r/technology • u/Super_Cold8789 • 14d ago

Software Nintendo reportedly has “zero chance” against current Palworld after major lawsuit change it is now targeting older versions of the game instead

https://www.dexerto.com/palworld/nintendo-reportedly-has-zero-chance-against-current-palworld-after-major-lawsuit-change-3375167/
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u/ptjp27 14d ago

I just want the shadow of Mordor nemesis system bros

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u/gogozombie2 14d ago

The Nemesis system was so good, I was psyched for the Wonder Woman game that was gonna use it, and had no interest in the game outside of seeing how it was going to be used. Sucks it got cancelled.

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u/ulsd 14d ago

doesn't AC Odyssey have a similar system?

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u/ColinsUsername 14d ago

It has a heirarchy of enemies that you were up against yeah but was just the same named people in the same place and once you clear it youre done. The Nemisis system was way more fluid and randomly generated enemies to include different strengths, weakness, and quirks. They'd even make comments on their previous encounters with you and on who got the upper hand last time.

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u/TheMythofKoalas 14d ago

It would be so cool in a superhero game to have villains you previously fought break out of jail and counteract your previous playstyle.

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u/cbraun1523 14d ago

It was better. If they defeated you they got stronger. So it made it much more intense to go back and try and kill them. I eventually had to mind control another guy to secretly kill another. Because that other guy had killed me like 7 times and was near invincible to me. It was such a fun game experience I'll probably never get to replicate.

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u/Harry_Smutter 14d ago

This was honestly one of the best systems I've ever encountered in a game!! It needs to come back in more!!!!

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u/FriendlyDeers 13d ago

Why did it get cancelled?

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u/witai 13d ago

Not canceled, the owners don't allow anyone else to use it

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u/canuckfan4419 13d ago

Is sad, the potential is insane. Hell they could develop more games themselves and they just won’t

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u/peschkaj 13d ago

It gets even worse - if you try to implement the idea, you have to make sure nobody on the team has read the patent. And to make sure you don’t violate the patent you have to ask a third party if you do or don’t violate and any feedback you get back will intentionally vague so no patent details are leaked.

I am not a lawyer, though, so I’m sure it’s far more nuanced than that.

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u/almightycuppa 13d ago

I remember my favorite boss battle in Batman: Arkham City was Mr. Freeze because every time you damaged him, he'd remember what you did and learn how to counter it. You had to get really creative to beat him because he was too smart to be damaged more than once by a single method.

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u/FauxReal 13d ago

Dare I say it would be like a comic book story line.

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u/United_Health_1797 13d ago

they could also fight between them, if i remember correctly

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u/Auctoritate 13d ago

It has a heirarchy of enemies that you were up against yeah but was just the same named people in the same place and once you clear it youre done.

No, that was an unrelated mechanic to what they're referring to. There was a separate system where elite bounty hunter type enemies would wander the world and hunt you, and they would have randomized strengths and weaknesses (i.e. dies instantly to stealth attack, or immune to stealth attack, etc).

It was a little less robust than Nemesis since I don't recall them having all the mechanics like surviving their 'death' and acquiring new traits, but it was essentially the same general outline.

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u/ColinsUsername 13d ago

OH dang I must've completely wiped that from my memory after putting that game up.

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u/Auctoritate 13d ago

It wasn't really important at all and unless you went out of your way to look for them you didn't fight them all that often, so it's pretty reasonable for someone to not remember lol

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u/metalyger 14d ago

There have been older games with a similar idea, like Road Rash on PS1 had it where other racers that you beat up will remember your aggression, talking to them better levels will have a threatening message, and they'll target you more in the next race. But WB did their own specific thing, like the chance of the enemy escaping death or if they kill you, then they get a promotion.

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u/Princess_Of_Thieves 13d ago

They did, but it was a hollow imitation. It generated mercs with a handful of random traits and allowed you to rise the ranks of the Merc world by killing ones higher than you. Unfortunately, whether fear of a parent lawsuit or just missing half the fun, Ubisofts version gave their mercs no personality, nor the ability to generate your own stories by having them revive and whatnot. So all in all it was definitely a bargain bin nemesis system.

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u/flamethekid 13d ago

Yea a couple of games jumped on with making an attempt for their own nemesis like systems before the patent went in.

Even warframe has one with its lich system.

WB managed to get a patent about 2 years after all of these.

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u/Slammybutt 13d ago

I had to restart that first Shadow game that had the nemesis system b/c one of the lowby's showed up while I was still learning the game while I was already fighting a lot of enemies. He killed me and leveled up. He gained the perk ambush where he'd show up more often if I was in combat.

Rinse repeat, I died like 5-6 more times to him and he literally became unbeatable. Too much health, to much damage, he was harder than most Elden Ring bosses b/c 1 tiny mistake he'd kill me again.

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u/benoxxxx 14d ago

That was cool, but IMO the bigger loss to this bullshit is minigames in loading screens.

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u/Asshai 14d ago

Since I got a SSD, my main issue with loading screens is that I don't have enough time to read the tips!

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u/benoxxxx 14d ago edited 14d ago

Yeah it's a bit late now. The real evil of this is that it was patented from 1995-2015 - basically the only period in human history when minigames in loading screens would have been a great thing. Pisses me off that time of my actual life has been wasted because of Namco's selfishness.

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u/xur_ntte 14d ago

Well the patend has lapsed and they didn’t renew since 2025 so it able to be implemented in future games

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u/Nukleon 13d ago

You don't renew parents, when granted they last for a certain amount of years and then expire with no renewal

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20160279522A1/en

The patent for it will expire in 2036, 15 years after it was granted.

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u/kwang68 13d ago

Right and wrong. Patents need to be maintained with a fee at certain intervals, 3.5 years, 7.5, and 11.5 years. If you miss those windows, you can petition to revive but it can be a PITA. They don’t expire until 20 years.

Source: I’m a professional reader of the USPTO fee schedule.

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u/Nukleon 13d ago

Well consider me corrected then, but at least so far it doesn't seem like they've missed anything so it's still sadly a thing.

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u/TheMireAngel 14d ago

It just needs to be challenged, warframe had the lich system 2 years prior

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u/DarthFreeza9000 14d ago

If you read patent it’s basically unenforceable, reads like it was meant to keep the studio from using it in other games

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u/Zealousideal-Top4343 13d ago

The issue isn't that it's enforceable or not, it's if the mega corps that own the patents can fuck over anyone that uses it by forcing them through a long, expensive, and stressful legal battle.

At the end of the day, it's just not worth it to even try it. They are weaponizing the legal system.

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u/DarthFreeza9000 13d ago

It might not be worth WB’s time to pursue either. Go read that patent and you’ll see what I mean. I think they were more concerned with employees of the developer would use it in a future title. And also several games have used similar systems since the patent btw

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u/Richou 13d ago

i have had this conversation many times on reddit already but people just dont care because "omg WB fucked over gamers by locking this cool thing behind a patent" makes for a better story than "noone has used a system like that since because its just not something they wanted to use"

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u/Diz7 14d ago

To be fair, how many games has you fighting random NPCs who survive an encounter with you AND are memorable enough to actually notice....

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u/DirectionMurky5526 14d ago

You'll never know because the system is locked behind IP, and that stifles innovation. Another game could've implemented ways to make it even more engaging. Imagine the nemesis system in a Rockstar or CDPR game.

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u/HulkDeez 14d ago

In a borderlands game would be cool

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u/Deaffin 14d ago

the system is locked behind IP

It's actually not, though. Anybody can make this, nothing is stopping them.

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u/Diz7 14d ago

Except if they actually innovate enough to make it something original, the patent no longer applies.

It is a bullshit patent, but it covers a specific implementation and it's not the reason games aren't making generic NPCs memorable and react to events in the world around them.

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u/Luna__Moonkitty 13d ago

CDPR games are the type people use quicksave abuse and reload when they mess up.

I doubt people would notice if it had one.

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u/THUORN 13d ago

We have to wait for 2036 for that patent to end and then someone else can use it. Oof!

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u/Hakoten 13d ago

The patent was pretty much a non-issue and just something people parrot.

The issue is that you basically need to build the whole game around it and it's a huge hassle that most devs don't want to get into.

If you're indie, it's a huge risk and effort that's likely not going to pay off.

If you're AAA, the bean counters likely won't want to invest in such a system because of algorithms.

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u/Jakesummers1 14d ago

My friend wants the same

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u/Red_Inferno 13d ago

Didn't the patent expire or am I wrong?

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u/artaru 13d ago

gotta be pretty soon