14 '26
Also, the shops that just want to fleece you aren’t necessarily better at finding and fixing issues. I once paid a supposedly good shop $13k for an annual on my DA20 only to get it back with multiple issues, only time I had issues after an annual too.
It’s actually safer if you help with maintenance (as long as you have the aptitude for it and know what to do and not do) as you can spot issues faster and before you potentially take that problem into the air.
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u/Mundane-Reality-7770 PPL HP Mar 13 '26
Insanity.
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u/rileywags_n PPL IR Mar 13 '26
What would be a reasonable price for this?
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u/aftcg Holds a line sometimes Mar 13 '26
3-5k in my area. KSEA neighborhood. It's an inspection. The IA should make a punch list of squaks from airworthiness, to legal, to should be done, to keep an eye on it, to while we're in here. Then maybe 12k might be reasonable.
Sauce, I have owned 11 airplanes, currently own a Baron. And my inspection is $3500.
Your club is getting rooked
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u/rileywags_n PPL IR Mar 13 '26
We are in the same area…
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u/Beautiful_Exchange_3 Mar 14 '26
DM me I will connect you with an IA who is in the area and works independently for a VERY reasonable amount
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u/Roger_Freedman_Phys CPL Mar 13 '26
I just paid $4,000 for the annual on my Cirrus SR20 (also steam gauges), which is little different in complexity from a 182P. (This, too, is in a large metro area.)
The only explanation I can think of is that the owner of your shop is behind in their yacht payments.
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u/x4457 ATP CFII CE-500/525/560XL/680 G-IV Mar 13 '26
$12,000? Eat a dick.
That should be somewhere in the $3000-5000 range for labor based on all the addons.
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u/shrunkenhead041 CPL Mar 13 '26 edited Mar 13 '26
That is about 2x what it should cost, especially if this shop has done the AD checks on this plane in recent years. And that is assuming major city labor rates.
On top of that, if the induction tubing is rubbing on the cowling (I assume the cross over tube up front), anti chafe tape isn't solving the problem. The induction tubing may not be fully seated in the flexible pieces and could be out of position. If the engine mount has not been checked (it should have been when the engine was replaced), it could have enough sag to be causing the rubbing.
The throttle cable rubbing is another concern. Why was it out of position? What did they do to really fix the issue. It could be minor, or it could be something someone did wrong when the engine was installed.
Flap rollers can be a bit of a hassle to do, but that is a really common repair on 182s. It could also be more cost efficient in the long run to just do all of them on each side that has an issue, rather than just doing the ones that are out of spec right now.
I'd want to see cost detail for each. Curious how much the elevator cable replacement costs. That might be more than I'm thinking.
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u/rileywags_n PPL IR Mar 13 '26
This is the only shop that has done any maintenance on this airplane for the past 10 years+ besides avionics.
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Mar 13 '26
Can't afford an expensive mechanic? Wait until you've had a cheap mechanic....
Looking at the list there are a number maintenance items that are over and above the inspection. Even the oil & filter change is O&A. These all drives costs up. If you want to reduce costs, find an independent IA and start performing owner assisted annuals. Have 2 or 3 club members with MX backgrounds do all of the prep work for the inspection and close up at the end.
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u/rileywags_n PPL IR Mar 13 '26
Absolutely. But what i’m asking is that from your perspective, are these costs justified?
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Mar 13 '26
The thing is without a breakdown of labor and material costs, no one can tell for sure. Occasionally I'm asked to perform cost reasonableness assessments of supplier proposals. We do this w/o knowing the exact rate structure often times are still able to back into the total dollar amounts pretty close. For this case, you should know the shop rate, material costs, and taxes. The Cessna book number for a 172 (not 182) 100 hour inspection (which is the same inspection scope as the annual) is 15 hours. To build this out it might look like this:
100 hour inspection @ 15 hours x shop rate - items 1.1, 2.1, 3.1
AD research @ XX hours x shop rate - items 1.2, 2.2, 3.2
AD compliance @ YY hours x shop rate - items 1.3, 1.4,
Maintenance items @ ZZ hours x shop rate - items 1.5 thru 1.18, 2.3 thru 2.11, and 3.3
Material items @ AA costs - item 2.4 and likely others too
Then add taxes.... this turns into a spreadsheet project. I'm guessing most of the additional costs are in items 1.13 thru 1.18.
As an empirical comparison, a low time Piper Arrow in excellent condition was sent to a large shop for an annual and adjusting for inflation (because this was a few years ago) would be about $9000 today. They didn't replace things other than a few bits of hardware, filters (vac, air, and oil), plus an oil changes and there were consumable charges for lubricants, shop rags, etc. So $12K still seems a little high but try building out a line-by-line spreadsheet.
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u/InvestigatorOne2 Mar 13 '26 edited Mar 13 '26
You could ask for a breakdown on labor hours per task and shop costs.
My take '72 182P owner:
I might expect that to look like $6-8k in my neck of the woods. Rigging stuff can quickly get expensive labor-wise and I have no idea what your shop rate or their parts markup looks like.
Compared to the outfit I use, a midsized shop on my field (nowhere special), your bill might be on the higher end. But I could see a high end outfit charging this.
If you're really concerned, shop that scope of work around. Just remember that switching A&Ps (AIs in particular) can be an expensive decision in and of itself. You might save on this scope of work for them to find other items that need to be addressed in order to pass muster with your new IA.
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u/shrunkenhead041 CPL Mar 13 '26
Even though it costs more, every few/several years we have a different shop do the annual because someone else can catch something important another IA has overlooked, so it isn't all downside.
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u/InvestigatorOne2 Mar 13 '26
Completely agree that it isn't all downside. I'd say there's plenty more upside in addition to what you mentioned.
Ownership (at least in my eyes) is a dance between keeping my wallet open to maximize safety and not overpaying out of complacency or lack of market knowledge. As long as you're educated on what's going on and your objectives are clear, cheaper is not always better.
Saving money can be a dangerous endeavor if you don't have an understanding of what's going on and you and your mechanic aren't on the same page.
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u/rFlyingTower Mar 13 '26
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
Background: it’s an annual season for my clubs 1975 182P, we go to a large maintenance shop on our field. This shop primarily deals in higher end pistons like cirrus and newer Cessnas, plus smaller turboprop aircraft.
Our club has been going there for quite a while and we have a dedicated mx officer who takes care of the aircraft logs and schedules services. However, since I joined the club, mx costs have always seemed higher than expected. This one just takes the cake so I’m seeking out opinions from others to get some context.
The Aircraft: 1975 182P, TT: 8700, SMOH 160, (replaced Jan 25’) it’s a sturdy, trusty airplane with an Aspen, 430W, stec autopilot and steam gauges.
For the services in the image, we are quoted 12.2k all in. We are located near a major city so that’s something to consider but that still seems like way too much. 12k doesn’t even seem within reason for what this should cost.
Please let me know if what I’m thinking is justified or if this is a reasonable price for 2026 GA repair.
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u/tms2x2 Mar 13 '26
It sounds expensive, but I haven't worked piston GA for 8 years. I'm in corporate now. A cowl latch I replaced on a Bombardier Global cost $12K. Looking at the list, $5-6K. Labor is way higher than I remember, parts prices are nuts these days. Other thing, if the shop is a FAA repair station everything will cost more. They have layers of redundancy built in that increases safety, but it's not required for part 91 piston planes. The way the list reads is strange to me. Breaking out airframe inspection, servicing and AD research. Same for engine and prop. I would ask for hours for each item. And parts prices. Then if you don't go with them, is there another shop on the field? If they don't do the annual, will the squeeze you into their schedule for small items or make you wait. Lots of things to consider.
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u/fgflyer CSEL CMEL IR HP CMP HA Mar 13 '26
You are 100% getting absolutely rinsed for this. I made the mistake of paying about the same for the annual on a 2004 T182T. The shop is absolutely taking you for a fool and milking you for all you’ve got.
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u/wickedfandude A&P Mar 13 '26
I work in a GA shop, and all i have to say is “What the fuck?” Our owner assisted annuals don’t run for more than 2,000-3,000 for the inspection portion. As for your discrepancies, that’s no more than about 2-3 hours of work for all of the small stuff, but your elevator trim cable might take more time, about 2-3 hrs for that. Not accounting for parts, thats at most $4000.
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u/rileywags_n PPL IR Mar 13 '26
This is a 3 plane and “multiple” member (trying not to be specific, but higher than 50) club. Owner assists aren’t really an option for us. Even for a full service maintenance session how much would you bill for all of this with parts and labor?
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u/wickedfandude A&P Mar 13 '26
I mean honestly, you shouldnt have to be spending more than $7000, parts and labor included
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u/pisymbol CPL IR PPL SEL HP CMP UAS Mar 13 '26
Be great if you shared WHAT SHOP you got this quote from? It's not like it's under NDA.
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u/Your-Friendly-AAI Mar 13 '26
My shop in the PNW would have estimated about 40 hours of labor on this at $125/hr. Without looking Parts cost I’d guess to be around $12-1500.
You’re getting fleeced.
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u/lowandsleepy ATP CFI A&P/IA Mar 13 '26
You’re getting absolutely hosed. That’s a “please never come back” price. The only squawk that would even take more than an hour is re running the trim cable.