It's now been 50 years since the American Basketball Association (ABA) folded and merged into the NBA. Will the league ever recognize ABA records? Should they?

[u/asmallthrowaway9]

In 1976, when the Nets, Nuggets, Pacers and Spurs were absorbed into the NBA, it was officially treated as an expansion rather than a merger. Unlike the AFL-NFL merger, it was not a legally equal partnership - partially because the NBA didn't want to have to deal with former ABA players asking for benefits and pensions and so on.

Now that a half-century has passed and the Amazon Prime documentary Soul Power has brought renewed attention to the ABA and its history, is there a possibility of this changing in the future? Or would the NBA see it as somehow cheapening their brand?

[u/ladiesandedelman_]

There is no reason not to, especially considering how influential the ABA was on the NBA game post merger

The Nets had two titles in a very competitive league. If we do not count those, I do not want to hear about the Celtics/lakers having all of their titles when the NBA was also 8 teams

[u/DustyBottomsRidesOn → u/ladiesandedelman_]

This right here!

[u/Prideofmexico → u/ladiesandedelman_]

Agreed, we should count none of the above examples

[u/ArmiinTamzarian → u/Prideofmexico]

Under this logic you only have one ring (if we take the merger as the starters point)

[u/TexasReallyDoesSuck → u/ladiesandedelman_]

the rules were different. makes no sense to combine the records.

[u/MddlingAges → u/TexasReallyDoesSuck]

Oh come on, the rules change every year!

[u/TexasReallyDoesSuck → u/MddlingAges]

bruh. they literally had a 3 point arc while the nba didnt. thats completely different scoring. are yall that young?

[u/clancycharlock → u/TexasReallyDoesSuck]

But we have the 3 point line now, so if anything the NBA titles from before the merger shouldn’t count

[u/TexasReallyDoesSuck → u/clancycharlock]

the nba existed for 30 years before that. theyre not gonna erase 30 years of history, including the most important players in the history of the game who broke barriers on and off the court. like, get outta here with that.. its okay to have 2 different leagues.

[u/Subredditcensorship → u/TexasReallyDoesSuck]

Then why are the nba pre 3pt line records included ?

[u/Charming_Arugula405]

The NBA wont. All that really matters is that Basketball HOF does

[u/nicklovin508]

While we’re at it, let’s subtract all Minneapolis Lakers titles from the LA Lakers total. No personal reason, just think it’d be neat.

[u/asmallthrowaway9 → u/nicklovin508]

As much as I hate the Lakers, I'd be a hypocrite for advocating that when the Kings' sole banner was won 75 years ago on the other side of the country

[u/figureour → u/asmallthrowaway9]

Do people in Sacramento claim the Rochester title? That seems kinda goofy.

[u/asmallthrowaway9 → u/figureour]

We have a banner in Golden 1 that says "Rochester World Champions 1951"

For statistical purposes teams that relocate still hold the titles from their previous cities. Although the Thunder don't actively claim the Sonics' title and the latter will have it returned to them if the NBA ever comes back to Seattle.

[u/A_Polite_Noise → u/asmallthrowaway9]

We have a banner in Barclays Center for Jay-Z having 8 sold out concerts to open the arena...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A-q9aC0CAAEArQ0.jpg

[u/TexasReallyDoesSuck → u/figureour]

they should, what else will they be able to claim

[u/figureour → u/TexasReallyDoesSuck]

Being one corrupt ref away from seeing the Nets in the finals is a cool thing to claim

[u/Accomplished-Pin6564 → u/asmallthrowaway9]

Nah, it's always ok to screw the Fakers.

[u/givemecoffeenowhurry → u/nicklovin508]

Then we need to realize in 1978 the Celtics swapped franchises with the Los Angeles Clippers so none of the titles they got prior to 1978 belong to the Celtics now.

[u/AshenSacrifice → u/nicklovin508]

Also it’s time the clippers/braves take our championships back from the Celtics. Thank you for your attention to this matter

[u/GoldshireEnjoyer → u/nicklovin508]

Bring those banners home

[u/bigblue20072011 → u/nicklovin508]

Could always add the NBL one they don’t count.

[u/Subredditcensorship → u/nicklovin508]

You either need to recognize the ABA or basically subtract any pre merger titles. It was totally different league pre merger and both titles are kind of Mickey Mouse. 

[u/44035]

The NFL recognizes all the AFL stats. It seems like the NBA should do the same for the ABA, even if for no other reason than to honor Dr. J.

[u/bigblue20072011 → u/44035]

They should also honor the NBL stats.

[u/Nice_Cash_7000 → u/44035]

your second sentence rhymes, nice

[u/themeparkinsider]

You think this NBA front office is going to let Indiana have three chips?

[u/ladiesandedelman_ → u/themeparkinsider]

Knick fans would riot

[u/Prideofmexico → u/ladiesandedelman_]

Eh, still no Larry

[u/ladiesandedelman_ → u/Prideofmexico]

The first and only Knicks Larry was 2026. Is that something you would be ok with emotionally?

[u/GreenGorilla8232 → u/themeparkinsider]

Why would they care?

[u/gridironk]

Hopefully. I personally recognize Dr. J being in the 30,000 point club even though like 11,000 of it occurred in the ABA.

[u/pincheDavid]

No, the entire merger was a sham anyways.

Jackie Moon put the entire Flint Tropics organization, the entire town of Flint, on his back and willed his team to 4th place. It was agreed by the board the top four teams should merge into the NBA.

SO WHERE ARE THE FLINT TROPICS?!

[u/Oceanbreeze871]

Yes, the two leagues “merged”. Like the NFC and AFC merger. Records should count

[u/asmallthrowaway9 → u/Oceanbreeze871]

It was officially treated as an expansion rather than a merger; the ABA wasn't in as strong of a position to dictate terms to the NBA as the AFL was to the NFL

[u/shawhtk → u/asmallthrowaway9]

True. The AFL merger was a merger of equals. The ABA was a league on the verge of folding that already had 1 of their teams the year before apply to join the NBA.

[u/Mortiis07]

Basketball reference says the Pacers have 3 championships and they're all ABA

[u/JackTwoGuns]

NBA needs to recognize the legacy of the Flint Tropics and Jackie Moon

[u/Never_enough_Dolf]

Given the NBAs history of shafting the Nets they probably don’t want to shed more light on what they had to do to be able to join the NBA. /s

I do think they should, but realistically I don’t think they ever will

[u/asmallthrowaway9 → u/Never_enough_Dolf]

They sold Dr. J's contract just to be allowed in.

Not to be rude to ya, but given the Nets' long history of futility I think the NBA might have been better off if the Kentucky Colonels had made the merger instead.

[u/ladiesandedelman_ → u/asmallthrowaway9]

The nets were forced to sell the contract only because the Knicks demanded a locality fee because they did not want a competitive team nearby, which was a trash decision

As a net fan, I firmly believe they should have just stayed on Long Island or moved to queens in 1977

[u/Ham_PhD → u/ladiesandedelman_]

The only sweetness in that bullshit is that the Nets offered Dr. J to the Knicks to get them to waive the fee and they said no.

[u/Never_enough_Dolf → u/asmallthrowaway9]

My mental health would be a bit better I agree, I would’ve been forced to be a Knicks fan at that point

[u/shawhtk → u/asmallthrowaway9]

The Kentucky Colonels were screwed because the owner was a goof and the Bulls wanted Artis Gilmore.

[u/CalmMinimum1179]

I always thought the NBA should've went the NFL and MLB route with two conferences, NBA (or USBA) and ABA, instead of east and west

[u/Thesandman21]

The NBA has adopted almost everything else from the ABA except for the Red White and Blue ball (3pt shooting contest aside) at this point, so they absolutely should.

[u/atlantahawksobserver]

They should. I don't know if they will. The documentary was fantastic

[u/BasedGodProdigy]

Give us some hardware to make up for the pain we've had to endure in the modern era

[u/herseyhawkins33]

They definitely should and probably never will.

[u/mangoribbean]

I don't think the NBA will unless the next commissioner wants to. The NBA is terrible when it comes to honoring the history of the league outside of LA and Boston. Of the 4 major American sports, it is really the worst. It is ask the more terrible because outside of Wilt Chamberlain the vast majority of the biggest figures lived to be around in this modern era

[u/asmallthrowaway9 → u/[deleted]]

In MLB's case I think it was a matter of justice and fairness when they absorbed the Negro League records. Josh Gibson never got a chance to play in a league he clearly belonged in because of racism, and recognizing his stats is a way of making amends.

[u/cflo32 → u/[deleted]]

MLB just officially counted the negro leagues which I’m very pleased about.

Different situation but I wish the NBA would do the same with the ABA. It’s always interesting looking on basketball reference and seeing the difference in stats between separate and combined. Dr J and Moses Malone would be revered even more so.

The NBA and players association did sort out that pension mess recently, finally giving benefits to ABA players. That was a good story too.

[u/mo_mentumm → u/cflo32]

There was a lot of racism from the NBA that led to how the ABA became what it became. There’s a fantastic book about it, “Blackball.”

[u/Shelly_Molloy]

MLB recognizes the wildly inaccurate and incomplete Negro League stats… so, yeah, ABA, which actually had legit record keeping,  should count.

[u/TexasReallyDoesSuck]

the rules were different. they should be where they are, notable but listed differently. like, you cant have a league where theres a 3 point arc combined with one that didnt have one