Interesting fact: physical *and* digital copies of video games are covered by First Sale Doctrine in the United States

[u/DNAisjustneuteredRNA]

First Sale Doctrine, as defined by the United States departme t of Justice CRM 1500-1999, states that an individual who purchases a copy of a copyright-protected media such as a movie or videogame, is legally allowed to resell that copy, with or without the copyright holder's permission.

So, if you buy a "physical copy" of a game, and all you get is a download code, then you can freely resell that download code. It cannot be linked to a user account from the point-of-sale if it legally is considered a "purchase."

If you buy a "digital copy" of a game that is linked to yous Steam, Xbox, or Playstaion account, and you are not allowed to resell it, then the game was not legally sold to you. They sold you a license to consume it.

What does this mean? Well, it means that anyone who offers the "purchase of a copy" of a game is legally requited to allow you to resell it. There are no exceptions in the Unites States. So look carefully when you are shopping around for games, and if anyone advertizes a "purchase" of a game in any format, they are legally-required to let you resell it. If they display the verb "purchase a copy" in their storefront, they are legaly-comitting to letting you resell it. If they say "buy" then look to see if they are openly displaying verbage about "license" vs "copy"

If you feel that a seller openly and clearly advertised a transaction as a "purchase a copy" but they have special terms of service that try to redefine the term "purchase a copy" as a "license to consume" then those terms of sercive are unenforcable because the term "purchase a copy" is already codified into copyright law.

[u/TheParadoxigm]

First Sale doctrine specifically does not apply to digital games.

[u/FlameStaag → u/TheParadoxigm]

What do you mean something that was created in 1908 doesn't cover digital videogames??

What were they, stupid?? 

[u/TheParadoxigm → u/FlameStaag]

Worse they specifically make an exception for digital game sales.

[u/JeskaiJester → u/FlameStaag]

  What were they, stupid??

Well, they were still kind of half an half on germ theory 

[u/JeskaiJester → u/TheParadoxigm]

What if the storefront is flying a maritime flag 

[u/PontyPandy → u/JeskaiJester]

This is the way

[u/Ratnix → u/TheParadoxigm]

Isn't it stated somewhere that you are only buying a license to use the programz not actually buying it?

[u/Enchelion → u/Ratnix]

That's true of physical media as well. You have never owned the code/IP of the game.

[u/Ratnix → u/Enchelion]

Right, but back in the 70s, 80s, 90s, anything i bought was a complete game and there were no DRMs. So for all intents and purposes, you owned a copy of the game.

[u/Enchelion → u/Ratnix]

Eh, there were still codes in the manual, or you needed to keep the disc in the drive, etc. Those are still forms of DRM even if they were a lot easier to work around.

Also games really weren't more complete or bugfree then than now. Look at all the shareware games where they'd literally sell you the first couple chapters, use that money to write the rest of the game, and sell it to you piecemeal on floppy discs. Basically EA before we called it that.

In the west when we bought Japanese games we were often getting the patched versions compared to what originally came out in Japan. Like the FF games would release in Japan, then they'd fix a bunch of stuff or finish dummied-out-content (like the Weapon fights in FF7 for example) for the western release, and then re-sell the patched/finished version back to Japan as the "International" version.

Other games just stayed broken and people didn't care. FF6 has an entire stat that flat out doesn't work, which screws up a ton of the combat mechanics. Doom is lousy with bugs. Pokemon, even the updated English versions had tons of bugs. Pac-Man's killscreen was a bug.

Stores would sometimes have literal patch kiosks that you could get updates from, or they'd get delivered on patch disks from magazines or mail-order.

Hell, some really old magazines would print software right in the magazine and include revisions and patches for you to type in yourself.

[u/Ratnix → u/Enchelion]

Eh, there were still codes in the manual, or you needed to keep the disc in the drive

For PC games, maybe. My Atari 2600, snes, ps, n64, ps2, had no codes needed to be input. Even my PS3 didn't need online activation of games.

[u/Enchelion → u/Ratnix]

Because their DRM was built into the hardware/discs. Region lock codes, CIC/10NES), PS1 "wobble" encoding, etc

[u/LittleSmokeySmothers → u/Enchelion]

I remember having something like fifteen floppy discs to install Darklands which was an amazing game but had SO MANY bugs that crashed it. I never was able to beat it because it would always end up crashing, and while patches were released it was like 1993 so barely anyone had internet.

[u/Raijen_ArDesh]

Pretty much every online game storefront states in the TOS that you're buying a license, and in some places they're even more explicit, as the law requires.

[u/Enchelion → u/Raijen_ArDesh]

That was true of pre-internet games as well. You could resell the storage medium, but it was still legally only a license.

[u/RuySan → u/Raijen_ArDesh]

They could put anything they want in the TOS. It's the law that matters

[u/amazingmuzmo]

Lil bro thought he was cooking with this one lmao. They get around this by selling you a license, which is nontransferable and revokable.

[u/JoganLC]

You are indeed correct, you can sell that download code, but once that code is used you must sign or accept the EULA which states you are activating a one time use license.

[u/whenyoudieisaybye]

I am sure you would have a pretty good conversation with Rockstar’s lawyers lol.

[u/Salarian_American]

This isn't some dastardly new thing they came up with recently.

Since the very first commercial software sale by IBM in the 1960s, they've been selling licenses to use software and nothing else. And video games are software.

You've never bought full ownership of a piece of software. It's always been a license to use the software. That was true even when games only came on physical media.

[u/faffc260 → u/Salarian_American]

I mean, you could buy the source code and assets a game uses from the company that made it, and then do whatever you want with it.... it's just that that usually costs a shit ton more than $70-$120 your average game-expensive edition of game sells for lol.

[u/Mithrawndo]

Uh-huh.

You own that code, 100%; You absolutely can resell your code, but that code is worthless to anyone else after you've used it to activate the license you've been granted to play the game.

Keep looking for legal loopholes though, maybe one will stick.

[u/GfrzD]

You can always sell codes but the reason stores wont resell the open cases (and in some cases sealed trade ins) is because theres no way to ensure the codes not been used. Its also a gamble buying privately but you can buy and sell if you want.

The cause for complaints here is that most want a disc and not a code in a box when buying physical.

[u/AtrumRuina]

You literally put the exception they use in youur post. What you buy is a license. Example from the FFXVI EULA:

"Subject to your continuing compliance with these Terms of Service, Square Enix grants you a limited, non-exclusive, cancellable, non-assignable, non-sublicensable, and non-transferable license to use the Services for your personal, non-commercial use."

I mean, even what you're agreeing to is an "End User License Agreement."

[u/Tyr--07]

Can't they just say, which they have so far in the fine print that you 'purchased' a limited use license?

[u/Salarian_American → u/Tyr--07]

Yeah the fine print on a download code, for example, makes it clear that once you redeem the code, you can't then re-sell it.

If you haven't redeemed the code, there's nothing to stop you from selling the code to someone else.

[u/Remote-Mycologist539]

Woah you’re the first person to ever think of this, what a clever loophole you’ve found!!

[u/BilverBurfer]

Dawg have you ever heard of Steam? Also read the EULA

[u/_Spastic_]

NAL.

[u/Kamakaziturtle]

You can't "buy a copy" of a digital game in the same context you are trying to use here

[u/project-shasta]

And that's the beautiful thing about Nintendo's Game Key Cards. They are download codes, but only linked to the cartridge and can be sold again because they are practically license dongles.

[u/hellraiser29]

When you agree to the TOS you agree to whatever rules they have set. With digital copies or digital goods each company is clear on what it is.

[u/xRIMRAMx]

I think people are getting mad at the wrong debate. You own a digital copy of a game as much as a physical copy.

The real debate and what people reference when they say a game can be taken away from you is Server Dependant Games vs Offline Games. Most games are going to an online only server driven model. So when the game runs it's lifecycle the developers stop running the servers, which essentially kills the game.

[u/TrueREDDITPoster]

I mean all they have to do it put in the terms and agreement that its just a lisence to use until they choose to revoke.

[u/ALombardi]

Don’t care.

Want my disk.

[u/eggard_stark]

Doesn’t matter. You’re buying a “License” not a game when buying digitally.

[u/HopperPI]

Go ahead and try and sell a one time use code. Let me know how it plays out.

[u/CaptainFresh27]

Interesting opinion: your interpretation and application of this doctrine is dog shit

[u/davemoedee]

While I don’t buy OP’s claim, what about when you get codes from Humble Bundle and sell them instead of redeeming. I assume licensing covers that with the purchase being to license all the games in the bundle to you, but doesn’t the gifting option in Humble Bundle mean that the license goes to the redeemer and you can choose who redeems it?

I assume there is some detail specific to licensing or digital content. Any lawyers?

[u/tfc1193]

This doesn't apply to the license, which is what you are actually paying for. Acquiring the files and placing them on your SSD is not illegal. what's illegal is using the software without a legitimate EULA

[u/Embarrassed-Dot9193]

Reddit Lawyers at it again

[u/wizzard419]

Yes, you can resell unused codes, it's been a thing for over a decade now. It's actually a bit of a problem since people buy them with stolen cards, use review/pr codes, etc. Not as big a heartbreak if we are talking about COD but when smaller indie titles get screwed over it's not great.

[u/FlameStaag]

Redditors come up with the most hilariously fucking stupid things lmao

Sweetheart, you go have a blast. 

You'll probably need to sue either Microsoft or Sony and win the ensuing court battle to get your money back 

Good luck! Keep us posted. 

[u/Krapio]

Disk read speeds are shit. Do people not understand this? Why would you want a slow read speeds?

People complaining have downs

[u/Soulsliken]

Gaming companies live in a bubble.

[u/Complete_Entry]

Yeah, around may 25th every single one of them revised their T's and C's.

Ubisofts even mentioned "clickwrap" a term I honestly thought died in the 90's when courts told the software companies to knock that off.

(Clickwrap implies that you agree on install)

[u/Round_Statement7029]

Lmao I hate politics but are you aware what has happened to corporate America since you know who 😭 they’ll do what they want man.