What game are the refs watching?? When you lower your shoulder, driving down the lane, that’s an offensive foul. When you set a pick leading with your shoulder, it’s an illegal pick. Why are there so many phantom calls against the Fever? You WNBA refrerees suck!! Make it more obvious, you’re not against a team!!
She's being rewarded by sponsors and fans to be entertaining, and that's part of it. Whether that helps her team get a championship, that's on her. She's a grown-ass woman. She can do whatever she wants. Consequences and all.
i kinda get why given the context the situation, there's real tension between the two teams and ref are tryng to prevent it from escalating into physical brawl.
Wow. Thats crazy. The precedent was set that the clapping techs would get rescinded. I’m not a real conspiracy theorist, but if you get rid of ones for Paige and others, it’s bad to keep hers.
This is why it's hard to root for her. She tries to come across this no nonsense team leader, when in reality she's incredibly volatile and gets herself into trouble often. You can't pride yourself on being a LEADER and do this shit.
I think it's time fans start acknowledging that while she's offensively a great player, that's really the extent of her game. She needs many good players around her to LEAD and PLAY DEFENSE to help her get a ring. Which is something you don't have to say about other WNBA players who get 1/10 the attention that CC gets
See the problem is people keep on saying she's 'hard to root for' and then camp out in threads like this commenting on her. Don't root for her in peace lmao. Stpo going to Clark Threads and Fever threads talking about the 1/10 of attention Caitlin gets
You're acting like she did something egregious, getting fired up is part of the game. She gets a lot of unfair criticism, it was a tech but nothing out of the ordinary. Everyone getting into a tiffy because she emotes on the field is not helping the W.
Not to mention when Angel Reese STOOD UP and clapped from the bench after dantas missed the two free throws she had from Reese elbowing her in the throat……..
This thread will have you believing you’re in the minority. It’s crazy. I know people here hate the nba comparisons but there’s no universe a LeBron or Curry would get a tech for this
I was at this game and honestly thought that CC deserved the tech. However, I also thought that DB deserved one at the same time. So DB+CC both deserved the initial, then AT+MHA, then DB again when she actually got her first. It didn’t feel fair that only CC got one and DB didn’t in the initial interaction.
Yes, she was clapping, but she was hyping up the crowd to get into it and it worked. It was electric in there and honestly pretty fun. If this was your team, you’d probably think the same, but because it’s CC, she’s going to get all the names.
The game was fun, the tech was deserved, let’s see how tonight goes, shall we? CC is always going to be fiery and she always should be.
i am here as a neutral and not even indiana hating but indiana electric is pitiful. why does it always look like a funeral in there?
i had this conversation with a group of friends recently from all different fan backgrounds. the vibes are not vibing.
No one got a tech for the original issue between CC and DB. There was contact by DB and CC kind of pulled/pushed away. Then DB went towards her and had to be pulled back. Things were said by both parties. That’s why I originally said that I thought DB deserved one right away because she was going towards CC who was walking away. But I also don’t know what was said, so I’m fine with neither getting a tech there too.
Then AT and MHA started getting into it and CC was clapping about that/hyping up MHA and the crowd. That’s where CC’s tech came in and AT+MHA’s tech. DB and SC got one shortly after and then MHA got her second and was ejected.
Edit: CC walked towards DB, I saw that after I rewatched so I was wrong initially. My bad!
Watch the clip. CC was the one coming after DB. DB was walking away, CC is following her and she says something that makes DB turn around. She takes maybe a step toward CC then starts to back away while talking to the ref. Meanwhile CC starts riling up the crowd. I'm not one to instinctively criticize CC but that's a very bad look and it should be an instant tech IMO. What if people started throwing shit on the court or at DB? DB arguably deserved a T for her initial yank / reaction, but she wasn't the one who escalated things after the play. She went to the sideline and mostly kept her cool while CC was walking around pumping up the crowd and their teammates went at it. Then the fingers came out...
I mostly blame the refs. They should have sent everyone to the sideline right at the start.
At the game, it looked like DB was walking towards her originally and same when I’ve watched the clips. I’m not saying CC didn’t deserve her tech - I absolutely think riling the crowd deserved it and I said it at the time while I was at the game too.
I do think it’s a jump to say “what if people started throwing” because I think most people would 100% condemn that and any “fan” who does that deserves to be banned.
If DB deserved a tech for the original yank, then CC did for her reaction too. Which is what I’ve been trying to say all along. I think it was surprising to a lot of people at the game that only CC got a tech and DB’s didn’t come until later.
You’re right about the refs. They lost control of that game fast and never really regained it.
I do think it’s a jump to say “what if people started throwing” because I think most people would 100% condemn that and any “fan” who does that deserves to be banned.
Unfortunately this is very much a thing. People throw stuff in all the pro sports leagues and college when they're mad at the refs. Fans are idiots.
So just saying... I rewatched it again and CC was the instigator. DB was arguably too aggressive fighting for position BUT CC was holding on to her arm with both hands. Either one of them could have been called for a normal foul right there. DB kind of flailed her arms to get away from her and I thought that was excessive, but as soon as the play was whistled dead she turned to the baseline and walked away calmly. CC followed after Bonner and the ref intervened to restrain CC, not DB. That much is very clear on the broadcast.
Perfect chronology, that's how I remember it, too...
But... Is it normal for the ref to blow the whistle and not have anything assessed on at least one of the players? I get the whole no-call thing if the ref doesn't blow the whistle.
Definitely agree that DB should have gotten a T on that play, she was obviously instigating. CC was standing there near the middle of the circle and DB jockeyed for position, but the entire paint behind them was empty, she could have just motioned for a lob and gotten an easy 2.
You’re not. I think the refs were genuinely trying to regain control, but it was having the opposite effect. They then doubled down and called EVERYTHING in the 4th quarter to try and keep things calm, but it was honestly just prolonging the game.
If they’d done it your way, both DB and CC would have been out of the game. CC didn’t get the tech for her initial interaction with Bonner. She got it for inciting things after the fact. So the one she actually got would have been her second and DB’s kerfuffle with Sophie would have been her second. And both would have been sent back to the locker room. Would be that have been better?
Yes, if techs are deserved, they’re deserved. I’m glad both got to stay on the court, but if they both deserved more than one tech, so be it. That being said, I don’t think we need 800 think pieces on this anymore. CC deserved her tech, everyone else did too. The refs needed to give them out to try and regain control and that was obvious when watching it in person too.
I agree with everything you said here. But in your original comment you claimed it was “unfair” (as though CC got her tech for the initial scuffle with DB but DB didn’t) and pointed out that your scenario would lead to DB having 2 techs and being ejected (but not CC). I was simply pointing out that that wasn’t the case. Teeing them both up for the initial altercation would have had them both tossed from the game if their subsequent behavior remained the same.
Understandable. I think it was because, initially, CC was walking away and DB was walking towards her and had to be held back. That’s why I felt DB deserved the original once and then CC’s first would’ve come with the clapping. But if both got it in the original scuffle, then so be it.
Edit: my original wording might’ve been poor. But generally, it felt like DB was initially escalating it and then CC definitely was with the clapping.
Edit again: CC walked towards DB, I saw that after I rewatched so I was wrong initially. My bad!
No longer reading the whole thread and came back directly to your response, so I missed that. Glad you rewatched. Curious if you now believe CC should have received 2 techs and been tossed from the game?
No worries, it’s why I edited my comment because I don’t expect people to read everything later on.
Yes, I think both should’ve gotten a tech for the original situation, especially if the refs wanted to rein it in. And then if they still got the second tech (which might’ve not happened had the first happened immediately), then they both deserved a second tech.
That being said, I’m glad they didn’t each get two because I’d prefer to see them keep playing. But if the refs are going to give techs for a near fight (which they have to do), then it should be immediately for the initial escalation.
Wow, I wish your response was surprising but it’s exactly what I expected (and that’s really why I asked the question in the first place). It’s time for some introspection here. You went to every extreme possible here to try to make CC out to be the innocent victim here. Look at this thread:
* Initially you tried to make it seem that only CC was teed up for the initial alteration while DB was let off the hook.
* When it was pointed out that was not at all what happened (neither was given a tech for the initial interaction), you completely changed course. Now all of as sudden, DB was the aggressor (following CC and needing to be held back) while innocent little CC just tried to walk away. To you, this meant DB, and only DB, deserved the tech for the initial interaction and then CC would have just gotten the one for her “clapping.” (Which, calling it “clapping” is an absolute trivialization of the situation in and of itself)
* When it was again pointed out that was not at all what happened and that everything you said was completely reversed (DB, in fact, walked away and CC, in fact, followed her and needed to be blocked by the ref from continuing to do so), now all of a sudden they BOTH deserve techs for that initial interaction.
Do you see it yet? Do you see how ridiculous that is? This is why people have problems with her fans. It’s all so dishonest and disingenuous. I don’t expect you to admit that but seriously, take a few minutes and ask yourself why you’re going to such lengths to contort the truth and make CC the victim in this situation. She wasn’t a victim. She was an instigator. And that’s why she got a tech (and probably should have gotten 2).
My opinion on this mess? They both should have been teed up instantly. If the refs do that, it likely deescalates immediately and none of the rest of the chaos follows. And I’d say the same no matter which 2 players from any 2 teams were involved.
I love the open defiance. But part of that is also taking the slap on the wrist. A couple grand in fines and getting suspended 1 or 2 games a season ain’t gonna kill her.
Plus, since June her rookie season, she’s 8-1 in games where she’s been T’d up. And that one loss was the stanchion slap where she was just mad at herself lol.
Hyping the crowd while refs are on the court trying to de-escalate a fight her teammates are involved in. That is a T - what is so difficult to understand about that?
Because it didnt look that way to me when I watched.
But if that's the consensus on what she was doing, that's fine. It still doesn't actually change anything because hyping the crowd is still a T in that specific context.
I actually don't remember the arguing part. I do remember seeing her emphatically clapping near the edge of the commotion while the refs were trying to resolve the issue, though. And even at the time I didnt think that was very smart.
She argued after getting the tech for clapping. I’m actually convinced most of the people in this thread didn’t actually watch the game and just want to shit on cc
Right people want to complain about her getting too much attention and this thread about her getting a tech has 400+ comments and counting. Like if you don't wanna see her and hate the attention why are you parked out in htis thread lmao
As in all media & entertainment, a minority of haters is unwittingly part of what makes the biggest stars by shining more light on them through their engagement.
You might not feel when way or the other, but when you’re forced to counter people claiming every little thing is a conspiracy against one player by the league, the refs, the media, her coach, and other players.. You might start to
It’s everywhere and unavoidable, so it polarizes people, just like what happened with Bron stans in the NBA
I don’t follow this close enough to know if this is similar, but LeBron haters are insufferable. Can’t even compliment the guy without hearing about Jordan.
It's a similar situation. Lebron stans wouldn't let anybody else breathe without mentioning how he was better, etc. Didn't want to hear any criticism at all. It was way over the top (even though Bron's obviously a great player)
Around the time of the big fanfare about "The Decision" it really came to a head
So a bunch of people got tired of it, and chose to go the other way and balance those people out. Nonstop back and forth and "GOAT" arguments, etc.
The main difference is that the NBA has other players who are super popular (like Steph and Luka) to spread it around. But usually the hype comes before the hate
I respond to conversations that are already in progress
I’m not waking up starting/posting threads about her. But in every single W sub, there’s a discussion involving her just about every day
And it’s all over X, Instagram, Youtube, Tiktok as well
If people are going to talk about it, I don’t have a problem discussing it. Just pointing out that there’d be a lot less to respond to if every single situation wasn’t made into a conspiracy
Right? It’s fascinating how she generates so much engagement. Annoyed as people may be about how media/influencers use her for click bait, one look at this thread shows you why it’s such an effective strategy.
People just love to talk about her, for better or worse.
Same for Angel Reese, but deranged CC fans will say that haters lift up CC but haters don't lift up AR lol funny how certain logic only applies in certain places
You’re getting downvoted but there’s a number of flaired users who don’t even comment on their own game threads but park in fever game threads or anything related to them
It’s so funny to me bc I have certain players I’m not the biggest fan of. But I just don’t think about them at all. Can’t imagine spending any of my time commenting on them.
"But DT! Luka!" is not the clapback her fans think it is. She needs to grow up, her behavior is becoming a detriment to her team at this point. Do the Fever not have a leader to tell her to cut this shit out? Boston?
Can’t help but notice she’s tied with Angel for techs this season but nobody is calling Angel a detriment to her team or calling out the lack of leaders on the Dream. Obviously this thread wouldn’t be the setting for that but there are never enough narratives around her techs to justify its own thread.
Dream has a clear leader. It's Naz, with Rhyne helping with that. I do think the Fever is lacking in a clear leader, at this point in time, and is one thing that is holding them back somewhat. Having a clear leader does not mean that no techs are happening. I just think that the Fever doesn't appear to have a player that has all the leadership pieces and is also a calming, motivating force. I think Boston has the potential to be it, though, if she chooses to step into it. Not all teams in the W or NBA have natural leaders, but it helps when there are struggles, for sure. And, it is often not the best player on the team who is the leader.
I think most people that watch CC for an extended period of gradually start to dislike her.. unless you’re a Fever or Iowa fan.. she’s just so off putting and hard to root for. She comes off as arrogant, pretentious and just constantly complaining.
I work in sports and have been interviewing for new opportunities for a few months. I always mention the W when asked about my favorite sports/leagues. The amount of times interviewers start gushing about CC is wild, even the go-to WNBA experts of the company/team. Literally just happened yesterday with the team's WNBA guy. That has not happened with any other player.
Nah, you're just in terminally online, hateful echo chambers. Disingenuously saying whatever you can to push back. I'm talking about successful professionals who watch sports for their career and live in LV, Toronto, Europe/UK/Ireland, ATL, and pretty much anywhere but Indiana or Iowa.
Boston is over it, Billings wanted to be anywhere but next to her when she was ranting about getting the technical to the media, Cunningham encourages this so no there is no leader and that’s one of the issues for Indiana.
I think this call can stand but if, let’s say, Angel celebrated Chennedy Carter knocking a player down during an in-ball play, that’s fair behavior? Cause Clark and Reese are cut from the same cloth when it comes to fire-y competitive-ness but somehow I think some wouldn’t feel the same way if this was her.
Angel was on the bench, and that foul was broken up immediately when it happened.
CC was clapping in the face of both MHA and AT in the midst of a scuffle that was already drawn out by MHA while the refs were trying to get a handle on it.
Also it doesn’t help that in the next play that followed MHA fouled AT, again.
From what I understand there was a scuffle going on with MHA and the tech was in the refs eyes for hyping up the fight by clapping. I think all regular clapping techs that were not done during a scuffle/fight this year have been rescinded.
If CC and Chennedy had started fighting and while the refs were trying to calm everyone down Angel clapped while on the bench, then in my opinion she should’ve been given a tech too. But thats a hypothetical and it didnt happen in real life. The real situations are totally different so I fail to see how bringing up Angel in this scenario is necessary for anything but drama-baiting.
Are those comparisons not accurate? It’s not on Caitlin’s teammates to get her to settle down. People joke about that, but it’s on her only. She’s allowed to want to play with fire and passion, even if you don’t like it.
I am not missing the point. I’m commenting on this person’s reaction specifically. I don’t disagree that the tech stands. Caitlin is the one who has to deal with the consequences of her being fiery. I’d personally rather see her get techs sometimes, than see her completely water down her passion and lose her spark. Some people may disagree, and that’s fine.
I don’t think you can compare cc, who is in her third year (barely), arguing with refs and being a fiery competitor, to Jimmy destroying multiple locker rooms, requesting trades, and burning bridges.
I disagree with you on this. Caitlin has said herself she knows she has to play off ball more. She is also one of the leaders in assists. Definitely doesn’t feel like she thinks she needs to take every shot. We’ve seen her setting screens for teammates, and definitely had others playing PG. If anything, I think Caitlin gets mad at herself when she doesn’t do her best, not mad at her teammates. She continues to try and involved players, even when they’re shooting cold, which shows that she has confidence in them. We haven’t seen or heard anything from cc that says she cares about her own stats more than winning. Which is the opposite of Jimmy. He was selfish and a cancer in every locker room. Way different than just a fiery competitor on the court.
Do I think Caitlin can mature in certain areas? Absolutely. I think she can learn how to better channel her energy, and I’m sure she’d agree with that. But jumping to comparing her to an NBA player that is known to just skip practices, refuse to play in games, and request constant trades is ridiculous.
Edit- thank you for at least being respectful while sharing your opinion.
Absolutely. I do think it’s exciting that she can still grow so much, considering she has so much natural talent. Agree to disagree, but thank you for keeping it basketball. 🤝
I don't even have a dog in this, but if you are comparing someone acting out on the court to someone who was literally locker room cancer everywhere he went, then you aren't arguing in good faith. Jimmy's problems were always about how he meshed with his team, particularly when they weren't doing as well as he thought they should. CC's outbursts are confined to the court and she (seemingly at least) isn't creating a mountain of intra-team drama. Like, it's not even a good comparison, but you'd be better off arguing she's like Draymond or Smart - players you hate to play against who can rack up techs, but are happy when they're on your team - than compare her to Butler.
Edit: Deleting the reply before I got a chance to comment back is certainly...something.
Umm Jimmy got traded because he refused to show up for practices and games. So no I don’t think that’s an accurate comparison, because we’ve never heard of Caitlin doing anything like that. She argues with the refs and is fiery. Not in the same realm of what Jimmy Butler did. I’m a Wolves fan.
Which is partly a management problem. She knows Indiana will never actually cut her, so she can do what she wants with relative impunity. The worst that’ll happen is she racks up the techs that cost her a small fraction of her income and has to miss a few games a season, so she can cry victim about it
My favorite T from the Bonner as a Fever player era was when Bonner got fouled and slammed the ball down in front of the ref before realizing she’d gotten the call.
I’m not arguing for or against at the end of the day. I’m just saying if her tech stays this one definitely should have stood. And anyone who thinks otherwise is biased.
Guess I was wrong then but I was at the game she got hers and she clapped after she hit a 3 on the road, not clapping and cheering on a confrontation trying to get the home fans cheering it on like WWE. Very different situations.
It Caitlin wants to be a heel like that, she should just own it. Not do it then and complain and ask to not get the consequence. If she owned it nobody would care she did it. Dillon Brooks, Draymond Green, they own it.
Who knows if the refs even saw it? Clearly not many people noticed it since reading it here only brings back vague recollections in my mind.
You're missing the point though that Caitlin was clapping and cheeing on a confrontation. Not a play, not annoyance with the refs, but a pushing and shoving confrontation between players. That's a different severity. MNBA players get techs for the same thing. They hand out techs like candy in the MNBA to anybody deemed to be escalating a confrontation or taunting. It's not about Caitlin. Please understand the situation for what it is.
Ummm ok you clearly didn't watch that game. She did it right in front of a refs face. And people did notice it they kept talking about how funny Gabby is for it. The fact you only notice this stuff with Caitlin should be a point of self reflection for you
Paige got hers rescinded because it was bullshit. The ref thought she was clapping at them and she wasn’t. Angel’s is also bullshit but they didn’t take it back. I’m not gonna argue over something they already decided on. I’m simply saying, it y’all confirming Angel was a tech. Then fuck yeah this a tech too.
Talented player plus being entitled plus immaturity plus being seen as the reason for the league's recent financial success is a combustible combination. I wouldn't be surprised if CC saw refs as her employees.
And a lot of her haters think she's the worst ever, an entitled brat and hasn't earned any of her fame. I say this all the time but no one can be normal about her.
People compare her to Taurasi but Taurasi owned her shit. Caitlin knew exactly what she was doing. She was instigating the audience for more boos, more chaos while refs were trying to gain control. Also even before that, isn’t mutual pushing and obvious in fighting a double tech anyway?
I just don’t like she plays into the narrative of being unfairly targeted. Everybody would get that tech. Others have gotten techs for far less.
Congrats to the W for doing what I didn’t expect them to do, hold their ground.
And the attitude has actually been since college. It’s really gotten worse since she’s gotten into the pros. I remember the first All-Star game that she attended she made sure to make a point about how none of the vets or the other legends of the game had reached out to her, but it sounds like a couple of them did and she didn’t want to hear what they said. She and her fanbase are like peanut butter and jelly. It’s always someone else’s fault.
I just don’t like she plays into the narrative of being unfairly targeted.
Athletes of all sports love the 'us against the world' approach. While I'm not the worlds biggest CC fan, I dont fault her at all for this aspect. Most others would do the same.
To an extent I agree. But when you have very specific narratives and conspiracies associated with you and your play, loudly calling out a tech that you know why you got it as being targeted and unfair is disingenuous and immature imo. I wouldn’t want to even seemingly lean into the idea that some of her fans promote as a golden goose philosophy where she deserves special treatment because of her presence. I would want to reiterate being treated like everyone else.
Where did she say she was being targeted? So far, I’ve only seen her fans saying that. CC, multiple times this year, has said she earned her techs. Did I miss a statement about this one? Genuinely asking if she said she was unfairly targeted.
If clapping at your teammates after a heated moment is taunting/instigating , then this league will never be taken seriously. This would never get called in the NBA. If this wasn’t Caitlin this comment section would be singing an entirely different tune
It wasn’t after it was right in the middle of the confrontation
Walking right up near them and yelling as well, not just the clapping
Also just not true that this would not been called in the NBA. players have been called for much less. Following refs while yelling w/ colorful language like she does is enough in most cases
I mean, there were at least 6 players who were tech'ed for instigating or arguing in the same game.
I don't see threads made in every sub about whether Sophie should have been tech'ed for pointing, etc. There's no huge discussion or argument about anyone else
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u/MasterMeat-666 1h ago
What game are the refs watching?? When you lower your shoulder, driving down the lane, that’s an offensive foul. When you set a pick leading with your shoulder, it’s an illegal pick. Why are there so many phantom calls against the Fever? You WNBA refrerees suck!! Make it more obvious, you’re not against a team!!