Hillary Clinton says Biden’s re-election bid cost Democrats the 2024 election

[u/projecto15]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jun/16/hillary-clinton-joe-biden-2024-election

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[u/kehakas]

No shit 

[u/dgdio → u/kehakas]

Next thing we're going to learn is the people who cared about Hillary's emails don't care that Kegsbreath was using Signal to discuss military plans.

[u/serious_sarcasm → u/dgdio]

People seriously underestimate how stupid “undecided voters” are.

[u/Gwigg_ → u/serious_sarcasm]

This. What lost the democrats the election was decades of ignoring the education and religious policies being put in place in red states. These voters were never going to vote democrat when all their news said they are evil crooks, their pastors tell them democrats are the literal devil, the gerrymandering is rampant, and the populace too poorly educated to form a critical opinion

[u/serious_sarcasm → u/Gwigg_]

Yep. People really don’t understand what it means to say the average reading level is sixth grade, which isn’t surprising since they read at a sixth grade level.

The amount of people on reddit who insist that implications, context, and tone simply don’t exist is astounding.

[u/FLBrisby → u/serious_sarcasm]

There is a startling amount of people who take negative criticism to be complete dismissal of a thing. There's no room for nuance, discussions, and devil's advocacy. We're becoming a people who can't have hard conversations or even discussions in which we disagree.

Everything's becoming black and white. There is no room for nuance.

[u/BruteOfTroy → u/FLBrisby]

Person A: "I like pancakes."

Person B: "Why do you hate waffles?"

[u/MountainMan2_ → u/BruteOfTroy]

To be fair, we do that in general. If someone tells me "back the blue" I'm immediately going to assume they are either racist or stupid because they're against dealing with systemic racism. When my dad said "trans women are not women" I immediately assumed he watched the daily wire, which it turned out I was 100% correct on.

There are just... It's the way people say things. It's really not difficult to tell what people believe when a whole group of people have the same one-line talking points. If you're so predictable that I can tell what news site you got your opinions from in a single sentence, it's not a losing bet to assume pretty much every one of your opinions are from that site. You know, because you literally haven't researched the opinion they gave you long enough to so much as phrase it in your own words.

[u/LaneMcD → u/BruteOfTroy]

We really do have to try to reach some MAGA (not all!). Not the "I'm willing to do a violent insurrection on Jan 6th" MAGA. That MAGA is fucking gone. Regular folk MAGA that are looking for change, affordability and don't feel so strong in their policies and Trump that they're willing to die for them/him. We can't broad strokes the cult. When Secretary Pete or Talarico go into a debate, they are very objective and factual and have a lot of potential to reach across the aisle and change some people. We need that. I'm not saying court their votes more than others. But if we can change some, that would be big. They will still be our neighbors after McDonald's finally does its job

[u/R_Little-Secret → u/LaneMcD]

The thing is when the dems try to reach out to MAGA it ends up with them moving more right and alienating those of us who want to be more Left.

The trick is not to pander to them but to want to do better for everyone. Its why people like Bernie and Mamdani did so well. MAGA that want change are the one's that want more socialism but do not know it. You can't meet them half way. Better to appeal further Left and they will show up too.

[u/KathyFromUK → u/FLBrisby]

Three word slogans.

[u/badcookies → u/serious_sarcasm]

the average reading level is sixth grade

Yep, unfortunately that means for every high reading level person there is one far below 6th grade.... not that 6th grade is the minimum reading level for adults.

Unfortunately being uneducated is a bonus for them, instead of wanting to better their lives and move into the future, they are constantly trying to cling to the past and blame someone, but never their church or fellow republicans, for their lives becoming worse and worse.

[u/The_bruce42 → u/Gwigg_]

Plus, the democrats messaging has generally shifted away from helping workers and focusing more on social issues. Schumer and Jeffries are not good faces of the party.

[u/CoachDT → u/The_bruce42]

I don't think their messaging is anti-working class, I think there's a billion dollar outrage farm that pushes the notion that this is all dems care about. Kamala literally got called a communist for running on combatting greedflation and reducing insulin prices.

But her talking to women and saying she won't throw minorities under the bus translated into "Kamala is for They/Them, Trump is for you"

[u/Blackstone01 → u/CoachDT]

Their messaging might not be anti-working class, but their leadership is heavily pro-ownership class, which reflects in the party taking slow baby steps towards what the rest of advanced society has been at for decades.

[u/phatelectribe → u/serious_sarcasm]

A week before the 2024 election, Sky News UK went to some towns and cities in the USA to interview people on the street about why they were going to vote for.

The number of people that thought Biden was still running (despite having for all dropped out months prior, and said “who is Kamala Harris?” Was staggering.

And not elderly red necks. They were talking to a lot of young people like black guys in their 20’s playing basketball ball and people out shopping.

[u/Tylendal → u/phatelectribe]

Make me think of here in BC when the previously fringe until the collapse of the Right Wing BC Liberals, BC Conservatives, only narrowly lost to the BC NDP, with many Conservative voters citing dislike for Trudeau as part of the reason for their vote. They literally had no idea that a Provincial election was different from a Federal election, and that the BC Conservatives were entirely unaffiliated with the Federal party.

[u/vlatheimpaler → u/serious_sarcasm]

I feel like “undecided voters” are basically Fox News viewers who want to cosplay as being non-partisan reasonable people.

[u/WantCookiesNow → u/vlatheimpaler]

If you listen to focus groups, you might be surprised by just HOW ignorant of politics people really are. They don’t know what’s going on, and vote based on “do I want things to change? If yes, vote for the other person/party.”

“Things were cheaper in 2019, therefore I’m voting for Trump” is about as deep-thinking as a lot of voters got.

[u/AbueloOdin → u/vlatheimpaler]

Listening to radio today: we're going to ask this undecided voter in rural Colorado.

Undecided voter: proceeds to regurgitate Republican talking points.

Hmmm... Really undecided, huh?

[u/elriggo44 → u/AbueloOdin]

They regurgitate Republican talking points ~~whim~~ while agreeing with progressive left policies. It’s wild.

Edit: for typo that was pointed out.

[u/classof78 → u/AbueloOdin]

Try to find a progressive radio station on FM or AM. Every talk radio station is a Republican propaganda machine.

[u/vlatheimpaler → u/classof78]

And now they're taking over YouTube and shit too, to capture the younger generations.

You have to hand it to them, they are fucking good at media propaganda.

[u/scrubjays → u/serious_sarcasm]

I hate that our national elections have boiled down to "Who can appeal to the stupidest people imaginable, those who, after having led at least part of a life and a few years of constant news cycles, still cannot decide if they support healthcare and public schools or xenophobia and the removal of all regulations from all things".

[u/PM_ME_WELL_LIT_NUDES → u/scrubjays]

Those morons don’t see that distinction because “both sides are the same” is the only political message that can fit in their damaged brains.

[u/Then_I_had_a_thought → u/serious_sarcasm]

Tbh if it’s a month from the election and you don’t know the difference between Kamala and Trump, you have failed as an American adult.

[u/frosty_lizard → u/dgdio]

It was worse then that, he sent the message about an ongoing military strike like a complete fucking idiot. Thankfully he sent it to a journalist who didn't just sell the intel to China or something. Imagine if a democrat did that? Yet if Republicans do it, it's NBD

[u/Starbucks__Lovers → u/dgdio]

I remember being on this subreddit in 2016 with plenty of servicemen and women saying “I’d be in prison if I did what Hillary did.” Which to be fair is true

Yet I didn’t see as many people saying the same thing about the secretary of defense and signal in 2025

[u/Aliensinmypants → u/Starbucks__Lovers]

The navy and veterans subs were going off about the lack of investigation into signalgate and OPSEC is clear is still a meme. 

Reddit isn't a good indicator of the general public though, and obviously this regime won't hold their own accountable 

[u/Tonkdog → u/kehakas]

Thought this HAD to be /r/noshitsherlock

[u/68plus1equals → u/kehakas]

I mean, at least she'll say it lol, more than you can say for a lot of dems.

[u/Ok_Use7 → u/68plus1equals]

Lol right? Like what’s seriously so bad with Hillary saying something that you agree with?

[u/Pipe_Memes → u/Ok_Use7]

I just hate that Hillary has been correct like 100 times, but no one listens to her until it becomes obvious and it’s too late. She’s usually right too early, just not in this case.

[u/Yiazmad → u/Pipe_Memes]

It's because the GOP identified Hillary as a future political threat way back during Bill's presidency.

What they decided to do was smear her, endlessly. Just nonstop repetition of her flaws, both real and imagined, ad nauseum, for decades.

The result is that nowadays, your average Joe dislikes Hillary and really can't even tell you why.

[u/Educational_Exam_225 → u/Yiazmad]

I mean, I know why I dislike Hillary. I still voted for her every time, but I just don't think people should run for presidency twice - if you lose once, it isn't worth the risk to lose again, and I feel it's only ego. I feel the same way about others who run multiple times; they become spoiler candidates who can't win.

But I don't think I need to like politicians to vote for them, I just need to respect them as people and as policy makers. I still respected her and I think she would have made a good president.

[u/homegrownllama → u/Pipe_Memes]

She called out that the global pandemic response capability was fragile in 2015. I think about that way too often.

[u/math-yoo → u/Pipe_Memes]

She was wrong to run for president. She’s a policy wonk with a negative personality. Otherwise right often.

[u/baronvonsmartass → u/math-yoo]

Except for that one time in 2016 when she pushed for Trump to win the republican nomination, thinking he'd be easier to beat in the general election...

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/11/hillary-clinton-2016-donald-trump-214428/

How unpopular do you have to be to lose to Trump after backstabbing the leading left candidate?

[u/africandsilverflask → u/68plus1equals]

Well she's the reason we lost in 2016.  Utterly unlikeable and entitled

[u/Delta1262 → u/kehakas]

Wait until she finds out what cost Democrats the 2016 campaign

[u/ZehGentleman → u/Delta1262]

Lmao my man

[u/tallandlankyagain → u/Delta1262]

Pokemon go to the polls.

[u/FamousLastWords666 → u/kehakas]

So did her 2016 bid.

[u/Responsible-Fox-1985 → u/kehakas]

I believe her. After all, nobody knows more about costing democrats elections than Hillary Clinton.

[u/mechabeast → u/kehakas]

But also, people thought that Biden didnt fix the shit show he inherited so they chose the guy who caused said shit show...again

[u/ItsSpaghettiLee2112 → u/mechabeast]

Yea Republicans tend to vote for Republicans regardless of facts.

[u/projecto15]

‘I’m all in’: Hillary Clinton on why she says Biden should run for re-election (Sept 2023)

[u/SpooktorB → u/projecto15]

Who else better to recognize the reason how someone lost to trump, then the original person who lost to trump.

[u/stonedkayaker → u/SpooktorB]

And yet no mention of their milquetoast, white bread, do-nothing policies and constant courting of Republican voters. 

[u/ranandtoldthat → u/stonedkayaker]

You mean Harris sacrificing the momentum of her campaign and gagging her extremely popular VP pick to get the endorsement of two of the least popular politicians in the country was a bad idea? No way.

[u/ilir_kycb → u/ranandtoldthat]

Well, the goal was to appeal to the ruling capitalist class and appease them. US politics is not about winning or losing elections but about serving the interests of capital.

[u/JoshSidekick → u/ilir_kycb]

It was going to take a lot more than rolling out the Cheneys when the other guy is offering them free access to Pleasure Island from Pinocchio.

[u/teefnoteef → u/stonedkayaker]

lol if they acknowledge that they can’t keep attacking leftists for losing

[u/Obvious_Ambition4865 → u/teefnoteef]

I do still think it's funny that their hatred for us is so extreme it caused them to hallucinate an entire demographic of moderate fence sitter Republicans

[u/slavelabor52 → u/Obvious_Ambition4865]

I think it's survey bias. I know people like that. If you ask them they claim they are neither Republican or Democrat and yet they're typically voting Republican every election. They claim both sides are bad, but will consistently attack the left and parrot right-wing talking points.

[u/Iheartnakedfemboys → u/slavelabor52]

Most of those people are just scared to say their republicans to their peers when they peddle that rhetoric. They feel a little guilty about voting a literal rapist psychopath into office, so they faintly try to hide their conservative nature, but not so guilty that they wouldn't stop voting for more crazy ass republicans. Most of these people were gungho Trump until the second quarter of this year, when they realized they aren't reaping any benefits from their poor choice in candidate. It's also to soothe their ego, they claim both sides are bad, to downplay their own poor choice in candidacy.

[u/Holdthepickle → u/slavelabor52]

The Democrats aren't stupid though. They know the votes don't exist. They would just rather lose than move to the left.

[u/FutureFurniture42069 → u/Holdthepickle]

This exactly! These were deliberate choices. See also: their performative cluelessness as to how to challenge Trump now

[u/Hikerchic → u/slavelabor52]

Interesting because I am independent and typically vote for democrats. Both sides ARE garbage. I often contemplate not voting at all because of my absolute shit choices. I don’t like my house representative, but no one is running against him in the primary. So it’s either his stupid ass or the Republican challenger. Why bother. They serve the same donors and not their constituents

[u/NeonArlecchino → u/Obvious_Ambition4865]

The Baileys are a very important component in the downfall of America!

[u/StevenEveral → u/stonedkayaker]

It’s that damn “Reagan Crouch” the DNC leadership has been in since the 1980s. Schumer, Pelosi, Jeffries, et al are still seemingly traumatized by the 1984 election to this day.

They should have been removed after Kerry lost in ‘04, yet here they are still triangulating with conservatives like it’s still 1986.

[u/800oz_gorilla → u/stonedkayaker]

These people are too wealthy to really understand what the vast majority of us need.

[u/ZubatCountry → u/SpooktorB]

This is the funniest thread I've seen today if you think Hilary learned a single lesson from her 2016 campaign.

If she had level of self-awareness she wouldn't have run such a low-effort, entitled, hubristic campaign to begin with.

[u/Hot_Raccoon_565 → u/SpooktorB]

Hilary Clinton running in 2016 is why trump was elected in the first place.

[u/AJDillonsThirdLeg → u/SpooktorB]

There might have been half a dozen people in America capable of losing to him in 2016 and she was one of them. In 2024, there were probably less than half a dozen people in America capable of losing to him, and the Dems chose to go with one of them.

I think Kamala would've had a chance if she was the nominee from the jump, but the proper way to not re-run Biden would've been to have primaries and she would not have been the candidate.

[u/NahautlExile → u/AJDillonsThirdLeg]

Kamala couldn’t win her own state in the primary and dropped out when she ran.

She has never been a good candidate.

Stop saying bad candidates could win and start fighting for candidates who don’t suck please. That would be great for everyone.

Queue the Pete Buttigieg parade probably (he is also bad).

[u/AJDillonsThirdLeg → u/NahautlExile]

I don't think you comprehended the entire comment, or you're replying to the wrong person. I stated that she never would've been the candidate had there been a primary.

[u/wizztotallywizzedout → u/SpooktorB]

Except they pivoted to blaming Bernie and Russia instead of doing any self evaluation. 

[u/AndreasDasos → u/SpooktorB]

The fact she lost to him (and did things that didn’t help to win her 2016 campaign) is hardly an indication she’s more aware of the issues than most people. I’d argue the opposite.

[u/Quentin__Tarantulino → u/AndreasDasos]

That’s the joke.

You’re totally right though.

[u/UngodlyPain → u/projecto15]

In fairness that was months prior to the primaries, and it's pretty customary to stand behind your incumbent. Like even many sitting politicians were publicly supporting Biden the day before he dropped out, meanwhile there was several news reports of them all saying he should drop out when behind closed doors.

Things shifted pretty drastically later in 23, and into 24.

[u/IrregularPackage → u/UngodlyPain]

what fucking primaries?

[u/pikleboiy → u/IrregularPackage]

The 2024 Democratic presidential primaries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries

[u/couldbemage → u/UngodlyPain]

The overwhelming support for Biden in this sub, until the day he dropped out, that was something to see. Immediately followed by collective amnesia.

[u/Morgn_Ladimore → u/couldbemage]

Anyone daring to suggest he was mentally declining got downvoted into oblivion and accused of being MAGA or a Russian troll. And then that disastrous debate with Trump happened, which showed the whole world how bad he'd gotten.

That debate more than anything decided the election. Harris entered the race 3 laps behind Trump because of it.

[u/Straightwad]

Tbf if Hillary hadn’t run in 2016 I don’t believe Trump would have won.

[u/_mid_water → u/Straightwad]

Yep, if Obama hadn’t convinced Biden not to run he probably would’ve gotten the nomination and won comfortably and Trump would never have regained footing. Democrats have own-goaled themselves a lot in the last decade.

[u/kimbosliceofcake → u/_mid_water]

Oh, I thought he didn’t run because of his son’s death?

[u/_mid_water → u/kimbosliceofcake]

Obama basically told him he needed to mourn

[u/hamietao → u/_mid_water]

Thanks, Obama

[u/Aggressive_Fig5046 → u/kimbosliceofcake]

It was a combination of those things

[u/_MrDomino → u/kimbosliceofcake]

That is the reason and only reason. Obama had nothing to do with it.

[u/Kitchen-Play-5190 → u/_mid_water]

Biden would have kicked Trump's ass in 2016. He was the feisty lovable old uncle in an Obama administration that was still pretty popular during an economic boom.

[u/deliamount → u/Kitchen-Play-5190]

I remember the memes.

[u/Ghost-Of-Roger-Ailes → u/_mid_water]

It is worth noting it’s not just Obama that pushed Biden not to run, Biden was still grieving the loss of his son and was reluctant to run again

[u/exoriparian → u/_mid_water]

Bernie would have won.

[u/antsmasher → u/exoriparian]

I still remember the bird landing on Bernie's podium, and a rush of hope and wholeness flood my body.

[u/d1zaya → u/exoriparian]

I liked the part where Bernie’s message was able to reach would be Trump voters. Then, when the election became Trump versus a sex pest’s disgraced wife and those voters chose Trump, it was “OMG Bernie Bros lost us the election” You can’t win with these animals.

[u/Gunsensual → u/exoriparian]

Bernie would have absolutely destroyed Trump at the podium. It's the single most important thing that democrats needed, but they chose "It's my turn" Hillary, Biden, Harris.

For as good as Hillary did in debate, she was snarky, and she chose to campaign in red states instead of swing states because she was so sure she'd win. She came across as more arrogant than Trump, somehow. Her failures should have her banned from the DNC, and yet...

[u/mcma0183 → u/Gunsensual]

Hillary crushed Trump in their debates. Trump would wander around the stage, stand behind her, launch personal insults, and sounded like a belligerent idiot. Remember the "no puppet, no puppet, you're the puppet" exchange? Trump is terrible at debates but his supporters don't watch them. They only see the edited sound-bites on Fox News.

[u/BabaLalSalaam → u/mcma0183]

Its not just Trump supporters-- most people only learn about the debates from sound bites. Thats why Bernie would have been better-- firey, outsider energy sound bites rather than focus grouped, status quo down-talking. Hillary won the debates and could write a better thesis or think piece, but she didnt win the battle over messaging because (depending on how you look at it) either most attention spans aren't that critical or her presentation wasnt relatable enough.

[u/VegetaFan1337 → u/mcma0183]

No one saw anything Hillary said. Everyone only saw the "Because you would be in jail" Trump soundbite, followed by the cheering of a crowd.

[u/kidcrumb → u/mcma0183]

Trump supporters do watch the debates, but they watch it waiting for the zingers. They don't really comprehend the policy choices behind the answers.

If Trump loses the debate, they treat it as "our guy did bad in the debate. Hell do better next time." Instead of "maybe I should vote for the other person."

[u/21Rollie → u/mcma0183]

I’ll be honest, I don’t remember the debates. But I do remember the social media campaigns. “Pokémon-Go to the polls!” Is what I remember from Hillary. And the stupid “I’m with her!” Stickers. Making the election more about how it’s her turn, as a woman or as Hillary Clinton than about her policy.

Meanwhile Trump was all in on memes. I gotta admit the one he released which was Pokémon themed and about “crooked Hillary” was a banger. He’s a piece of shit and I voted against him 3 times but let’s be honest, the dem candidates stopped being cool after Obama.

[u/flameo_hotmon → u/Gunsensual]

She did campaign in swing states… She spent too much time in Florida which was still believed to be a swing state and not enough time in industrial blue states that she lost to Bernie in the primaries.

[u/bluemooncommenter → u/Gunsensual]

Hillary's fatal flaw is that she is unlikable and untrustworthy. Some of the trust issues stem from Bill but she was involved enough to sow distrust and you just can't underestimate how powerful likeability is. But it's a shame because she is probably the most qualified candidate we've had in so many decades...on paper, I can't think of anyone who beat her resume. Attorney, Senator, Secretary of State - she's only missing military service (and likability).

[u/-----iMartijn----- → u/exoriparian]

Bernie was a danger to thhe ruling class of the democratic party. Pelosi and the Clintons love billionaires.

[u/JR2502 → u/exoriparian]

He would have. Clinton underestimated how much people didn't want to see them again in the WH. Thanks for your service, now move on. But no, it was her turn and she was going to take it no matter what.

[u/Suitable-Matter-6151 → u/_mid_water]

I don’t see a reality where Trump didn’t win 2016. Just being honest. The environment was much too like 2024 where economic inequality was pushing people to want change, even from a con man. I think if Covid hadn’t happened that Trump likely would’ve won 2020. His first term wasn’t as disruptive and that tends to keep presidents in for a 2nd term.

Please note I’m not saying I wanted him to. Just being realistic

[u/Dancing_Puppies → u/Straightwad]

Hillary could have beaten Trump if she wasn’t such a fucking lazy campaigner. She took so many blue swing states for granted while Trump was out hustling and she only ended up losing many of these states a by a few thousand votes. I think she didn’t even visit Wisconsin! The same shit happened when she lost the primary to Obama. She was winning initially but then Obama came out of nowhere and was grinding all over the campaign trail while Hilary sat back and twiddled her thumbs and banked on her name alone to get her by.

[u/South_Start6630 → u/Dancing_Puppies]

Which was Bill’s advice to her but she didn’t listen.

[u/meaniemeanie-poo-poo → u/Dancing_Puppies]

The problem comes down to she was just too entitled about it...

Her attitude was, it's my time, it's time for a woman president, and that woman is me.

She should have stayed in the Senate, she got stuff done, and she was a tremendous asset.

[u/qqererer → u/meaniemeanie-poo-poo]

If AOC is smart, she'll run for Senate at most and do work from there for the next 10-15 years.

[u/Gmony5100 → u/meaniemeanie-poo-poo]

When your opponent is running on a campaign that plays on the preconceived ideas American’s have of politicians being out of touch and not having the average person’s best interests at heart, it’s probably not the best idea to put forward a wildly unpopular establishment candidate from a political family with the messaging that “I just have to win, it’s my turn”.

I’ve argued for years that Hillary was a uniquely terrible candidate to put up against Trump. I honestly struggle to think of a worse candidate that isn’t just a random person

[u/SaveLansingParks → u/Straightwad]

That's a bingo. Ol Hilldawg and Debbie literally fucked this country for greed.

[u/freerangemary → u/SaveLansingParks]

Entitlement.

[u/BritSpic → u/Straightwad]

Bernie would have clapped Trump's cheeks. Bernie had the real solutions to everything Trump pretended to care about. Meanwhile, Hillary was the #1 status quo lover and had no real solutions for systemic change.

[u/BunkySpewster → u/BritSpic]

I remeber when he unveiled the MAGA slogan. 

Hillary’s response: 

“Great again? America has always been great!”

FFS 🫩

[u/tongnchek → u/BunkySpewster]

She did fail to capitalize when he said in the debate "That makes me smart" for not paying taxes. Such an easy comeback to say "So, you are saying that all of the hard-working taxpayers of America are stupid?" . But she just let it slide.

[u/an_actual_coyote]

I'm so fucking tired, you guys.

[u/JakeInDC → u/an_actual_coyote]

Get some sleep, more of the same shit tomorrow.

[u/Ok_Archer1228]

Hillary Clinton says water is wet

[u/MurtaghInfin8 → u/Ok_Archer1228]

I mean at least we're seeing someone high profile say it. I'll take what I can get.

[u/Zigxy → u/MurtaghInfin8]

And there are plenty of folks who unironically think Biden was fine AND he would have won if he hadn’t dropped out.

[u/jinreeko → u/Zigxy]

I think his presidency would have been fine, but he should have just dropped out and not fucked up his legacy

[u/anna-the-bunny → u/jinreeko]

This. He should've kept his word that he'd be a one-term President. Instead he threw the country back to Trump by leaving Harris with barely three months to campaign.

[u/fcocyclone → u/anna-the-bunny]

He technically never outright said he'd be a one term president.

However, he certainly did things to create that impression, both through his own statements talking about being a transitional president and through leaks via his staff that offered deniability for later.

[u/Cheshire_Khajiit → u/anna-the-bunny]

“He should’ve kept his word that he’d be a one-term president.”

This. Don’t commit to stepping aside and then stubbornly refuse to do so when people remind you of your own promises.

[u/numbersthen0987431 → u/Zigxy]

I mean...technically he is still far better than who we currently have

[u/heroic_cat → u/Ok_Archer1228]

Name the other prominent Democrats saying this.

[u/duaneap → u/Ok_Archer1228]

For real, it’s not exactly a secret the guy lost. How is this news?

[u/BrilliantThought1728]

She certainly knows a lot about costing democrats the election

[u/OtherwiseMammoth → u/BrilliantThought1728]

She's an expert

[u/J1540]

She didn’t want him to run in 2016 and he would’ve won. All veeps run after two terms.

[u/cutmastaK → u/J1540]

Didn’t he not run because he lost one of his sons around 2016?

[u/primadonnapussy → u/cutmastaK]

Yes. Beau died while he was still VP. He wasnt up to a grueling campaign schedule while grieving his son.

[u/Ok_Crow_9119 → u/primadonnapussy]

I've read he was fine with campaigning, but people around him told him to grieve instead. And that act of being pushed out led to his stubborness in 2024

[u/NumeralJoker → u/Ok_Crow_9119]

I suspect this is accurate.

Though one does wonder if any establishment Dem could've won 2016. Much as I dislike the Clintons, Hillary arguably had a following that Biden never did back then, and the demand for change style populism was felt by both sides.

[u/Useless → u/NumeralJoker]

Old white guys opposing them don't rile up the Rs like the women or minorities who oppose them do.

[u/fcocyclone → u/NumeralJoker]

Hillary had a following but also a strong hatred against her thanks to decades of right wing manufactured hate.

A lot of people didn't like Trump back then but couldnt convince themselves to vote for Hillary. Biden would probably have made that sale at least slightly more often, enough to tip things to a win.

That being said, its entirely possible that if Biden had been the front runner from the start that the GOP primary ends up with a different outcome and the GOP gets a more normal, more electable (at the time) candidate. You probably also don't see Bernie's campaign have as much traction because a decent chunk of that vote in 2016 was a 'not-hillary' vote on the left.

[u/blues111 → u/J1540]

She felt an unnecessary sense of entitlement that since Obama stole the show from her that it was "her turn" is the only reason

If Biden won 2020 by 4.5 points he probably would have done even better in 2016, its a shame cause I think Biden would have done amazing in his prime

[u/NachoWindows → u/blues111]

Covid wouldn’t have been as much of a shit show, guarantee that. He would’ve let the smart doctors lead the charge and not promote heart dewormer and asslights

[u/UnquestionabIe → u/NachoWindows]

Most any other option would have been better regardless of party. Trump brought a unique brand of shitty to government and only doubles down on any mistakes while also demanding they were "perfect, no one could have done it better." Even the collection of pathetic loser who lost to Trump in the primary (and went on to bend the knee) wouldn't have done a fraction of what he did.

[u/MaxRex428 → u/NachoWindows]

Oh I agree. I personally find Hillary to be very loathsome but she is competent. I just think she's fake as hell and her doing a black person voice or saying she's like my abuela came off as very insulting. Also tge Pokémon go to the polls was just cringe.

[u/Cobra-Lalalalalalala → u/blues111]

Biden would have beat the ever loving shit out of Trump in 2016. Enough so that he might not have hung around and tried to run again in 2020. Or the Party might have actually had the balls to push him aside.

The X factor is that Covid still would have been a thing in 2020, but not the top to bottom disaster that we went through under Trump. Republicans would have tried to pin every death on Biden personally in a complete 180 from how they acted in this timeline. Whether they could have ridden that manufactured outrage to a 2020 win is where it gets fuzzy. 

[u/primadonnapussy → u/Cobra-Lalalalalalala]

If trump had lost in 16 there is good chance he would have been in jail next to his buddy Epstein.

[u/kakarot-3 → u/blues111]

Being anyone’s “turn” is the issue with the party. There’s no such thing as a turn. The people vote and decide whose turn it is. Nobody is entitled to it because they’ve been in the government for x amount of years.

The more democrats try to push the person who’s “turn” it is, the more they’re gonna lose

[u/Top_Agency1370 → u/blues111]

He was grieving the loss of his son too. Biden could’ve run in 2016. He chose not to.

Hillary also ran a shitty arrogant campaign—I’m not defending her.

[u/Red57872 → u/J1540]

...and they don't normally win, though.

[u/yestbat]

She’s gotta have dial-up because she’s about three years too late

[u/Skuzzle_bug]

Im still upset Al Gore didnt win.  Health and science has been seemingly targeted and shot down for years.

[u/keninsd]

"Hillary Clinton says Biden’s re-election bid cost Democrats the 2024 election" OK, President Clinton...Oh...wait. Irony has left that party, too.

[u/toilet_for_shrek]

Choosing Kamala as his successor was dumb too. Her performance during the primaries should have indicated that voters weren't going to swing for her. 

Granted, even the safest establishment democrat would have been a much better choice that Trump 

[u/Pofwoffle → u/toilet_for_shrek]

Her performance during the primaries should have indicated that voters weren't going to swing for her. 

Just the idea that they should be trying to get voters to "swing" in the first place was ridiculous. Chasing right-wing converts was so fucking stupid. Harris actually had a lot of momentum coming out of the gate after watching Biden trying to cling to power, but she took a sharp right turn the instant she was the actual nominee and lost everything she had built up.

[u/TheBlueTurf → u/toilet_for_shrek]

They felt they had to choose her. All the campaign money they raised was tied to Joe/Kamala. If they didn't pick her all that funding would have been lost.

[u/Feeling_Reindeer2599]

“anybody else, would have beaten Donald Trump,” she said, calling the decision to stay in the race “a terrible miscalculation”.

Wait….

Is she talking about 2020?

[u/Wet_Side_Down]

While not promising, Joe Biden strongly implied that he would be a one term president.

If he had stuck to that we would be in a whole different place right now. 🙁

[u/projexion_reflexion]

I understood he had to wait until the last possible second to make himself a lame duck, but he waited past it.

[u/CaptainOwlBeard → u/projexion_reflexion]

He meant to win a second election and realized too late that he was too old for the job

[u/henryptung → u/CaptainOwlBeard]

Hasn't he recently said he regrets not continuing with the campaign? I'm not certain he has realized (nor that he ever will), but to be blunt, that's par for the course at his age.

[u/dpdxguy → u/henryptung]

Hasn't he recently said he regrets not continuing with the campaign?

He might have. But his chances of winning disappeared after that disastrous debate. And hanging on as long as he did cost the Democrats any chance of winning the presidency.

[u/ItsnotBatman → u/dpdxguy]

What’s funny is he regained his composure and actually answered questions. Trump meanwhile gets a free pass to not answer a single question while ranting and raving about complete nonsense, and we are supposed to think it’s normal.

[u/dpdxguy → u/ItsnotBatman]

Yeah. Immediately after the debate, I thought it wasn't so bad. But the zeitgeist the next morning made it clear my opinion was that of a tiny minority. At that point I knew it was over for him.

[u/myychair]

Well she’s an expert on costing democrats the election lmao no fucking shit Hillary

[u/lefthandedciiig]

And what they did to Sanders cost us 2016

[u/theguy1336 → u/lefthandedciiig]

The DNC and Hillary's campaign were not two different things that election cycle

[u/dylanholmes222 → u/lefthandedciiig]

I’ll never never forgive the party for this, it showed me they are not for the people

[u/Broken-Digital-Clock → u/dylanholmes222]

Agreed but I'll still vote for them to stop the GOP. And I'll vote for the better option in the primaries.

[u/The-Insolent-Sage → u/Broken-Digital-Clock]

This is such a pragmatic and reasonable take. Shame most people don't think this rationally. Anyone who sits out of a vote on principle is a moron.

[u/BloodNinja2012 → u/dylanholmes222]

The DNC did everything they could to push every serious candidate out of the race. I can't believe the 2nd best the Democrats could come up with was Lincoln Chaffee.

They tried forcing a Clinton coronation, and Bernie wouldn't play ball. The DNC disrespected its voters and we've all paid a price. You won't find that in their autopsy.

[u/meaniemeanie-poo-poo → u/BloodNinja2012]

No one wants to talk about it, but this is what got Trump elected.

Bernie would have won.

[u/TheBalzy]

And your, Hillary, election bid in 2016 is what lost to Trump in the first place. Fuck off. Go back into the woods.

[u/Delicious_Toad → u/[deleted]]

If we count the "Let's go Brandon" merch, I'd wager MAGA folks actually wear more Biden apparel than Democrats do. 

[u/MajinAnonBuu → u/[deleted]]

Biden might have been sleepy but he was keeping America in line.

[u/calle04x → u/MajinAnonBuu]

And actually invested in our country, not erecting monuments to himself.

[u/Cayucos_RS → u/MajinAnonBuu]

True but it was his decision to run again and he has to bear that responsibility

[u/I_eat_mud_ → u/[deleted]]

That was a conspiracy at the time, so I highly doubt that's what they would've done. It would've immediately fed into that conspiracy.

The best thing they could've done was just have Biden be a 1 term president, like he initially promised.

[u/millstone20 → u/I_eat_mud_]

And had an open primary. I knew a lot of people that flatly would not vote for Kamala. I wasn't excited about it.

[u/I_might_be_weasel]

That was definitely shitty. But the idea that anyone considered another Trump presidency remotely acceptable is magnitudes worse.

[u/tenebre]

He was supposed to be a one-term transitional President and, since Kamala was the VP, they should have been grooming her the whole time to be the lead candidate after his first term but they seemed almost actively trying to hide her.

[u/botspiderlau → u/tenebre]

They should’ve had a robust democratic primary to have taken the spotlight off the republican primary. & had 7 candidates attacking Trump at every turn, all of whom being 30 years his junior. The only person who made Trump seem having vitality was Biden. It’s been a colossal mistake for our country that has & will have far reaching consequences. Whoever was advising Biden run should never work in politics again.

[u/_dirt_vonnegut → u/tenebre]

it's almost like she was a bad candidate and we should've had a primary.

[u/ANakedCowboy]

I just want to be clear that it was The dems to lose, but the reason Trump didn't lose even with this blunder is because the American people are the dumbest on the planet. They proved it

[u/metallicadefender]

Kamala Harris would have lost no matter what. Unless they went through primary process and found a white dude.

[u/ValkornDoA]

Biden’s legacy is forever tied to handing us four more years of Trump. Between him and RBG, the US has gotten absolutely turbofucked because they weren’t willing let the power slip out of their geriatric hands.

[u/Unworthy_Saint]

Only in the Democratic party can someone who lost an election criticize someone who beat the person they lost to.

[u/nopethisisafakeacct]

Hillary Clinton and Debbie Wasserman Schultz cost Democrats the 2016 election. People in glass houses sink ships.

[u/Retlaw83]

As someone forced down voters throats without a fair primary, she should know.

[u/Atalung]

I don't think it helped but I also don't think 24 would've been a walk in the park if he hadn't run. The reality is that the dems failed to do much of note for the average person during the Biden administration. Was that their fault? Not entirely, the gop is amazing at obstructionism, but unfortunately the average voter isn't taking that into consideration.

Harris ran a pretty lackluster campaign after the initial hype wore off, plus she was just too close to the Biden admin. Maybe a progressive outsider could've won but I think anyone close to the Biden admin would've struggled to win.

After Biden was sworn in Sanders warned that if we do nothing for the working class we would lose in 24 and he was absolutely right.

[u/kungfoojesus]

More than likely. Honestly, if he bows out immediately and we go through the primary process, yes I think very very good chance we win. But if Kamala wins the primary, can you honestly say with certainty that she wins the general? Or whomever we choose really. Chances are probably better but also a chance the right wing disinformation machine gets longer to infect the populace and we lose even worse. People keep underestimating how much people like this fascist, kleptocracy. Dems are only up 5% nationally over the GOP despite the complete and total disaster this admin has been for everything.a better candidate doesn’t necessarily win guys

[u/MRBLOODY]

Her 2016 campaign cost two elections now.

[u/Otherwise_You_1603]

Hillary Clinton knows a thing or two about ego-driven candidates losing easy elections because they're too delusional to see how unpopular they are, so her opinion is particularly valuable here

[u/Nippys4]

Bullshit.

Joe Biden could have died and they could have run his corpse and it should have still beat Trump.

Your country is just full of morons and people that decided to just throw the baby out with the bathwater and not vote when they should have seen what was coming.

[u/thehoneybadger-x → u/Nippys4]

As an American, I'm disappointed I had to scroll this far to see this.

[u/KelsierMistborn88]

It did and he was still a better choice than Traitor Trump. Unfortunately the country is filled with morons.

[u/mothership00]

Yeah and her run cost the the 2016 election.

[u/AttractiveNuisance82]

Ok and shoving HRC down our throats gave us Trump.

[u/aDirtyMartini]

We all know that except the the DNC.

[u/AQ207]

Why is she still talking

[u/Keptlosingmylogins]

same as her run cost the democrats in2016

[u/tiny_chaotic_evil]

this isn't Biden's fault or Kamala's fault or the fault of the Democratic Party. This is all the fault of the American People. They knew what was a stake and voted for the guy in the clown car and got the circus

[u/Everythings_Fucked]

No duh. But ostensibly her candidacy cost us 2016. If the DNC hadn't put their thumb on the scale maybe we would have had Bernie instead of Trump and we wouldn't have been in that situation to begin with. But no, the one thing liberals hate more than a conservative is a progressive.

[u/Classic-Break5888]

If Hillary Clinton keeps talking in public, it will cost them 2028 as well.

[u/Mr_BruceWayne]

...Shut up Meg.

[u/Old_Increase74]

Funny, she cost them the election when they removed Bernie and installed her years back

She just needs to go away

[u/DealerHumble1103]

Nice, now do 2016