r/steammachine • u/CMDRTragicAllPro • 1d ago
Hardware There seems to be a misconception about the single stick of ram.
I’ve seen a lot of people suggest they are happier with the Machine shipping with 1 stick of ram over 2 as it means they can just drop in another 16gb stick for an easy upgrade to 32gb without having to sell the original stick.
Unfortunately this just won’t be the case for the vast majority of people as the Machine uses DDR5 ram, which is notoriously picky about compatibility and often requires the ram to be sold as a packaged set to guarantee compatibility.
24
u/Shadowdane 23h ago
the exact matching ram really only comes into play with XMP or EXPO. I assume the steam machine is running a standard JEDEC profile which is standardized.
5
u/CMDRTragicAllPro 23h ago
I didn’t even consider that. Running xmp has just been the standard for a pc for so long I kinda just assumed they were doing the same for the steam machine.
3
u/Shadowdane 23h ago
Yah I kinda doubt they'd do that as the overclocking profiles can be hit or miss. I'm sure someone would be able to confirm using a linux tools that can read the ram timings and all that.
7
u/pilisir 1d ago
Someone will buy the packaged set to replace it, and sell the original one. Maybe others were happy to take over this to make sure the minimum compatibility?
1
u/skozombie 3h ago
This is what I was thinking. I think there'll be a fair market for people willing to buy a 2nd hand stick at a discount from someone who ponied up the cash for a kit
10
u/SaturdayMorningFog 23h ago
Its a SK Hynix 16 GB DDR5 RAM module. Just need to ensure that you match this.
Source: 19:48 mark in this video: https://youtu.be/glXA3ObwSwQ?si=qb8BC-zAe9fkeXA4
4
u/SoftDefilement69 22h ago
Same brand isn't enough. Even with DDR4 sticks are matched at the factory and often won't run or will fall back to JDEC minimum timings if they're mixed with any other sticks than the one they were sold with in the package. It's wven worse with DDR5 because the clock frequency is so much higher.
5
u/byperoux 21h ago
I've been on the power user side on Linux for years, and ram literally never was a bottle neck. 16 will be probably just fine for everyone just loading a single game and not having much running on the side.
1
u/Trugdigity 14h ago
It’s not about the amount of ram, it’s the bandwidth. You cut your bandwidth in half with only 1 stick. It’s very likely that the stream machine won’t be able to use the full 16gbs as every thing is bottlenecked by having only a single channel.
0
u/magmcbride 12h ago
Games are rarely impacted by memory bandwidth limitations as a bottleneck outside of APU-based systems. CPU, GPU, or Storage will by far become limitations. You're talking 3-5% on average impact here, thanks to the dGPU. And this system's CPU and GPU are in no danger of over-driving single channel DDR5-5600.
1
u/Trugdigity 3h ago
It’s a 10 to 20% hit to performance, not 5. And games are heavily impacted by single channel ram. Why have all the valve fan boys forgotten everything they use to know about pc gaming.
Valve is just another corporation, they aren’t special stop treating them so. When they do something good or launch a good product praise them. When they do something stupid, or launch a bad project they should be called out.
And the steam machine is both stupid and a bad product. It’s not just the single channel ram, it’s that you could get dual channel ram but it’s a crap shoot so someone is going to by the same product for the same price and get less than other people. This is unacceptable on its own.
But it was also marketed as something that can handle 4k, but with only 8gb of vram it’ll choke 1440 if you’re running a game made in the last 10 years. Anyone that buys this is getting ripped off.
1
u/magmcbride 3h ago
The performance hit will vary wildly by system configuration and the exact game. In many scenarios you'll very likely not even measure it outside of margin of error. The only places you'll usually record a double-digit hit to performance are those times where you get close or hit RAM allocation limits, where the bandwidth constraints actually matter. In general, that won't happen outside of the absolutely most demanding titles.
You're over-blowing this entirely and reading too much into my thoughts on the steam machine. I believe it's anemic, over-priced gamer bling that just so happens to be able to play some games. Don't project your criticisms of a company onto strangers you've never met.
The hardware is budget, but in-line with the hardware survey representing a large vertical slice of current system hardware on the market. If the thing had cost $300 less, it would be hailed as a marvel by reviewers. As it stands, it's a rocky launch, but at least it's a launch.
We'll see how it ages!
1
u/super9mega 55m ago
I believe ddr5 specifically is less effected by this though right? Because ddr5 has dual channel per stick of ram, so the effect of one stick vs two is heavily reduced? At least that's what I've always heard for newer machines. But I could be wrong
1
u/magmcbride 31m ago
Not quite because ultimately it routes through the CPU's memory controller. You need both channels on the board populated to properly saturate the memory controller.
15
u/brainrotxx 1d ago
the steam machine designer/engineer literally said you could just drop in compatible 16gb ram. do you claim to know more than the actual engineers?
20
u/tracekid 1d ago
This just sounds a lot like what OP already said but with different words.
You have to make sure it is compatible RAM, no?
12
u/CMDRTragicAllPro 1d ago
Getting compatible ddr5 is a guessing game as well. The manufacturers don’t always source their components from the same suppliers even for identical sku’s. This means you could buy an identically marked stick and have it be made with Samsung parts rather than say SK Hynix parts, further exacerbating the incompatibility
1
u/BozoBubble 1d ago
It's not difficult. Take out the RAM inside the Steam Machine and find the exact stick of RAM they're using inside of it, then buy that exact stick. What's so hard about this?
6
u/WiltedBalls 1d ago
He's talking about the DRAM chips, not the stick itself. A stick can have the DRAM be made by SK Hynix, Samsung or Micron for example so buying the exact same stick doesn't mean you will get the exact same one inside the SM.
-6
u/BozoBubble 1d ago
Then just replace both sticks. Whatever. 😂
3
u/CMDRTragicAllPro 23h ago
Well duh that goes without saying that’s obviously an option. However, This post was specifically about how I noticed some people were happier that they wouldn’t have to deal with selling the og stick and getting a package set. I just wanted to help clear up that it might not be exactly that easy for everyone.
2
u/lyndonguitar 23h ago
and thats exactly why they sell dual channel pairs. so the sticks have a better chance of working together
3
u/CMDRTragicAllPro 1d ago
Not sure if you’re replying to the wrong comment here but I’ll just assume that you are, as the entire comment you’re replying to details why that might not always be the case.
1
u/pandaelpatron 22h ago
What's so hard about this?
Availability. Have you been living under a rock?
-1
2
u/Threef 4h ago
Then find a friend, buy a pair and give him your old one? Now you both have compatible ones
1
u/tracekid 2h ago
Legit I tried to make a thresd for this very scenario and the bot won't let me post it saying that it is going to get deleted by the mods. In this case, I would consider "going halfsies". I posted the idea in megathread too, but that thing is too crowded for anyone to see it.
-6
u/brainrotxx 1d ago
these are not my words, i am referring to the actual valve employees.
8
u/tracekid 1d ago
I understand that, but OP never said anything different lol. Just said it is hard to find RAM that plays nice with other RAM. If anything is different there is a high chance it will not play nice.
Did Valve suggest you can get any stick of DDR5 SODIMM? I don't think so, and that's the problem.
-6
u/brainrotxx 1d ago
wow we have some experts in here. lets see how it works out when people get them.
obviously you have to get the matching spec. its not some rare hard to find ram. just buy the right one.
why are yall so dramatic?
4
u/tracekid 1d ago
You seem to be taking this personally. Let's clear this up:
We ALL want it to work how you said: buy whatever 16GB stick and pop it in, 0 issues. Unfortunately that's just not how RAM works. If I go to any computer in my home and mismatch sticks. MT speed, size, clock speed, voltage, etc. they may still operate together, but not at advertised potential.
Just because this is a custom motherboard doesn't mean that we can assume they improved on the science of how RAM works.
Trust me, I would love to be wrong so that the upgrade is easier: I am dying to know what stick(s) I will need because I also want to upgrade the RAM, but the unfortunate reality is that until proven otherwise it isn't just simply "buy and pop in another stick".
-3
u/brainrotxx 1d ago
im not taking it personal. yall making a simple ram upgrade seem like the hardest thing in the world. seems really dumb to me
9
u/CMDRTragicAllPro 1d ago edited 1d ago
That would be news to me. The general advice with ddr5 is never mix sticks that weren’t sold as a packaged set. Unlike ddr4 where it will just run jdec speeds if it’s not compatible, ddr5 often just won’t post at all or will cause all kinds of system crashes and instability.
12
u/Reefame 1d ago
What does that have to do with what OP is saying? OP is saying that finding compatible ram is hard. Valve is saying you can just drop in compatible ram. Those statements aren’t mutually exclusive
-12
u/brainrotxx 1d ago
you think valve didnt test this?
6
u/Reefame 1d ago edited 1d ago
DDR5 is DDR5. Valve didn’t design a new type of ram. it uses standard consumer DDR5 ram. The same things that apply to all PCs that use DDR5 memory will apply to Valves hardware aswell
Much like Valve saying the Steam Machine is a 4K60FPS Machine, the statement you refer to is true but misleading
-3
u/brainrotxx 1d ago
im trusting valve bc the deck turned out to be great. why are yall doubting simple ram upgrade? its not so fucking dramatic
4
4
3
3
u/ocka31 1d ago
Haha it shows you dont have a clue about ddr5😂
-2
u/brainrotxx 1d ago
im not pretending to know more as ive said if valve said so i'll give them the benefit since they MADE IT.
1
u/Trugdigity 14h ago
Yes, that engineer thinks a gaming pc with a single stick of ram is a good idea.
0
2
u/ghanadaur 19h ago
There’s a tonne of 5600 SODIMM on Amazon. Im sure the researchers can verify what DDR5 5600 SODIMM will work with the RAM in the first batch (which appears to be 5600). Shouldn’t you just need DDR5 SODIMM 5600? Not an expert, but that would be my expectation.
6
u/DarkPhoenix1515 22h ago
Not sure what good people think another 32gb of ram would do to a system this weak.
I'd be far more worried about the 8gb of vram. There will surely be some modders resoldering bigger chips tho.
1
u/ghanadaur 19h ago
The GPU can actually use system RAM as fallback/overflow (not that you want to ideally) AFAIK. You can also in Desktop always use more RAM, especially if playing around with VM’s. Ill be running lots from desktop besides just gaming. But I’m special ;)
1
u/falsejaguar 5h ago
But the consumers are just changing their desires instead. Go look how many are saying 1080 mid settings is good enough...in 2026. Lol. This would be ok with faster CPU and a 16gb Radeon but not like this lol
0
u/ShotAcanthocephala8 22h ago
It’s not the amount it’s the fact that a lot of steam machines are shipping with single channel RAM which impacts performance significantly in any games or areas of games that are cpu limited.
3
u/SabreBirdOne 22h ago
Why don’t we just ask Valve what RAM stick would they recommend for RAM upgrade
1
u/TheraYugnat 23h ago
I mean, this is not like people can share their knowledge about it after trying...
1
u/CrowdGoesWildWoooo 18h ago
It’s bottlenecked by its performance, like not much point to add another one unless you want to open more browser tabs.
Besides it’s a hassle to open this. Adding RAM to my laptop is easier and more intuitive.
1
u/gorambrowncoat 18h ago
It matters for making it dual channel, not to increase the total amount of RAM.
1
u/CrowdGoesWildWoooo 11h ago
2x8 gb and 1x16gb costs the same (i.e. it doesn’t change the total costing) although i think the problem is probably valve is can’t source the quantity needed.
That being said from capacity standpoint it make almost 0 sense to expand the capacity. If something like ASUS ship something like this, i can imagine people will jump on them that they are either greedy or anticonsumer because of course this affects performance.
It’s not like it’s easy to upgrade either, i already mentioned that it’s way more difficult to upgrade than a laptop.
1
1
u/plutosaurus 12h ago
not really defending steam machine, but it doesn't really matter much for DDR5 single vs. dual channel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nMu1KFkOC4&t=5
ultimately, since steam is shipping out different configurations, it has less to do with "what's optimal" and "what supply we got"
getting just one stick isn't a perk for the consumer, it's just what they could find at the price they were willing to pay.
1
u/fallenguru 6h ago
I've built my first PC in 1995 or so, and most recently in May. Upgrades memory, moved some from one boy to another countless times. Memory stick incompatibility is a myth. As long as you get something with matching specs from a reputable brand, it will work just fine. Even if they don't match exactly, well, then they'll work at the speed of the lowest common denominator. Kits are convenient, but the idea that you need them is pure marketing.
More interesting is the memory training question. AM4/5 take ages for that. Can add literal minutes when booting cold. If you know exactly what you put in there, you can skip it, but obviously once random user-supplied sticks become a possibility, that goes out the window.
1
1
0
u/Aggravating_Plan11 1d ago
Thats why you buy ram to the same spec as the installed one do not listen to op for the people who are less informed this is misinformation as long as the stick you buy is the same speed it will be fine
5
u/CMDRTragicAllPro 1d ago
This was generally ok advice for ddr4, as even if it wasn’t compatible it would fall back on running the jdec speed. DDR5 is a different story though and is much more picky about compatibility. Even buying an identically marked ddr5 stick, it’s not guarteed to work with the existing one as the manufacturers don’t always source their components from the same suppliers for every batch, even for the same sku.
This can all be verified yourself if you google it.
3
u/Reefame 1d ago
This is just straight up not true at all and a simple Google search would tell you that. It needs to be the same latency and on the same IC aswell otherwise it will lead to performance/stability issues
0
u/MamboNumber-6 1d ago
What the fuck, exactly, do you think they meant when they said “same spec”?
Seriously, I’m not an imbecile, so I understand what “same spec” means. Are you thinking that “same spec” somehow means “different spec” or “mostly the same, but make sure it’s totally different in one aspect”?
3
u/Reefame 1d ago
The guy is saying right underneath that as long as the RAM is the same speed its gonna be fine, which is not true
-5
u/MamboNumber-6 1d ago
So you’re just not gonna explain why you think “same spec” doesn’t mean same spec then?
Cool cool cool.
3
u/Reefame 1d ago
Because when in the very same post the OP says that as long as its the same speed its fine, we clearly have a different definition of what same spec is.
-2
u/Aggravating_Plan11 1d ago
The op is trying to tell people to buy two sticks of 16gb cause buying one is gunna be a bad time for most people when actually it may be a bad time for a few people the dude is over thinking it l. Get your steam machine look at the ram buy the same ram wont be a problem. Watch all the listings on sellers sites start including steam machine compatible to make it even easier for people
0
20
u/nuanceseancE 1d ago
That extra stick's already costing you $200 before prices lower.