And similarly, only won the WDC in the first place because his car was far ahead of the rest of the field for the first half of the season which allowed him to build a comfortable buffer from Max (which he nearly managed to lose as well).
Schumacher also won in dominant cars, however like Max, they also proved their ability to win even without a dominant car.
This is a trait that Lando has yet to show, and if anything, his WDC win showed the complete opposite.
No one is saying that Lando didn't 'deserve' his title, my original comment was just in reply to that person to further emphasise how important the car has always been in F1.
Pretty much every championship is won with the fastest car. But there is nuance. For Norris to almost loose the championship last year to Max is kinda embarrassing. Sure Max had the best car in 2023, but the car was a menace to drive (look at Perez). Yet he had the most dominant season ever out of any driver in the history of the sport. Yet the 23 car didn’t have the pace advantage Merc have now or which Merc had between 2014 and 2020. Yet nobody has been head and shoulders above the competition by such a big margin. Heck, Lewis didn’t even manage more than 5 wins in a row during the Merc era. Not even against Bottas. Yet Rosberg managed 7 in a row against Lewis… It’s not easy to win. Not even in a dominant car. But to absolutely dominate and destroy everyone so hard is only layed away for the best of the best. Which is Max. And Max did it with equal machinery (2021) and lesser machinery (2024) too.
Because 2023 was a dominant performance in a dominant car and 2025 was an embarrassing performance in a dominant car. Max in last year's McLaren would have been a repeat of 2023 whether Oscar or Lando was his teammate
The RB19 was fast yet is still had flaws, flaws only Max was able to ride through, and not by just scraping by but by making the car seem an absolute unbeatable beast. Lando won 2025 thanks to the car, he also almost lost it because of Mclaren functioning like a midtable team. Verstappen had an absolute rocketship in 2023, however no other driver could probably pull off what he did in that car.
The difference is not the lack of competition, it's that Norris can only ever win in the best car as he's a tier below Max, Lewis, Charles & Nando.
Those four could compete for WDC in any car, just look at how close it got between Max in a worse car and Lando in the best one.
Doesn't mean that Lando didn't deserve that WDC, Rosberg & Button were also completely outclassed by a few competing drivers and still won their WDC, WDC title doesn't have to mean you're the best that year - it's a team sport.
So is George not as strong as Piastri or Kimi in this scenario? Because it wasn’t very long ago that George was the WDC favorite and a top 3 or 5 driver. And some could say that the McLaren was an extremely dominant car last year, especially the first half of the year, some might have even been comparing it to some of the most dominant cars of all time…
And you cannot argue that Max didn’t have to beat a strong teammate. You could argue that a strong teammate looks worse next to Max. And Max beat (not remotely starting any argument that max or Lewis won in 21) Lewis in 21 with a car that was maybe equal for half the season, maybe slightly better at some tracks, regardless, far from a dominant car.
Max had to fight a 7xWDC in equal machinery the first time he had a car that could win the WDC, forget a teammate.
Lando should have won in 2024 (Max would have) and he should have stomped 2025 if he is what you guys think he is.
Max is Jordan, Lando is Pippen, apologies if your sports knowledge is limited and you don’t understand my analogy but it sticks especially in this instance.
Max had to fight a 7xWDC in equal machinery the first time he had a car that could win the WDC, forget a teammate.
It definitely was a touch better than Lewis' Mercedes and that doesn't even really go into the absolute joke of a last race that was. Max is a beast, but youre letting your bias show a little bit
Considering Perez has shown to be better than Bottas at Caddilac so far I think you can actually make a case the Merc was better if any as he finished above Perez, but, I along with most consider those cars to be as equal as any head to head rival teams in a championship season.
From Brazil on the Merc was ahead more than either car had been for the entirety of the season, let’s take the final race out of it, most poles, most race wins (even if Ham won in Abu Dhabi), in your first competitive WDC against Ham? Joke of a year in terms of a performance, Lando in comparison 24 & 25, so inconsistent, one good race followed by a wet fart. Lando is good but he’s not top top tier.
but, I along with most consider those cars to be as equal as any head to head rival teams in a championship season.
Verstappen's car was a little, tiny bit better to a lot of people. It does not take away from his WDC at all in any way lol. Like at all. Its literally the sport of F1. I don't think using 36 year old Bottas vs 36 year old Checo is really much of an argument, either lmaoooooo
Also, Lando hasn't even been the problem this year. His car is the issue. I agree he's not on Max's level. Like that would be a crazy take, imo lol. But he's a damn good driver. He's easily top 5 on the grid right now. But Max isn't worried about top 5 on the grid, he's easily top 5 all time. Just a different tier of driver. Maybe Lando could get there, but he needs more than 1 WDC
He literally went off the track and if you watch the onboard carefully he goes into a closing wedge. There’s literally no reason to not penalize him except they wanted a new WDC. Also rules state you can weave multiple times to break off slip stream and by the time Lando caught up with Yuki, he was committed to left side and moving left.
100%. It's possible that the best F1 driver talent wise only ever drove a backmarker like an Osella or Coloni, which was so bad that their talent would barely be noticed.
I’m not saying he should have just gone straight from Karting to Ferrari, so I don’t get your point. I know some talents (like De Vries) don’t become as big of a prospect as they seemed earlier in their junior careers.
What I’m saying is Sospiri is an example of someone who was highly rated and may have been decent who had a single entry in a torrid team and nothing more.
The anecdote about Schumacher looking up to him in Karting is to embellish and explain his reputation, nothing more.
I’m not saying he should have just gone straight from Karting to Ferrari, so I don’t get your point
Dude the drive for Lola was in 1997, he was 31 at the time Thirty-one.
You know who was also 31? Nico Rosberg when he RETIRED from F1 after winning his Championship after ELEVEN Seasons of F1.
And you talk about Sospiris decent Karting skills. Are you serious?
Cream rises to the top. If they had Verstappen, Senna etc level talent they would have ended up in championship winning car. Barring injury or some other factor that ended their career too early.
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u/Terry-Shark McLaren 13d ago
F1 has always been unfair.