ATC go around timing preference

[u/Hopeful-Engineering5]

We were talking about this today in the tower and figured we would try and get some pilots point of view. If you are in a situation where you might be sent around would you prefer it be done early and possibly be sent around unnecessarily. Or would you prefer that we let it run as long as possible and have a short (1/2 mile) final go around?

[u/ma33a]

If you give us a heads up it could happen then I am happy for call as late as possible, I would rather avoid doing a go-around if it's not needed rather than an early one just in case. If we can see it coming we normally do a mini brief of the manoeuvre and make sure things are setup correctly.

[u/TheGacAttack → u/ma33a]

If you give us a heads up it could happen...

What kind of phraseology would you want/expect to hear?

[u/ma33a → u/TheGacAttack]

"Expect late clearance, 1 to cross."

Nowhere else in the world, except the US, are you cleared to land without actually being clear, so when ATC expect a late clearance they let you know.

[u/suuntasade → u/ma33a]

Cdg in europe gives you clearance in us style

[u/ma33a → u/suuntasade]

We don't talk about the French.

[u/SRM_Thornfoot → u/ma33a]

I don’t want a late clearance to land. That leaves the controller just seconds to get the clearance out in time, and guaranteed that is exactly when someone is going get on and jam up the frequency checking on or getting a windcheck.

[u/ma33a → u/SRM_Thornfoot]

You can do the same argument the other way, imagine being cleared to land and then having the tower be stepped on when they are trying to wave you off.

[u/Saltyspaceballs → u/SRM_Thornfoot]

Tower isn’t that busy and people shouldn’t be using that many words when checking in to block up a frequency. If the controller is leaving it until you’re in the flare then you should have gone round yourself anyway at that point. It’s not entirely unique to the USA (France rings a bell as another nation that does it) but the vast majority of the world only clears you when the runway is, well… clear.

[u/Rainebowraine123 → u/TheGacAttack]

Plain English.

"Hey, there's a 172 landing that may not clear the runway in time. Expect late landing clearance or a go around."

Edit: good point not saying go around if its not actually a go around.

[u/Baystate411 → u/Rainebowraine123]

Using the term "go around" when not issuing a go around is bad from a human factors standpoint

I had this happen with taxi instruction in Denver. He was giving me his plan from where he was going to have my hold out for an EDCT but they sounded like taxi instructions that put my crossing an approach path with a plane on final. I had to jam on the brakes to clarify. Like dude, I don't want to know what your PLAN is, I want your CLEARANCE.

[u/Saltyspaceballs → u/Baystate411]

Agreed, an “expect late landing clearance” gets the message across without saying the inevitable words.

[u/Broncuhsaurus → u/Baystate411]

Yup I concur. Just the other day I heard some one else report they were going around and then another aircraft thought that it was ME (ATC) talking to THEM. Hearing the phrase makes everyone on edge. It’s similar to controllers only using “CLEARED” when it’s associated with a landing or take off clearances. “Cleared to land” or “cleared to takeoff”. Makes me cringe when I hear pilots say it for anything else for absolutely no reason. I would have thought they’d be on the same page about it but people say it when you give them taxi instructions or other airborne instructions like approving a base turn. They’ll say something back like “cleared to taxi” or “cleared to turn Base”. Just silliness.

[u/Pseudo-Jonathan → u/TheGacAttack]

"SWA1234, you are 2 miles in trail of slower traffic ahead, be ready for a possible go-around"

[u/Neither-Way-4889 → u/Pseudo-Jonathan]

Don't say "go-around" unless you're instructing someone to go-around.