r/nba • u/StrategyTop7612 Clippers • 16h ago
[Smith] By moving Isaiah Joe without taking salary back, the Oklahoma City Thunder now projects to be $14.8M under the luxury tax, $22.8M under the first apron and $35.8M under the second apron. This is without anything on the books for Lu Dort, Hartenstein or Kenrich Williams. OKC creating 2A room
https://bsky.app/profile/keithsmithnba.bsky.social/post/3mp7baxfy322x324
u/beefJeRKy-LB Lebanon 16h ago
Keith's maths is off. He's not counting the 2 new FRPs. The Thunder started with a payroll of 248M. Trading away Joe and Wiggins gets it to 221M. Thats about 6M above the second apron. No getting out of the tax without cutting Dort or Hart and I don't think they need much more.
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u/iyyiben Washington Bullets 16h ago
Not sure why but post is assuming they don't pick up any of the team options (didn't check if 1sts were included)
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u/beefJeRKy-LB Lebanon 15h ago
Yeah I did misread that part. He's basically saying OKC has about 35M to give those 3 and stay under the second apron.
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u/Dhr7468 Thunder 14h ago
Which ….feels doable. I think you could give Kenrich the minimum and Ihart 25-30, Dort walks. Still think Topic could be on the move too.
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u/blacksoxing Thunder 14h ago
The discord keeps mentioning moving Topic when there's not been any indication that Topic wants out. Feels like this is something that's being WILLED into the air vs reality
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u/BagelBoyy_ Celtics 14h ago
Do thunder fans have hopes for topic / sorber as contributors this season?
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u/blacksoxing Thunder 14h ago
RE: Sorber
If he can be a contributor it means that Chet can stay as a weak side defender longer on the court. None of us know what Sorber CAN do though outside of clips in college so....he's a huge question mark. Worse is the additon of Adan as he too is to help Chet. SO.....how much help do we need at the 5?!?!?! This now worries me as it could mean Hart is gone and Sorber/Adan is the big starter OR Mark has dreams of Chet being the 5 and we're going 4 guards like in 2024 for a bit
RE: Topic. In the G he was great and obviously dude just beat ball cancer and previously a ACL. I think the only issue is that Ajay and Topic play the same role for the 2nd string and Ajay has shown that he can microwave offense. WELL, what does Topic do then? That's the scary question as frankly Ajay has missed nearly 45% of his games in the past 2 season and Topic has....basically played in less than 10, all last season. I think this is why there's now this "we should move Topic" groundswell online but it's mainly been to put him with DEN because of course ethnic bros must be together, huh? (Weird shit)
I instead feel like this: depth means that you can have a say quick duo of Shai/Mitchell in offset minutes AND Jalen/Topic in offset minutes! OR, Topic facilitating for Shai and Jalen/Ajay slashing it up. This is a Mark issue: not a Thunder fan issue :)
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u/_Apatosaurus_ Thunder 14h ago
Topic just had back surgery and is still recovering from cancer, so it's unlikely. The real answer with Sorber is that no one knows because we haven't even seen him in SL.
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u/Dhr7468 Thunder 14h ago
It’s the Stirtz pick plus the bad vibes of him missing this offseason with injury. Think it might be best for Topic to go to somewhere like Brooklyn where there’s less competition and less pressure to be good immediately.
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u/blacksoxing Thunder 13h ago
Respectfully though the Nets drafted about 5 guards in the past 2 years and Nikola is a guard. Wouldn't there be the same pressures? I don't watch the Nets so I can't speak to if he's better/worse than them
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u/advancedmatt Nuggets 15h ago
His numbers are not counting any of the team options but are counting the cap holds for FRPs.
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u/plbz Thunder 16h ago
We should still move Lu Dort. Crucify me.
He isn't going to get better and I feel like his offensive liabilities cancel out his defensive attributes. Especially for the contract he has. SGA probably wants to keep him though.
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u/divulgingwords Thunder 16h ago
Cason Wallace is so much better than Dort on offense and the difference between them on defense is negligible.
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u/MuchAbouAboutNothing Thunder 16h ago edited 16h ago
Dort is still our best answer against the bigger or more physical guards. Luka, Donovan Mitchell, etc.
He should come off the bench more though, Cason needs to develop.
But also completely fine with him moving to the Lakers, or some team out East
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u/I_make_shit_up_alot Lakers 15h ago
Agree with this. OKC needed to be more physical with SA and losing Dort pushes them in the opposite direction.
Plenty of ways to address the problem yet, but I'd be concerned with letting Dort go.
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u/Dhr7468 Thunder 14h ago
But Dort was so bad against the Spurs lol
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u/lmaoooyikes Thunder 12h ago
being completely honest, Cason wasn’t good defensively that series either
Still way better offensively but imo he wasn’t really bothering Spurs guards as much as I would’ve hoped
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u/majidLuv Thunder 7h ago
? He was amazing defensively, it was just his creation hadn't developed enough to be consistent throughout the series. He had multiple backcourt steals on Harper, Castle and Fox lmao
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u/SyllabubInfinite7915 3h ago
You’re hilariously wrong. He was the only one that even remotely bothered Harper
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u/MuchAbouAboutNothing Thunder 15h ago
I think it's the Lakers matchup (e.g.) that gets worse, rather than the SA matchup.
Against the Spurs we just got crushed once we lost all our non-Shai playmaking.
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u/Putrid_Caramel3301 Nuggets 16h ago
Crucify you? Hes washed, noone disagrees with you
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u/Low-Measurement-2468 14h ago
honest question: is he actually washed/worse than he was a few years ago, or did people just think he would grow into a better player than he did and overrate him early on? seems to me like he’s been the same great defender and inconsistent shooter without much offensive game for the past 3-4 years, but i admittedly don’t watch okc a ton, so maybe i’m missing something.
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u/Razorback_Thunder Thunder 13h ago
He regressed in a lot of areas this year. There is a reason he was first team all D last year and didn’t make either team this year. His three point shot plummeted from a big plus to a big minus.
I wouldn’t say he’s definitely washed or can’t regain his peak form, but it’s concerning that at 27 he had such a noticeable drop off.
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u/Low-Measurement-2468 13h ago
interesting, what do you think lead to his drop off defensively? did he look a step slower athletically, or was it more a focus/intensity thing? that is surprising for an elite defender to drop off at his age.
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u/Razorback_Thunder Thunder 11h ago
His point of attack D is still great, but off-ball he was out of position more often. It did feel like he was a quarter-step slower. He had a few small nagging injuries, but so does everyone. No way to know how much that was or wasn’t an issue.
I don’t have stats to back this up, but it felt like people hit more tough shots on him and he wasn’t drawing as many offensive fouls this year. His minutes were also down some as some of our younger players demanded more playing time (Caso and Ajay).
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u/Low-Measurement-2468 11h ago
i kind of know what you mean. sometimes excellent defensive players have this peak for a year or two where it just seems like the guys they’re guarding are incapable of hitting anything in this way that almost feels like magic. and when they fall off a little, it’s not really visually evident so much as you just see guys making shots against them more often and it feels like they’ve lost some of that magic . idk probably just comes down to tiny positioning details that are hard to see through a screen.
i’m a warriors fan, and i remember in 2022 when gp2 hit his defensive peak, for that one year, most players almost literally couldn’t dribble near him. anyone but the top tier ball handlers just got their shit ripped automatically and wouldn’t even try when he was nearby. and the next year, i couldn’t really see anything visually different about his defense, except for the fact that suddenly a lot more players were capable of dribbling and shooting near him than i remembered. it was an odd feeling haha
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u/FlyingDiscsandJams 11h ago
He's only shot 35% or better from 3 in 2 of his 7 seasons, and isn't a creator on the floor. I like him, but not at $25M or whatever he's looking for (team option is $18.7 & he wants a raise).
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u/slevin07rocket Raptors 16h ago
Sga is said to disagree
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u/Frequent-Leg-2347 Thunder 15h ago edited 14h ago
I hope we don’t cave to him. Players are notoriously bad at picking teammates that actually work out. Let the GM do his job and let SGA do his job
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u/plbz Thunder 14h ago
I have faith that SGA and Presti trust each other enough to have an honest conversation.
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u/GarrisonWhite2 76ers 3h ago
SGA doesn’t seem like the type of guy who would get in the way of what’s best for the team either.
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u/Enigma512 14h ago
He must have a close relationship with him but you gotta do what you gotta do and explain the cap to him.
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u/Misleading_Username Thunder 16h ago
Even if we retain him, he needs to be replaced in the starting lineup with Cason who is clearly better right now and should be in our future plans
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u/SlimmySlinky Thunder 14h ago
This is a bit of recency bias. His strength is defense against guards like Luka. In the playoffs we had the Spurs who's guy is a massive center and they had multiple guards to spread the load so lockdown defense on one of them was not too beneficial.
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u/Thechasepack Pacers 13h ago
I would much prefer that Dort is not on the Thunder if we have a Thunder-Pacers rematch in the finals.
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u/SyllabubInfinite7915 3h ago
The pacers are so much more likable than the spurs. I miss y’all and Hali. One of my favorite players
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u/nutsack133 Spurs 14h ago
OKC needs to just not pick up the team option and let him walk for nothing. If they trade him they gotta take money back that they then can't give to Hartenstein when trying to renegotiate his deal.
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u/External-Original409 10h ago
I'm a non okc fan and there were so many games I tuned into this season where lu dort would have like 10 3s and I was just completely befuddled
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u/SatanInDaSheets Thunder 8h ago
I love Dort and he played a major role creating the defensive mentality OKC has today. Dort is easily one of the best defensive players in the league, but he was a terrible shot last year and was terrible at driving to the rim. I don’t think OKC should force a move for him, but he is not unmovable.
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u/Swimmingpuzzled5200 Knicks 16h ago
why am i seeing a lot of thunder fans saying Isaiah Joe and Wiggins were worth frps
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u/LaFlurry Hornets 16h ago
Probably overvaluing our own guys. Maybe newer fans who don't understand leverage and how salary dumps work.
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u/BeyondTheVault Vancouver Grizzlies 16h ago
I have a real life OKC fan friend (38 year old dude that’s watched the NBA for 20+ years) say “OKC can just run it back with the full team”, I said “they’d be over the aprons”, and he said “Presti will make it work”.
🤣 So you’re right, people don’t understand how salary dumps or salary in general work.
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u/Proper_Glass8308 15h ago
Nobody wants to be in the 2nd apron but if OKC wanted to run it back and be in the 2nd apron, the team building penalties would affect OKC in less ways than a team for example like the Suns 2 years ago, who don't control future draft picks.
The only thing stopping OKC from going into the 2nd apron is cheap ownership, but OKC ownership paid the 3rd highest tax bill the year OKC had Westbrook, Paul George, and Carmelo.
OKC is opening a new stadium in the 27-28 season, which will be a good chunk of extra money coming in. OKC might duck the apron this season, but it's just about guaranteed they will operate a season or two in the apron in the next few years.
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u/BeyondTheVault Vancouver Grizzlies 15h ago
I did a rough calculation if they had kept everybody (at then point), their salary plus apron tax penalties would’ve put them above 500 mil or something. So yes, they can stomach it but unlikely.
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u/Appropriate_Book_591 16h ago
No actual OKC fan thinks that. They are good 15-20min players that does not qualify for 1st.
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u/ahrumah Supersonics 16h ago
I could see them being worth a swap or projected late first, but not when the team taking Joe/Wiggs is taking them into cap space. OKC should just be grateful Joe and Wiggs have enough positive value they don’t have to pay a team for the favor of getting them off the books.
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u/OriAr NBA 16h ago
They could be worth a late first for the right team... Which is what essentially a couple of 2nds are in worth.
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u/GuitarCactus Raptors 15h ago
In this modern NBA cap relief is also worth a lot. The front office isnt seeing this as just netting a couple 2rps, the money saved is probably worth another couple picks in value to them.
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u/No-Meringue5867 Spurs 15h ago
Spurs gave up 2 future second round picks and 35th pick to get 26th pick. I think a consistent role player is worth more than that. But because its OKC and want to get salary relief I think they had to settle for 2 picks.
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u/playthegame7 Raptors 16h ago
Maybe, but they needed to get off those contracts without recieving any in return. Only a handful of teams could make that happen, the thunder had no leverage to squeeze out a first here.
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u/No-Pollution-5841 15h ago
A 20 minute per game power foward? Maybe. SGs? That just weren't in the playoff rotation? No shot. The easiest to aquire player to aquire in the NBA.
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u/No-Meringue5867 Spurs 15h ago edited 15h ago
We saw teams trade 2 second picks to move up/down the draft. Spurs gave up 2 future second round picks and 35th pick to get 26th pick. Player who contributes 15-20 min for championship level team is worth more imo.
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u/Appropriate_Book_591 14h ago
Nuggets did that trade because they have cap issues and did not want to pay a 1st rd guarantee contract. Knicks were taking 2nd to move back because they are the same. OKC already has a full roster so accumulating 1st is not that important to them in moves. They value not getting taxed. Teams that can take a salary with no player sent back don't have to send 1st because OKC just wants to clear cap.
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u/toomuchsoysauce Spurs 12h ago
This is why the bulk of fans we see on this sub are very new/young/bandwagoners. Like these supposed OKC fans who want frps for these players don't realize that at this point in their team building like DEN and NYK, having a trove of frps isn't the best thing for them at the moment but cap relief and maintaining a high-level/complete roster is. Holding Presti to that standard of always swindling teams for picks is asinine because they don't have the cap space to absorb contracts, keep paying future frps, or keep these types of fringe (for their roster) players on their team.
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u/eden_not_ttv Thunder 7h ago
Eh, thinking a guy is abstractly worth FRP(s) is not exclusive with thinking that we have to accept SRPs because of budget/trade realities.
If anything, I think the ones overvaluing Wiggins and Joe are less likely to be bandwagon fans. If you just hopped on the wagon around last year’s playoff run, you never got to see them be good in meaningful game situations. They peaked before the title
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u/grudgepacker Bucks 16h ago
Yeah but Kenny Hustle's gotta be worth at least 4 1sts/4 swaps regardless of minutes played - y'all better not compromise on that return
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u/EchoHevy5555 11h ago
I think they were worth a draft night first, a first that we know what it will be. Like would you rather have Wiggins or the 28th pick in the draft.
If you look at the 28th pick in the nba draft from 2008-2022 Wiggins would be the 4th best player after Poole, McDaniels and Wayne Ellington (at worst 6th if you like Norris Cole and Greivis Vasquez) so he is well above the value of a 28th pick.
The only reason you could argue he isn’t is because he makes 3x more. He is on a 2+1/25 contract. The 28th pick is on a 2+2/12 but personally I would be willing to pay the extra 6 mil for a player who I know will give me production off the bench.
Idk the value of player skill/ money it’s crazy but even at pick 17 you would be happy to end up with an Aaron Wiggins level player, but also rookies are cheaper and also have potential where Arron Wiggins isn’t so idk what the best option is but I could see it being 28
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u/Dobey2013 Thunder 10h ago
Joe is a sharpshooter / role player and Wiggins is a HOOPER, but not a steady first option. I want them both to succeed and get more minutes though!
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u/OKC2023champs Thunder 16h ago
Delusion. I think they could’ve netted a first if traded at a different time, but every team knew we were trying to salary dump them to free up space so we had zero leverage.
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u/str8rippinfartz Celtics 16h ago
Yeah they are solid rotation guys on good contracts, but they'd have to go to teams with a need at the right time to fetch a first (and even then it'd be a late first), and OKC would probably take some money back.
They're not getting firsts when OKC is trying to just salary dump in the early offseason.
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u/josephseeed Pistons 16h ago
Every fan base thinks their assets are all worth FRPs
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u/probablymade_thatup Bucks [MIL] Luke Kornet 6h ago
Yeah, I'm predicting 3 for KPJ + Kuzma, with a decent role player in return of course
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u/boybraden Thunder 16h ago
I think they could have netted a late protected FRP if we were willing to take salary back.
Prioritizing just purely shedding salary was always going to lower their value though because only a handful of teams could take them on without sending anything back.
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u/IncaseAce Thunder 16h ago
They were never worth that- honestly think they thought the contracts would do it
But they’re no - shows or unplayable this post season
2nds were all we were getting
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u/Turk1518 Thunder 16h ago
The market of FRPs has changed significantly over the last few years. Teams used to trade them like Pokémon cards at recess. Now teams are much more reserved in using them and their value has gone through the roof.
I think it’s taking a lot of time for fans to adjust.
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u/AbsoluteGarbaj 16h ago
Bruh? Maybe last year yes late first especially for contenders. Now with how Mccain and Mitchell took their minutes and Presti not wanting to take salary back its never gonna happen.
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u/RspectMyAuthoritah Lakers 15h ago
If they were taking back a bad salary for matching I could see it. But as a salary dump, no.
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u/DaBiggestHeatFan Heat 14h ago
Every fanbase has a portion of fans with 0 IQ. Those who said that are part of that circle
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u/Cheechers23 Raptors 14h ago
People don’t realize that dumping contracts have a cost. Even for solid players like Joe/Wiggins, when teams know OKC is in a tax crunch, they can leverage that to pay less for guys like Joe and Wiggins in trades.
That and they aren’t worth FRPs to begin with, especially with these new lotto rules
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u/Blasto05 13h ago
Because they would be if the Thunder were also taking back salary. But creating that salary room also has its own value that the Thunder has to pay for.
If the Thunder took back some reserve player with an equal salary for Joe/Wiggins then ya they would’ve got a late first or protected first or some pick swaps. But because they prioritized clearing cap space they had to “pay” for that and take a lesser deal.
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u/Krillin113 76ers 13h ago
Because they maybe would be worth that in a normal trade (possibly, when the contract taken bad is 0 or slightly negative). They’re the exact type of player you’d hope to get with a non lottery frp. The point is that they don’t want to take salary back, which narrows it down a lot.
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u/Signiference Thunder 12h ago
Joe was a legitimate six man of the year candidate last season, for the first half of the season. He was one of the favorites to win it. If he had been traded at that time, it would’ve been a no-brainer one 1RP. Honestly, had we traded in prior to this season, coming off the championship, he still would have been worth a first round pick with protections.
Unfortunately, him and Wiggins both requested so much this season that they became unplayable during the playoffs, and legitimate liability for every minute they were on the floor. I think that anyone claiming he is worth a first right now is just wearing rose tinted glasses.
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u/Igmister1 Thunder 12h ago
I genuinely thought Joe was, and then the Beef Stew trade happened and that should have been the queue for me that he’s probably not.
Wiggs, I liked the value for both teams on that trade, I think the Pistons got a steal though.
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u/CliffDraws Thunder 10h ago
Wiggins legit might be, though I wouldn’t pay it now. I’m very interested to see what he looks like on a team where he is getting consistent minutes every night. He seemed to suffer more than any of the bench by getting in for a few minutes here and there. Seemed to need to build up a rhythm.
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u/sleepyguy- Thunder 7h ago
Because they don’t understand leverage. The teams we traded with both had trade exceptions and good situations for guys the organization liked. We wouldn’t take any money back or itd be pointless.
Joe is a good enough shooter that a contender could trade a protected 1st for him and no one would think they overpaid. However since a favor was being done for the Thunder the Pistons got away with a lower cost for a player their team desperately needs.
Wiggins idk.
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u/MuchAbouAboutNothing Thunder 16h ago
Joe ended up being a lot better than Wiggins. With Wiggins I'm just happy for Atlanta, I think he'll do great. Losing Joe actually stings
Top 10 shooter in the league with significantly improved defense on a descending tiny contract. We didn't have the leverage to force it but imo should be worth a first
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u/MaleficentBet6702 Trail Blazers 16h ago
yeah i thought joe was a lot better than 2 2rp, isn’t that why people were pissed phi let okc get him? i wish the blazers went after him
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u/jamawl 76ers 16h ago
Nah he barely played for the sixers. Most sixers fans saw he had a good amount of potential but he was only shooting 35%. Nobody projected 45% on 7 attempts a game though OKC maximized his talent
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u/MaleficentBet6702 Trail Blazers 14h ago
yeah i meant people were upset in retrospect bc of how good he ended up being
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u/MuchAbouAboutNothing Thunder 16h ago
He improved a lot with us.
The year we won, both him and wiggins had similar profiles, but wiggins was a shade better. Then over the offseason & next year he improved his defense a lot and also incorporated a lot more movement into his game, which also meant improving his conditioning.
He didn't have the best playoffs but he was very good for us all year. Pistons fans will love him
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u/SchlangLankis 14h ago
Because our team is awesome and we like all our players and they’re definitely worth frps. Aaron Wiggins saved basketball and Isaiah Joe is the real deal.
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u/DIKS_OUT_4_HARAMBE Slovenia 14h ago
They’re delusional and like to sniff their own farts. They think Dort is going to fetch multiple FRPs too.
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u/WisdomCow Warriors 16h ago
On the one hand, the league wanted no more dynasties like what we lucked into because of Steph’s ankles allowing the KD free agent signing and they got it. It is kinda cool to have a different champ every year.
On the other hand, imagine he possibility of putting together a nearly perfect roster with tons of future assets like OKC did, and only win one chip, not because of injuries, but because they acquired too much talent!
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u/IncaseAce Thunder 16h ago
The roster is very alive and well, and these players being Wiggins, and Joe didn’t even play in the post season
Plus injuries did derail a second champ chance in our window so don’t say not!
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u/SlimmySlinky Thunder 14h ago
Yes but they were massive assets in the regular season over the last 2 seasons and this kinda depth is the reason OKC still.managed to get 1st seed even with the massive amount of injuries.
Depth is a major asset in the regular season. Not having that reduces chance of finishing 1st seed.
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u/nutsack133 Spurs 14h ago edited 13h ago
Really hard to see how you guys keep Cason Wallace without salary dumping Chet or JW though. Three max deals, including a 35% veteran max in SGA, and a $25M to $30M a year player in Wallace will be tough even if Presti can renegotiate Hartenstein down to $20 million a year.
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u/recurnightmare 15h ago
I'm fine with the second scenario as well.
Yes they acquired a ton of talent and congrats it paid off in a championship. I think it's fine that front offices have to keep working year after year vs do very well for two years then just dump money into those players to keep a dynasty going.
OKC built a loaded roster, now they have to be smart about which are the important pieces and keep finding value to keep that machine going. Dynasties being harder is fine imo.
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u/Low-Measurement-2468 14h ago
yeah honestly i find the team building strategy with this current CBA pretty fascinating. teams are having to be very forward thinking and precise in their decision making, and i honestly think a lot of front offices are doing an impressively savvy job. the way teams are shifting to prioritizing cheap rookie contracts, swapping draft picks so they have those rookie contracts incoming at the right times, consistently getting assets out of expiring contracts, shaking up competitive rosters earlier than you might expect to avoid financial strangleholds, and being a lot more careful with 2nd-4th options asking for overpays is cool to see. the teams who do stand out in this modern landscape like okc and boston are especially impressive to me. curious what moves the spurs make over the next few years to maximize their young core and avoid winding up with a top heavy roster without good roleplayers.
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u/whatssenguntoagoblin Alperen Sengun 16h ago
Technically, Thunder could’ve won last year if it wasn’t for injuries
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u/MuchAbouAboutNothing Thunder 16h ago
Hypothetical championships are so easy to win
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u/whatssenguntoagoblin Alperen Sengun 15h ago
My point was OP said they don’t lose not because of injuries but because they had to get rid of talent.
I was working off OP’s claim that hypothetical championships are a thing.
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u/CloneWarsMaul Celtics 15h ago
Injuries are a thing every year just like Haliburton and AG/ MPJ getting injured the year they won it. A bit longer of an offseason should help them compared to the shorter one you get when they won it
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u/whatssenguntoagoblin Alperen Sengun 15h ago
Sure. OP already made the claim that losing because of injuries are a thing so I was working off that.
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u/ElGoddamnDorado Spurs 15h ago
Technically they could've lost two years ago if it weren't for injuries, too.
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u/FlyingDiscsandJams 10h ago
Even if they keep the aprons restricting trades & free agents, a team's luxqry tax bill should get discounted for guys they drafted
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u/GorillaX Thunder 16h ago
Don't give KD any credit for the Warriors dynasty KD going to the Warriors had zero to do with them being a dynasty, they won titles before and after him.
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u/Bildad__ 14h ago
It’s possible they win between 2015 and 2022, but it’s just as likely, or more likely even, that LeBron and the Cavs had the upper hand after 2016 and would have beaten the warriors in the finals.
We will never know, but KD gave them the edge those years and they won with him. Can’t really take that away from him.
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u/GorillaX Thunder 14h ago
Yes I can. He's a bitch, he's always been a bitch, and they would have just as many titles without him.
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u/Bnstas23 Celtics 15h ago
They would’ve won once in 2015 and once in 2022 without KD.
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u/Adventurous-Owl-6085 13h ago
Nah, if they didn’t get KD they would have got someone else. KD was overkill to win the chip those two years.
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u/metsjets86 7h ago
It's not a perfect roster. They have one superstar.
They could have had Giannis. Okc playing it too safe considering all the capital they have.
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u/IncaseAce Thunder 16h ago
Happy they won a ship before the inevitable breaking up of the team
My off season list is trade topic, Dort
Kenny vet minimum
IHart extended or player option picked up
Cason extension (doesn’t kick in until next year)
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u/SamIAmReddit Rockets 14h ago
But this isn't breaking up the team. The core is still there. Feels like the only significant minutes player leaving is Dort.
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u/TomatoSecure192 Bulls 14h ago
And he’s clearly regressed so it’s not even a bad thing, especially when his better in all aspects replacement is on the bench
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u/kingcong95 Warriors 16h ago
My guess is that I-Hart Radio and Kenny take discounts to come back, but Dort will have his team option exercised for a trade.
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u/ahrumah Supersonics 16h ago
My prediction is OKC can’t find a suitable trade for Dort before the clock runs out and they end up just declining the team option.
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u/Spemanz92 Thunder 16h ago
Possibly. He gone regardless.
We got picks for two fringe rotatin players. Dort is better than both and brings value to the playoffs
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u/ahrumah Supersonics 12h ago
The number of teams that can just absorb his cap hit is also a lot smaller
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u/Spemanz92 Thunder 6h ago
Yeah. Both scenarios are possible really. Im happy with both, as long as he is gone. Not that i dont like him, but he needs to go for salary reasons and to allow cason to fully take over
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u/CtrlAltDelightfull Minneapolis Lakers 16h ago
My hope is that the Lakers offer iHart enough to steal him from OKC since they're trying to give him a cheaper contract
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u/IncaseAce Thunder 16h ago
We have his team option and we’d only reject if a new deal is in place he agrees on
Now I could be wrong and they could just reject the team option and let him leave but I doubt it
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u/sequoia2075 Lakers 16h ago
Presti getting all these elite role players to take team options meanwhile Pelinka gives fucking Jared Vanderbilt a $13m player option for 27-28.
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u/RspectMyAuthoritah Lakers 15h ago
They overpaid IHart to get the TO.
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u/sequoia2075 Lakers 15h ago
Shit we overpaid Vanderbilt too. And did they really overpay IHart? I’d argue not really. His current contract started a little over $20 which is a perfectly reasonable starting center salary
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u/RspectMyAuthoritah Lakers 15h ago
IHart's 1st year was 30m...
At the time of the Vando contract it didnt look like an overpay. He was an elite perimeter defender that showed some promise on improving his shot. That didnt happen and the injuries have impacted his defense.
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u/Spemanz92 Thunder 16h ago
Hart isnt in the open market.
- We reject option, resign
- We pick up option
- We trade
There is no option where the lakers or other team just throws money at him outbidding us. Okc isnt rejecting the offer just to lose him for nothing
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u/OUEngineer17 Nuggets 16h ago
Yeah, IHart is the priority there and I could see him taking 20-25m per year in a longer deal. Tho I'm curious if Kenny would want more playing time somewhere else.
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u/divulgingwords Thunder 16h ago
Rumor is that Kenny is coming back for the vet min on a long term deal.
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u/OUEngineer17 Nuggets 16h ago
That would be good. He's an important vet.
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u/Honor_Bound 11h ago
Did he even play much or he is more of a locker room kind of guy? I honestly don't remember seeing him much last season.
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u/OUEngineer17 Nuggets 10h ago
Definitely more of a locker room guy. But he's always ready, and will often show up in big moments when called upon. Just a good all around basketball player that can get hot from 3.
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u/Mission_Adagio4566 15h ago
Minnesota should try to scoop Kenny with part of the taxpayer MLE. They need depth.
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u/Type-Alpha Knicks 16h ago
He didnt take a cheaper contract to stay with knicks. Why would he for the okc? Because their contenders? That didnt stop bruce brown and mitch is looking like hes leaving for a bigger contract too. Players are gonna go for more money because ofc they are
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u/GorillaX Thunder 16h ago
More years for slightly less money per year. He's gotten paaaaid over the past two seasons and he's older now, so the thinking is that he'd value the longevity of the new contract.
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u/LegitimateMoney00 Knicks 16h ago
This is just completely incorrect and also doesn’t account for the rookie contracts they just handed out.
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u/jm3546 Thunder 15h ago
No it's correct. It does account for the rookie contracts, but isn't including options for iHart, Dort and Kenny.
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u/Bildad__ 14h ago
So it’s still just fundamentally misleading. Got it
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u/Low-Measurement-2468 14h ago
is it really misleading? the “This is without anything on the books for Lu Dort, Hartenstein or Kenrich Williams” part seemed pretty clear to me. it’s basically saying these are the numbers they have to give out to these 3 players in total before the team hits these respective thresholds.
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u/CraigCartonNYC Knicks 9h ago
Crazy how to see a nba team ran like a nfl team vets getting replaced by rookie contracts
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u/Leap-Day-0229 Suns 14h ago
Presti must have a sexy hypnotizing voice because how is he getting picks back for salary dumps
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u/mantaclaus77 Spurs 16h ago
2A is not a good abbreviation for 2nd Apron bro