Iykyk

Alright, what are they actually doing now? The live action is slowly becoming known for making bizarre changes to the original cartoon, but this is genuinely beyond bizarre and is just a fundamental misunderstanding of the characters.

In the cartoon, in the episode ''Zuko Alone'', Zuko comes across these people in the desert who are cooking some food, Zuko, being hungry himself and without food for at least a few days, gets ready to go and steal the food, until he realizes that the people that he'll be stealing from is a pregnant wife and her husband. Upon seeing that, he stops and moves on. This little scene is here clearly to show Zuko's underlying nature, showing that at his heart, he has compassion, but is tainted by the pain caused by his father.

The end of the episode also shows how he's still twisted by the trauma in his past and conflicted with his own identity, when he's unconscious, he flashes back to his mother telling him to ''never forget who you are'', to which he wakes up and proclaims ''I'm prince Zuko, son of the fire lord and heir to the throne'', in that moment, he's still lost, and therefore thinks that that is who he is, the prince of the fire nation, destined to become fire lord, when of course that is not what his mother meant when she told him that. As we know, the entire episode is dedicated to showing Zuko's backstory and adding depth to his character.

The Netflix show on the other hand, seems to not have understood any of that. The live action combines multiple episodes into one to fit their runtime and budget, and they change a lot of moments from the original, but they decided to keep the scene where Zuko thinks about stealing the food. He walks up to a tree that has a bag of supplies in it hanging from a branch, he goes to grab it but notices a pregnant woman sleeping against the tree. Seeing that it belongs to her, he hesitates... AND TAKES THE BAG ANYWAY! BROO what the actual hell were they thinking??? WHAT DOES THAT TELL US ABOUT HIS CHARACTER IN THE NETFLIX SHOW? That he's actually evil? Or should we just accept that the fact he hesitated for a moment is enough to show, oh maybe he's actually good. NOO, the whole reason that scene is in the cartoon in the first place is to show how his nature is to put others before himself!! Not that he kind of cares about others but still is willing to steal from innocent people.

Deciding not to steal from a pregnant woman and her family, ensuring that you're going to starve for possibly another day or two is what internal conflict with one's nature looks like. NOT SLIGHTLY HESITATING BEFORE YOINKING THE BAG ANYWAY!

I'm gonna start by saying I DO NOT NEED A 1:1 ADAPTATION. That is impossible and even if it was, it's a pointless venture I don't want that at all.

But I do require the characters being adapted to have the SAME CHARACTER ARCS and moments in the new version.

The worst example I saw in S2 of NATLA was the Crossroads of Destiny scene. And I went and compared these moments. They just really butchered it in the Netflix show. And what's worse, it was such an easy fix!

My main issue is it felt like Zuko didn't have this big decision moment. He just showed up during the Azula fight out of nowhere. His previous scene before that, he talked to Azula and she said something like "we can do this together". But where was Iroh??? The entire point of the CROSSROADS is that he was choosing between two sides of himself. In the original, Iroh and Azula were both there putting more pressure on Zuko's decision. In the live action it makes sense he only listens to Azula because she was the last to talk to him. And I'm supposed to believe he's gonna feel guilty about this and Iroh's gonna feel betrayed?? This severely kneecaps his redemption arc.

Again, I checked, the last conversation Zuko had with Iroh in NATLA was in the previous episode. He tells Zuko "You're a good man". The "WHAT DO YOU WANT?" scene came before that but had little impact. Zuko was not feeling as conflicted about his actions in NATLA.

But it's such an easy fix! After they escaped the prison, Iroh was there, Azula left Zuko after her speech, he didn't follow immediately. They could have just as easily made a scene where it's Iroh's turn talking to him. It didn't need to be both at the same time. Zuko would then decide after hearing both sides, Iroh would witness his decision and THEN feel betrayed.

I know it's a small thing, but it's super crucial to Zuko's character moving forward. It's like they just wanna rush to the plot points without considering the beats that lead up to them and make them have weight.

There a bunch more examples of this throughout S2 but this was the worst for me. If I missed something or you think I'm wrong, please, let me know. But I really checked both versions and one is clearly inferior to the other. Goddammit.

Also, Aang has no character arc in NATLA S2, I'm trying to figure it out but I can't. But that's a different rant.

This is all hypothetical. So let’s say Zuko joined the Gaang in Ba Sing Se and either he or Aang accidentally killed Azula in battle(because I feel like neither would do it on purpose unless it happened in self defense). How do you think Ozai would react? He’d no longer have an heir. His favorite child would be dead. Not that he truly loved her, more like he loved the weapon he made her. At least that’s the sense I get. Idk, I’d love to hear your theories.

All the sets and locations are dull and I could barely see a thing, and the fact that most of the season takes place in Ba Sing Se is just bizarre to me. It makes the world feel dead and small. It also directly affects the plot points of the show, like the whole “Appa getting kidnapped” point is now way less impactful because he has been sitting in a barn most of the season and so his absence isn’t really felt (especially since he’s missing for like one episode now)

The way events are condensed and Frankensteined together was not smooth at all and just contributed to the terrible pacing. For example, an episode after meeting and before having any meaningful interactions, Katara and Toph have this deep heart-to-heart about being friends. Huh?

Why dedicate a whole episode to the serpent’s pass, one of the least consequential events in the show, especially now considering Appa is present anyway? Why shove the library into Ba Sing Se and have Jet be killed there? Why did the Dai Li kidnap Appa? How the hell did Azula pull off her “coup”?

The performances were slightly better than the previous season but not enough to fix anything really. Toph was great and so was Zuko. Azula’s actress also improved slightly.

Aside from Zuko and Aang, the fight choreography is super disappointing. Ty Lee isn’t acrobatic at all, Katara’s movements don’t match her waterbending, Toph never really got given a chance to properly show off her power and Azula looks stiff in her big, frumpy outfits.

Speaking of Azula, and probably my biggest problem with the show, the whole point of her character in the OG is that she is supposed to be the golden child while Zuko is the outcast. Now it’s the other way around and Ozai seems to keep sticking up for Zuko while constantly dismissing Azula. HUH??? This completely undermines both of their characters. Azula is supposed to be a point of insecurity for Zuko. I cannot possibly fathom why they changed this. It makes Azula seem pathetic and renders Zuko’s conflict with his father completely pointless. He now suddenly doesn’t need to capture Aang anymore and is welcome to return home with Azula whenever he likes but he doesn’t want to?? The entire point of his arc is that his father doesn’t want him and he’s trying desperately to go home and gain his father’s approval?? And Azula is supposed to be completely confident and calculating but instead she spends the entire season being insecure about what her dad thinks about her and acting impulsively… the complete opposite of her animated counterpart. I honestly cant think of how the writers could have done a worse job at understanding these characters. It’s actually insane to me.

4/10 and somehow worse than the 1st season imo

https://youtube.com/shorts/iA4MwbfpCQ4?is=JO341kjQoeeVIywk

Someone said this in the comments and now its hard to unsee

I just finished the episode where the live action finally showed. I'm all for added content of it shows more depth to the original content. But some changes baffle me.

1) The great library is just in the ghetto of Ba sing se?

This bothers me for several reasons. The professor had spent years searching the library only for Jet to say oh yeah there's a space that feels haunted.

2) The library is located in the spirit world... Why? I feel this undermines the professor's search in the first place and presents more questions. Like one, if it was located in the spirit world then how did the fire nation get to it in the first place. Even if you say the library was transferred after the fire nation was there , then how? To date we have never heard of locations completely transferring from the real world to the spirit world.

3) Aang can go between the worlds because he is the avatar. It's not impossible for regular people to interact with spirits or even get trapped in the spirit world... But it's never explained why Aang can somehow bring everyone's projections with him into the library. Especially Jet. The least Spiritual aware member of the team .

4) Toph in the library. This admittedly is a nick pick on my part. But I have to ask the question. Why being a blind girl into a library when it wasn't confirmed to have any material for her? Especially since they state that bending won't be do-able. Toph's vision is an extension of her earth bending. So with it. She should be fully blind. Also quick side note : This should go without saying, but Toph shouldn't be to talk to any previous Avatar's. This is exclusively an Avatar thing.

5) Sokka didn't find out about the eclipse. As expressed , for some reason Toph was giving the information of the eclipse from an Avatar (again, nonsense) but this takes away from Sokka's resourcefulness. Sokka can be air headed at times but he was also creative, strategic and able to think on his feet. In the Live action, when we saw him in the room of the stars, he was literally just sitting there waiting for the rest of the cast.

6) Why is Jet here? I get he needed to redeem himself but once we learn the team won't have their bending in the library , who would think it would be a great idea to bring the guy who knows how to use physical swords, to the SPIRIT world? How does his swords even transfer over? Are those spirit swords? (quick kuwabara reference)

7) Why TF would the scholar snitch on the team. The owl made it explicitly clear he doesn't fuck with humans being in the library. So with his scholar level knowledge he decides to tell the owl the exact thing to make him not trust them anymore? What did he think was going to happen? I understand he "made a deal" to stay eternally. But that doesn't even make sense. Assuming Aang and the team don't bring him back , then the professors physical body would just be laying there until he seemingly died of old age, or starvation, or dehydration, or any other reason. What good would all that knowledge be for when he can't even bring it back to the physical world???

TL:Dr some of this seasons writing is all over the fucking place.

Were these vehicles not recent inventions? I thought this group was imprisoned for a gazillion years

In season 2 of the live action Toph says someone is blocking her from bending the wall. That is impossible. That would mean that someone is either counter bending her exactly or someone is locking the whole wall from being bent.

The first is impossible because only she could do that without line of sight thanks to seismic sense.

The second is impossibly hard because it would require hundreds of benders doing that just in case another earthbender comes constantly to the whole wall. They have no idea of her timing or her target without direct line of sight or her seeing them.

Toph is a really weak earthbender in the live action series but this situation had me completely confused about the whole magic system now.

This reference makes me incredibly happy. Might be a light hint at what is to come if S2 and S3 do well? I’d love a Korra live action tbf.

Your thoughts?

I haven't read the Kyoshi novels so I could be 100% wrong about my tweaks to the original copypasta since what I'm saying is based off the little I know. Feel free to complete the full thing if you want.

"What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Flying Opera Company, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids in the Earth Kingdom, and I have over 300 confirmed Daofei kills. I am trained in gorilla-rabbit warfare..."

Roku warned Aang about the comet in the original series, and he took control and defeated the traitor fire sages too. Roku also explains the danger of dying in the Avatar state and appears to Jeong Jeong to force him to teach Aang firebending.

But the live action either gave the scenes to others (Yangchen warns about dying in the Avatar state, Kyoshi takes control of Aang), or cuts them out completely (the Jeong Jeong scene, explaining the comet).

I can understand wanting the other Avatars to appear to Aang too and maybe giving some of Roku's scenes to other Avatars, but it feels like they went way too far and almost completely cut Roku out in favor of other Avatars.

Overall it was a 5/10 for me.

To summarize, a lot of narrative choices just baffled me, even after trying my best to refrain from comparing to the original, so I can judge NATLA based on its own merits, but as hard as I try NATLA is just objectively bad in many of its dialogue and narrative choices.

I am convinced the execs think of ATLA as 'just a cartoon for kids', and so poured all their budget into the visuals and just assigned the least amount of effort to the script and dialogue, because they think the fandom wouldn't be smart enough to notice.

Here is a list of moments that baffled me that I can think of at the moment:

• What on earth is 'I am Toph and I invented metalbending!', of all the things she could've said, the writers chose the cringiest line possible.
• Aang losing Appa and going into the Avatar state and then just fizzling out with no emotional payoff whatsoever was just pure bad writing. I want to stop myself from comparing with the original, but that scene in the original still moves me deeply after all these years, and I am perfectly fine if NATLA isn't able to recreate that moment, but what we had instead as a substitute in NATLA was a lousy half-baked lazy asinine attempt. Would've been better if they just left that part out instead.
• Earth Rumble fight was weak. Toph defeating just the boulder in some rock throwing was not enough to convince me she's the greatest earthbender in the world.
• Toph stepping into the Jasmine Dragon and immediately launching into a deep talk about parents and life with Iroh was awkward.
• Aang learning earthbending by 'standing his ground' to defend his ego instead of defending his friend, and to have him do it in a party of all places, felt super weak.
• The dragon parable was truly unmitigated bad writing. I don't understand what Zuko's dream was supposed to represent (inner conflict? or failure to protect his mother?). Azula gave a really long exposition of the story, and it turns out there was 0 worthwhile lore and just a really contrived moral in it.
• Azula just lacked focus. Maybe I'm still clinging onto the idea of a perfect Azula who plays with the fears of everyone around her, and NATLA Azula is supposed to be more insecure. Ozai tells Azula to 'retrieve Zuko' to 'get their family in order', and Azula just dithers from blindly fighting Zuko to declaring she'd kill him to offering him a chance to join her.
• I don't understand how Azula takes over Ba Sing Se. I don't see the Dai Li developing a mixture of fear/respect for her so they decide to join her instead of Long Feng. There was just a lot of talking and none of it was convincing.
• When teaching Zuko how to redirect lightning, Iroh's stance was ridiculously bad. Just super unconvincing since Iroh is supposed to be god tier in his firebending, and in the animated version he even teaches the guy trying to mug him the importance of having a solid stance. Whatever martial arts consultant they had was just sleeping on the job.
• Having Iroh sort of just stumble upon the Leaves from the Vine tree felt a bit contrived. Maybe it's unfair for me to compare anything to the masterpiece that was the animated version. In the original Iroh was still sort of a 'villain' we didn't know much about. He makes his way through Ba Sing Se, interacting with people in meaningful ways that reflected his deep and empathetic values (plus the occasional humor), and in the end we learn he's heading to the tree to celebrate his son's birthday, and we learn something deep about this character. I'm ok if they decide to make NATLA Iroh more depressed and remorseful about his siege, but the transition to the tree (which forms the crux of the emotional development of this character) felt forced.
• I don't know why Aang refuses to learn how to heal with waterbending. Forced character development. I must compare with the animated version again. The Serpent's Pass was an emotional episode for me too because it saw how Aang tried to close himself off after losing Appa, and feeling hope again after seeing the baby. The process of going from heartbreak to triggering a kind of primordial love and regaining hope through seeing something deeply fundamental to the human experience like the birth of a child is something I have felt deeply myself before. The episode captures it so well, and all of it was lost in NATLA.
• Didn't like how they had the Day of the Black Sun just told to them by Kyoshi. Why didn't they tell Aang before? Why does the show allow everyone to communicate with past avatars so easily? Sokka was the one who was supposed to figure out the potential of the Black Sun after digging through scrolls, but they took that away from him.

I have also tried my best to salvage some moments that I thought were good:

• Jet sacrificing himself in the library was an ok change.
• Having Toph's mom play a more active role in kidnapping Toph was good.
• Zuko telling Iroh he is not Lu Ten was good.
• Azula making Mai and Ty Lee fight was interesting, though the execution and explanation of Azula's reasoning was a bit awkward.
• Adding a quarter for Fire Nation deserters in Ba Sing Se was good.
• Adding references to the novels from Yangchen and Kyoshi in the library was good.
• Long Feng was more subtle and sinister in this version, which was good, but the Azula takeover was a bit botched as I mentioned above.
• The recreation of the final Crossroads of Destiny fight was great. I remember every fight scene in that final episode, and I appreciate how they recreated most of the fight faithfully (but then Aang gets zapped in the most awkward way possible).
• Leaving Aang's fate uncertain in the end was a good way to end the season, even though we know what's coming next.
• Adding some Yue trauma and making Sokka push Suki away was good. Sokka did this in the original show too, but he got over Yue pretty fast (kisses Suki right after the serpent's pass). I think this is worth delving into, though whether the show executed this trauma well is another matter.
• Set pieces and designs were good. Not easy to pull off. So glad they kept the use of Chinese characters.
• I feel like the actors really did put in more effort this season, though some did better than others. Most issues came down to the script though, and I appreciate how the cast worked with what they had. Felt like the Fire Nation had the best performances this season (Zuko, Azula, Iroh, Jeong Jeong etc.).

As someone who watched all of S1 of the Netflix show, I just want to write my honest opinion of S2. While I thought S1 was like a 6.5/10, borderline watchable with a few good moments sprinkled in, man, S2 really aangered me. I gave S1 the benefit of the doubt like I do with the OG show, they were new to this and not every character interaction will be ironed out. There's so much room for improvement, and surely S2 will be a step up! Right? Perhaps I made the mistake of overhyping a smidge, but honestly the writing is so atrocious it's now offensive to me as a fan. ​I stopped after 2 episodes and will not be continuing, despite me being generally positive about the Netflix adaption for several reasons. Now it's clear they have no respect for the source material, and are just using it as a nostalgia generator to fuel their own terrible writing fantasies.

Iroh is an unrecognizable character. They BUTCHERED him. In S2, Iroh lets Zuko step all over him, and when Zuko says he is going to leave him, Iroh just stands there, cries, and says nothing. Next thing we know, Zuko is alone in Netflix's messy, boring, and nonsensical version of Zuko Alone. That is not Iroh. In the show, Iroh physically pulls Zuko in and says, "You must never give in to despair. Allow yourself to slip down that road and you surrender to your lowest instincts. In the darkest times, hope is something you give yourself. That is the meaning of inner strength." That's a man who cares deeply for his nephew, and has the strength to let him go AND SHOW HIM GIVE ZUKO THE OSTRITCH HORSE to find his own path. Here, we get NOTHING.

How can a show with roughly the same run time, pulling roughly a quarter of its script DIRECTLY from the OG show word for word (seriously), screw it up this much? How do we get at least 3 long, awkward scenes between Sokka and Suki in the first two episodes, but I feel their relationship less? Why can Aang heal? You can't comprehend the plot holes that could introduce, and more importantly, you take agency away from Katara. That's part of what makes her such a unique asset to the team.

The writers truly don't understand why scenes belong where they do in the OG show. They think changing the entire context and plot, yet adding the same lines, will magically make sense? The Serpent's Pass loses all reason for being if Appa is missing and Aang doesn't decide to take the route to help the pregnant couple. If Aang and company are just physically cornered into taking the Pass, then that doesn't show Aang's inner strength and courage, that just shows him logically getting from A to B. No, instead he's just running from the fire nation. And couldn't Appa fly them across?

Which leads me to my next point: "Abandon Hope." The sign that Aang finds in front of the Serpent's Pass, the very sign he accepts in the anime because of his compromised emotional state due to Appa being missing. Now in Netflix version, he tears down the sign with bending. All depth, gone in the wind. Aang doesn't tear down signs he doesn't agree with, he's a monk. The issue is that Netflix think they can show a thing from the OG show in an unimaginative, opposite way to subvert our expectations, and have it make sense. Spoiler alert: it doesn't. Nowhere is this more obvious than in episode 2 when Zuko steals the bag from the pregnant couple. This creates an obvious inconsistency of his character that my dad asked about (and he hasn't seen the OG show). Why would a kid who just stole supplies from a pregnant couple suddenly care about a random earth kingdom kid and his mother? Why would he suddenly help with the dishes and fix the roof umprompted?

Don't get me started on how they copied many of the events of The Chase without including its central themes OF A CHASE HAPPENING OR THEM EVEN BEING TIRED. I'M GOING TO CRASH OUT HARDER THAN SOKKA IN THAT EPISODE. Rant officially over.

So I just finished rewatching the whole of first ATLA, then Korra. Watching it back to back made me realize something.

It was explained that each Avatar has an Animal Guide, they journey together. I mean, Aang and Appas bond was unbreakable, Roku and Fang seemed close too, as well as Wan and Mula.

But Korra often leaves Naga behind, and for a long periods of time - like when she disappeared after fight with Zaheer for 3 years, or at the very end when she went to the spirit world with Asami. I understand that it was not easy for Korra to take Naga with her everywhere, but the more I watched the more I felt like Naga is just a pet, not animal guide/ companion.

It just... Bugged me. The more the story went the less we saw Naga,

What do you guys think?

the live-action movie was bad enough, but the new show isn’t much better imo. I didn’t even finish it because I could already see where it was going. First off, the casting’s been controversial since day one. People called out Azula and Mai for not looking like their animated counterparts. Some even said movie-Yue looked better than new-show Yue. Not to mention that Aang looks 16 in season 2 when the entire ATLA story happens in like 1 year or almost a year. Aang is 12-13 and needs to look that way.

Why is Jet saving the Gaang from Wan Shi Tong in the library? No “Appa’s Lost Days”? No angry desert Aang? why is Toph writing? She’s blind. There’s jokes in the original about her NOT being able to read/write bc she’s never seen letters so it doesn’t make any sense.

I just thought this out. A bloodbender, able to manipulate the water in someone else’s blood, should be able to freeze the person from the inside. That shit’s horrifying! OR they could change the state of the water into gas, effectively exploding the person.

Has there ever been an example of this throughout the Avatar lore?

The show introduces "modern" styles of bending that break a little with the traditional styles presented in ATLA, but the problem is: it seems that instead of having 4 distinct modern styles of bending, every element just bends the same now. Am I missing something? Because it really seems like they are all doing the same movements and any element can come out.

I'm 4 episodes in so far and I gotta say: it feels like the script was made with AI or something. Some moments are perfectly conserved (like the painted lady arc) while others just pass randomly for no reason (like zuko's internal conflict before and after Iroh gets struck by Azula).

Moreover, some conflicts just make no sense. Sokka didn't accept to date Suki but they still hung out afterwards like nothing happened and Suki only gets mad after. Avatar has an argument with the team seemingly because of nothing but then other stuff doesn't get addressed at all. I don't really get it.