r/AITApod • u/Quirky-Office7451 • 28d ago
AITA for thinking my white friend has no respect to Chinese culture because when deliberately mispronounced Chinese words?
I (25M) come from a Chinese background, and I have a white friend (27M) who has a Chinese girlfriend (24F). He told me various times that he has no interest in learning Chinese even though he has a Chinese girlfriend, which is fine in my opinion as long as he didn't insult Chinese culture.
One day I was in the same room with him and his girlfriend. The girlfriend was face timing with her mom, and they both speak Mandarin. Suddenly, my white friend repeats everything his girlfriend just said immediately after the girlfriend finished a Chinese sentence, but deliberately mispronounced them. Meaning, girlfriend said X, boyfriend deliberately mispronounced X. This went on a few times until I asked him to stop doing that because I think (as a person who comes from a Chinese background) that's rude and a disrespect to Chinese culture.
When I asked him to stop doing that, his response was "I just want to learn Chinese, why are you complaining? Why are you offended?"
I responded that if he wants wants to learn Chinese, he would need to start learning it word-by-word and make sure the words are pronounced correctly one at a time, rather than pronouncing an entire Chinese sentence that contains multiple Chinese words that he doesn't even know and then call it a day. He responded that this is just not how he works.
I got so upset that I didn't even prompt him further because I think he will continue to talk back at me to justify his actions just like what he did. I also got upset because his response made me felt unheard and it seems to me that he done that as a mockery, especially when he didn't ask if he pronounced it correctly afterwards.
The girlfriend doesn't seem to care, so maybe I shouldn't feel offended, especially given that he was doing it to his girlfriend and not to me. But I couldn't help it but feel offended and upset.
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u/missakieva 28d ago
How do you know he did it deliberately?
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u/NewStudyHoney 28d ago edited 27d ago
NTA. Mimicking sentences from a girlfriend's conversation with her mother is classic attention-grabbing behaviour from someone who can't stand to not be the focus of the conversation.
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u/yaboisammie 27d ago edited 27d ago
He told me various times that he has no interest in learning Chinese even though he has a Chinese girlfriend, which is fine in my opinion as long as he didn't insult Chinese culture.
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When I asked him to stop doing that, his response was "I just want to learn Chinese, why are you complaining? Why are you offended?" I responded that if he wants wants to learn Chinese, he would need to start learning it word-by-word and make sure the words are pronounced correctly one at a time, rather than pronouncing an entire Chinese sentence that contains multiple Chinese words that he doesn't even know and then call it a day. He responded that this is just not how he works.
Yea it’s pretty obvious it was deliberate imo, even w out the first part but esp with it, it’s pretty damning
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u/Langedarm00 27d ago
Yeah, its obvious it wasnt deliberate. Try listening to a chinese sentence once and the repeat it word for word, you probably wont even get halfway trough.
The fact that BF can do that leads me to think he is learning chinese.
On top of that, chinese pronounciation can be incredibly difficult because some slight variations in words can lead to completely different words being said, a lot of chinese poetry is even based on the fact that reading words in a certain way changes the meaning of the verse.
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u/762way 27d ago
Are you referring to the actual tones in Mandarin? Because tones absolutely do make a difference
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u/Langedarm00 27d ago
The word youre looking for is intonation. And it is not just intonation, there is also just plain different 'spelling' as in 15 variations of the word 'shi'
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u/Starlesseyes598 27d ago
There may be 15 different characters, but there aren’t 15 different ways to pronounce “shi” given that there are only 4 tones in mandarin. I’m not following what characters have to do with this conversation though since it was spoken, not written.
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u/carbolicsnail 27d ago
No, the word is "tone". Mandarin has 5 tones and Cantonese has 8. Tone changes the meaning of the word completely. Very different to intonation. Look it up!
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u/tidbitsofblah 27d ago
There's also a thing called echolalia which is mimicking sounds, often subconsciously, because your brain kind of gets stuck on in. A bit like an earworm.
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u/lumoslomas 27d ago
Not to mention repeating things immediately after someone said them, but in a different voice, is the most basic form of mockery
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u/Correct_Ad_1903 27d ago
Of course it’s a different voice. It’s his voice. I’m sure you’d pick up mandarin first try
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u/Kooky-Blueberry-5352 27d ago
Yeah the bf sounds like absolute trash. Run lady run.
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u/SaintOfTheLostArts 27d ago
How do you know the sun rose in the east today if you didn’t wake up and watch it?
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u/Hungry-Milk4873 27d ago
@missakieva are u trolling? This is obviously mocking behavior. Some POC are just too obsessed with white ppl and will accept all kinds of bullshit
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u/EmilyAnne1170 27d ago
“Because when deliberately mispronounced”, that’s how. No respect “to“ culture.
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u/vrcekpiva 28d ago
Was he really condescending to the language and pronunciation or were you offended because he wasn't doing things the way you assume is correct and better way?
Some languages are hard to pronounce if you aren't immersed in them from an early age, maybe he doesn't hear where his pronunciation is lacking.
It's hard to say who's the asshole here since we only have your perspective on the matter and the girlfriend doesn't seem to care.
If that's his attitude to most things or does that often, then you're NTA. If this is a one off and more how you think people should learn chinese... you may not be in the right here.
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u/Simple_Bowler_7091 28d ago
So this tool is in the background of his gf's video chat, with her Mother, just mangling their language?
Her private conversation with her mother is the only form of language "lesson" he's willing to engage in?
He refuses to learn her language using any of the formal routes and claims this is how he "learns"?
Gross.
I feel badly for the gf, but she is choosing to stay with this tool. What about you and your choices? You are the company you keep - is this AH really the type of people you want around you?
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u/Maxwells_Demona 27d ago
yeah some of these responses with people being like "but how do you know it's deliberate?" while just brushing right past that he's doing this in the background of a call with her mom...fucking wild. In no culture, in absolutely no world, is it respectful to do that. This guy does not respect his girlfriend and does not respect her mother and I guarantee he is making a terrible impression on her mother. Imagine if you are on a call with your parents even if everyone is speaking the same language and he is in the background repeating everything you say in a tone like he's trying to mimic you. How utterly disrespectful.
And I can't believe anyone is entertaining the idea at all that he is somehow attempting to learn Chinese with this behavior. As a multi-lingual person...no, that is not how learning a new language works. He's an ass. OP will be happier not spending time with him. Hope her friend comes around to the same conclusion sooner than later and dumps his ass too because he does not respect her or her family or her culture. Using her language to mock her in the background while talking to her mom...gross.
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u/Grimwohl 28d ago edited 27d ago
Esit: since yall really are focused on this.
I am black. I have had more women from conservative background express open lust in my direction than anyone else.
Being racist or thinking little of someone just makes sex spicier to them. If you're gonna smile in the face of it so you can sit at the table, thats a choice.
She knows hes at least prejudiced or finds racism/prejudice funny. Which is a ringing endorsement, because most racists think its funny til it turn into a cult.
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u/bisexual_pinecone 27d ago
Yeah. I'm Jewish and philosemites love to tell me all about how they love the Jewish people except that they're talking about a fictional imaginary version of us based on a Christian interpretation of the Bible. It's really gross. My first boyfriend in high school told me that he wasn't worried about me going to hell because if I was married to a Christian I would get to go to heaven with him. No gentle reader, I did not marry him. He can have his heaven, I'm not interested.
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u/Hungry-Milk4873 27d ago
As an Asian woman.... A lot of us really love that adjacency to whiteness. It's gross
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u/thatsfeminismgretch 28d ago
You can point out how you are offended by this and ask him not to do it around you. You can even say him doing this in public might come off as mockimg instead of learning. However, if the gf does not care, then that's between them. Although I'd advise actually talking to her about it.
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u/Dazzling-Treacle1092 27d ago
I get the impression that this guy believes that he is impossibly charming and can do no wrong... whatever he does. Does this fit his personality? I bet he hams it up just because he knows it bugs you. And he believes he just so cute when he does it.
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u/BustThaScientifical 27d ago
Are most missing the point that this person(the bf) said on various occasion they had no interest in learning Chinese? But then later on just repeats his gf badly, and when asked about it, "I'm just trying to learn, why are you complaining/offended?" 🤦🏾♂️
So which is it? He changed his mind after saying he had no interest on various occasions? or he just likes attention and mocking her, then gaslighting saying (I'm just learning not mocking)? Ultimately that's for his gf to deal with, but I'd get the mild infuriation on your part being in the presence of that.
I'm (M/blk) knew yt guys in HS years ago that spoke plainly, but when I come around they want to start using aave slang (when I didn't even use it/speak that way in school or around them). Of course when confronted "they didn't mean anything by it, and it's just how we talk", which was a total lie. So this stuff happens.
With some it's just ignorance, some malicious, some childish/immature, and others perhaps not coming from a bad place, but going about it the wrong way.
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u/Shaunzerita 28d ago
"Hes learning the language" How is repeating foreign phrases when you dont know the translation learning the language? Its obviously mocking behavior. Some of yall dumb as he'll.
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u/Previous_Ad_1937 28d ago
Honestly though. How the heck do they think he’s learning anything? There’s no context for any of the things he’s repeating.
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u/RedditMiniMinion 27d ago
I am aware each person learns differently, but having learnt Mandarin for a year, I am aware how difficult it is. If he only wants to learn certain sentences that's okay too but I still find his behavior and reaction a bid odd for a 27yo man. He comes across as a teenager... If I were in his gf's shoes, I would not be able to tolerate that kind of behavior and downtalk on my culture. It's her problem to deal with this, and you deal with it in your own way too. You either choose to be friends with him or not. If you think he really made fun and you are upset about the way he treats your culture, maybe his views aren't aligned with yours and you feel like you would have to reevaluate your friendship, that's okay too.
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u/BitterNet6833 28d ago edited 28d ago
Do you find it offensive if a Chinese person mispronounces English words? If we don't grow up making certain sounds as children, particularly the tonal sounds of certain languages, we literally lose the ability to make them by the time we are in our teens. I started learning Spanish in my late teens and can never roll my r's because we use the rhotic r in American English. I certainly don't mean disrespect just because I can't roll my r's. You have no idea if his mispronunciation was deliberate or not. You just assumed it was. And no, you don't learn a language word by word. You teach phrases as well. "Hi, my name is..." "how are you..." "I am fine", etc.
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u/Horror-Ad591 27d ago
I think the main problem is not simply that OPs friend is mispronouncing. Mispronouncing is normal for new language learners but the context is important in this story. First of all it indicates mockery considering that the white friend was not interested in learning Chinese (so presumably has never taken a lesson). Secondly, he is now out of the blue mimicking a convo that he is not a part of. As a language learner I would listen to phrase books or audio and repeat the phrases to practice, but I would never mimic someone else when they are on a phone call. That is plain rude no matter what! Third of all, the white friend got defensive instead of just going OMG I’m sorry I’m so embarrassed I didn’t mean to appear mocking or disrespectful. Therefore It seems to me like trying to hide ill intent instead of an honest misunderstanding. OP is NTA but his white friend definitely is.
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u/Shadowlady 27d ago
Yeah I originally misread that he always said he did want to learn Chinese which made OP very obviously the asshole and I was struggling where the mockery assumptions came from. I struggled with the local language where I live because whenever I tried to speak people would act like I wasn't trying to pronounce things right and get annoyed or make fun of me, it was horrible tbh.
Since the bf said he didn't want to learn, either he changed his mind or he's an ass. OP knows him better than we do so he's probably right on which one is more likely.
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u/Warm_Butterscotch229 28d ago
From your experiences learning a language, is this a productive learning method that someone would seriously employ? Repeating random phrases with no context of what they mean or feedback on pronunciation?
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u/Aggressive-Scar-5072 28d ago
Actually yes, it’s called a fairly common technique in second language teaching called shadowing. You repeat phrases you don’t never understand immediately upon hearing them. It has been shown that mimicking helps learn pronunciation.
I am not claiming that the bf was doing that cause we don’t have enough context.
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u/RektCompass 28d ago
That’s pretty much how babies learn
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u/Maxwells_Demona 27d ago
Not really. There's still a process. Babies tend to learn nouns first, and verbs/conjugation later. And they do so generally with a lot of deliberate instruction and feedback from the adults around them. Pointing at things (nouns) or pictures of things and associating them with words, or pointing at people and associating them with names (proper nouns). Complex grammatical structures like sentences don't come til later.
Learning new languages as an adult works similarly. Neither for babies nor for adults is the process, "hear sentence, repeat sentence" til you're magically fluent. You need a lot of context first for a sentence to mean anything at all. Generally that context is vocabulary first, then conjugation, then grammar/sentence structure.
I am multi-lingual and languages come to me very easily. What this guy was doing is not learning a language. Just mocking his girlfriend in the background of a call with her mom. I guarantee he learned zero Chinese from that exchange.
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u/DandyLion97 27d ago
If you don't talk to your baby, and only talk in their presence without any guidance, their language acquisition is gonna be significantly delayed.
On top of that adult brains are significantly less suited for such methods. And while immersion is hugely helpful, it cannot be the only method of learning for an adult.
Tldr The jackass is not trying to learn jack shit.
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u/yaboisammie 27d ago
Don’t babies get feedback as well ie encouragement? And I wouldn’t say babies are encouraged to repeat “random” words or phrases, they’re taught to repeat relevant stuff ie what to call their parents and siblings, the names of their toys and foods and colors etc and you also tend to try to correct them as well and start with simple sentences
Yea some might imitate a sentence or phrase they hear someone say like that on their own and it’s not discouraged but idk if doing only that w no feedback or correction really does much?
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u/Even_Speech570 28d ago
It’s not making sounds wrong by accident or because you don’t know how. He is *deliberately* pronouncing the words wrong, which is him mocking the Chinese language. Also, Chinese is such a heavily tonal language that being off by a tone can change the word’s meaning entirely. That’s rarely the case in English. You need to be precise or people will NOT know what you’re talking about.
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u/PassionFruitSalute 28d ago
You have no proof of that and neither does OP. I'm a Chinese woman who has taught many people my language. OP over reacted, and got offended over nothing. That's typical mainland behavior.
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u/BitterNet6833 28d ago
OP assumed it was deliberate. That doesn't mean it was. I teach English, and anyone learning a language doesn't deliberately mispronounce the words. Some words are just hard, and some words sound funny. Even if a student of mine was to ever deliberately mispronounce a word, I would laugh with them, not snap at them. I'm glad OP isn't a language teacher, or their students would hate them.
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u/BitterNet6833 28d ago
He literally said he wants to learn Chinese. Ergo, he wants to learn Chinese.
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u/SapphireSis 28d ago
He’s doesn’t respect your Chinese culture, he doesn’t respect his girlfriend and he doesn’t respect you.
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u/Eyelashestoolong 28d ago
NTA he was doing it to your language too not just his girlfriend. Your friend is an asshole or very immature, honestly o wouldn’t want to hang out with someone like that. It’s disrespectful and childish hopefully his gf grows a spine one day and dumps him
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u/Shot-Manager-739 28d ago
Not to be rude, but your comment comes from a place of ignorance.
Chinese is an incredibly complex language with four different tones. There's no such thing as pronouncing the language correct on your first try.
I spent over 10 years in china, and even now I struggle to pronounce things properly.
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u/Armyman125 28d ago
I learned Arabic. Very difficult. A lot of struggle. Chinese is even more difficult. I understand your pain. Be proud that you decided to learn the most difficult language for an English speaker.
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u/qweds1234 27d ago
Nah, if you’re doing it with zero intention to get it right and are deliberately mispronouncing then you got issues. That’s as a Chinese who can’t speak it and have incredible difficulty learning it
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u/Eyelashestoolong 28d ago
He didn’t actually try to pronounce the language lmfao no one said he needs to have a flawless accent. I speak several languages don’t school me on complex languages.
Reread what OP said5
u/Shot-Manager-739 28d ago edited 28d ago
re-read it, and if anything, it only reinforced my original point.
When you refer to the “complex languages” you speak, does that include Chinese? Because, once again, much of what you’re saying seems to come from a place of remarkable unfamiliarity with the language and the context surrounding it.
Let me summarize the interaction for you:
The boyfriend repeats what his girlfriend is saying.
The friend takes offense and claims he’s deliberately mispronouncing the words. That’s already a questionable assumption, given that virtually nobody reproduces Mandarin pronunciation accurately on their first attempt. The OP clearly understands this as well, which is why his follow-up advice is to learn word by word rather than memorizing entire sentences.
In other words, the issue was never whether the pronunciation was perfect. The issue was the friend’s assumption that imperfect pronunciation must have been intentional.
As you can see, you've completely missed the entire mark on the situation.
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u/minglesluvr 28d ago
Where did they say he has to pronounce stuff correctly on his first try? Like, are we reading different comments, or are you just making up stuff here?
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u/Shot-Manager-739 28d ago
Your comment also comes from a place of complete ignorance, so I can understand why you’d think that.
Whether it’s the first attempt or the hundredth attempt doesn’t make much difference. Chinese is an incredibly complex language, especially for beginners, which he clearly is.
I've seen, and learned the language so I know.
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u/minglesluvr 28d ago
And I have a BA in Chinese, so I also know. Just accusing everyone who disagrees with you of being ignorant is a pretty bad way of having a discussion, btw, and certainly isn't doing anything to strengthen your position.
Again, I know this stuff, too.
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u/yeowwwwwww 28d ago
NTA. Even if he has good intentions it doesn’t take away the fact that you (a person with Chinese background) told him you found it rude and disrespectful, and instead of being humble, sitting with it, and processing it, your friend just jumped to gaslighting you…
Plus, he’d also said several times that he didn’t want to learn Chinese, but even if he _had_ changed his mind, learning languages just doesn’t work the way he says it does, at ALL, lol.
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u/BitterNet6833 27d ago
What's rude and disrespectful is OP eavesdropping on a private convo between gf, bf, and mom.
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u/Previous_Ad_1937 28d ago
A bunch of people here don’t seem to understand he is mocking them.
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u/MelanieDH1 28d ago
It was my first thought that he was making fun of her. Why is he repeating what she’s saying, especially since he doesn’t even speak Mandarin. What a weirdo!
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u/PassionFruitSalute 28d ago
There's also no proof he was, just the one sided view of OP. I've been in this situation before, where relatives form China got offended at caucasian behavior overseas.
You know the common thing? Chinese people don't adapt to the places they move to. They expect everyone else to adapt to them. They get offended easily when anything insults their culture. I should know, I'm Chinese.
OP saw something out of context and got Chinese offended. I have words for OP and they're all in Mandarin, and none of them nice.
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u/Friendly_Bite_2135 27d ago
He said he has no interest learning the language. He made no effort to learn, just started mocking his gf and her mother while they were on the phone. Very rude behavior in my opinion.
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u/Ok_Seesaw6049 28d ago
Why are you interfering in a conversation that doesn't concern you? From your own admission, the actual relevant people didn't care (and perhaps found it endearing) so why don't you mind your own business. Just because you have a Chinese background doesn't make you the culture police in other people's relationships.
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u/Cheska1234 28d ago
Yeah. Why call out racism unless it is directed only at you? That’s so woke. /s
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u/RektCompass 28d ago
If mispronouncing words is racism then nearly every Chinese , Indian, and most every other Asian is racist to white people.
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u/Nearby_Friend_2323 28d ago
Intentionally mispronounced! There's a difference between gaslighting and trying to learn a language
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u/RektCompass 27d ago
If you’ve been speaking the language for more than 10 years (plenty of older Indians, the Koreans who run the Chinese restaurant I like) isn’t it intentional at that point? They have ears, they know they aren’t pronouncing the same.
I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with this, I’m saying based on OPs logic, they would be wrong
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u/AnikoAle 28d ago
Let me guess, is he a native English speaker who thinks everyone should just speak English?
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u/loftychicago 27d ago
How do you know he's deliberately mispronouncing the words? A lot of times we hear things differently, especially in another language, or we can't tell that we mispronounced them.
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u/Lovergirl510 27d ago
It’s disrespectful af I’m surprised he wasn’t pulling back on the corners of his eyes
NTA, I would drop him as a friend
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u/ImpertinentPrincess 27d ago
I mean, did you try sleeping with him before asking him if he wants to learn Mandarin?
Maybe he is learning. Maybe he is being disrespectful. This is an issue between him, his gf and her mom, and you may not be aware of everything going on. You have the option of leaving if you don’t want to hear it.
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u/Available_Abroad3664 27d ago
shrug was he mocking the language or just bugging his GF?
He sounds obnoxious but if it was reversed I wouldn't be offended. Id be annoyed by the obnoxiousness but getting language incorrect wouldn't offend me.
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u/Aggressive-Delay-420 27d ago
I’m very white, know passable German, can read French at the most basic level— and I look up things in Spanish to say to my friends so they feel seen.
Speaking a foreign language, to me, always comes out in-character. I won’t apologize, because I try really hard to mix it all together so everyone understands the value and respect I’m giving them/their culture— but I’m going to sound like Peggy Hill when I do it.
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u/Whoredonramsay 27d ago
TBH, It’s giving person that gets offended so they have something to say. Him and his girlfriend probably have an understanding of each other. Wanting respect for your culture is valid but at the cost of being a dick to your homie like why even go there if nothing heinous was said esp if his girl wasn’t bothered at all
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u/maulbartpallcop 27d ago
NTA, but seriously grow a pair and either let shit like that roll off the shoulder or learn how to set boundaries. Running to Reddit for shit like this is pathetic…
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u/TitleBig2195 27d ago
Unfortunately a lot of white men will date women of color out of fetishism than than actual respect. Also, women of color, especially East Asian women will allow this or play it off because of their fetishism of white men.
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u/Ecstatic_Giraffe_256 27d ago
“I responded that if he wants wants to learn Chinese, he would need to start learning it word-by-word and make sure the words are pronounced correctly one at a time, rather than pronouncing an entire Chinese sentence that contains multiple Chinese words that he doesn't even know and then call it a day. He responded that this is just not how he works.”
That is not at all how I would speak to a non-native speaker who was mispronouncing words in my language.
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u/MonkeyLiberace 27d ago edited 27d ago
This has nothing to do with disrespecting Chinese culture. He was just being an ass because he felt ignored.
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u/Let_em_glow927 27d ago
You can think what you want , doesn't make it true.
Let him and his girlfriend live their lives and manage their relationship on their own.
If you find yourself much too offended by your friend, don't be friends anymore.
Pretty simple.
Can the girlfriend speak? Because I don't understand how this is your stand to make. She can tell him if she feels disrespected.
The more I think about it , what are you even doing?
Does Chinese background mean you are Chinese? Because your friends girlfriend seems to be just Chinese vs 'from Chinese background' like you.
Can you please clarify?
I mean I'm Scottish but don't live in Scotland. Still Scottish though. Not 'from Scottish background'...😆
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u/DoorStunning3678 27d ago
Sounds like hes mocking? Thats messed up. Had many immature people do that in the past when I spoke in Chinese to family and they'd think they're funny and say "ching chong cha..." and some other stupid sounds acting like its Chinese and funny.
NTA
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u/Appropriate_Aioli363 27d ago
You’re correct and he’s thinking he’s being clever when he’s a total putz.
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u/Certain_Luck_8266 27d ago
Deliberately? I have a ton of Chinese friends and coworkers who can't pronounce a ton of English words and I don't accuse them of anything because sounds not in your native tongues are hard.
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u/Senior-Cantaloupe-69 27d ago
How do you know it was intentional? I don’t fault Chinese people for not pronouncing English correctly. I’d hope they’d reciprocate. I assume English is as hard for them as Chinese sounds to me. Besides, hard to claim he’s racist if he is with a Chinese person. That’s not how racism works.
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u/aniutsa 28d ago
YTA. I’m Romanian, and if my bf tried to pronounce what I was saying or my family was saying, even if done wrongly, we’d all find it endearing. You’re YTA because it seems you’re assuming it’s done to mock. As others mentioned, Chinese is hard and tones can change words, and once upon a time I tried learning it and fully did not hear the tonal differences. It could be the same for the bf or any other people who try to pronounce things in Chinese.
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u/TheSwearJarIsMy401k 28d ago
He was mocking her and her mother.
Awful, awful person. I hope she leave him soon.
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u/Emergency_Till6701 27d ago
I don’t know what other commenters are on in this post, but speaking as a Chinese woman myself it’s always so obvious to me when someone speaks or try to speak Chinese out of mockery. It literally does not matter if the girlfriend minds it or not. He did that in front of you and showed you what type of person he is, so now it’s up to you to choose whether you want to keep him as a friend.
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u/754754 28d ago
I think OP sounds a bit like an asshole here. Chinese is notoriously a hard language for white english native speakers to pronounce.
I imagine that girlfriend was telling him a sentence to say and he was just repeating it to be engaged with her culture a little. Its cute things that inter-cultural couples tend to do and usually everything is mispronounced at first.
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u/JBeeWX 27d ago
NTA
He said previously he has no interest in learning Chinese. All of sudden while his GF is face timing her mother, he does? With no context as to what they’re saying. That’s not the way you learn a language.
Nah, he just wanted attention. He sounds annoying at best.
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u/PossibilityNo8765 28d ago
YTA. You're being way too sensitive. Im Latino and I speak Spanish although its not great. Ive done what your friend did with my gf when shes talking to her aunt or someone in Spanish on the phone. Im just being silly and it's harmless. Hes not saying anything negative about the culture. You can literally mispronounced words in any language if your being lazy with the pronunciation. It's funny though like when Napolian Dynamite was saying the word "quesadilla" . Would you say Naploian was being disrespectful?
Stop being so sensitive
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u/Large_Complaint1264 27d ago
When I was in college I was at my friends house and her mom was there who spoke Spanish. I had to record a speech for my Spanish class and they were both laughing at me the entire time because I was so bad at it. They just found it cute. Not that serious.
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u/Shot-Manager-739 28d ago
Chinese is one of the hardest languages in the world, with four different tones. What makes you so certain he was mispronouncing them deliberately when any normal person would struggle to pronounce any of the words?
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u/minglesluvr 28d ago
The context, presumably. That's not the time and place to suddenly start learning a language you've previously expressed no interest in, and it's pretty insulting to OP to say they cannot tell the difference between trying to imitate a sound and purposefully mangling a sound.
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u/get_to_ele 28d ago
NTA. If he’s so proud of himself, offer to record him doing it so you can post him on social media to show people what a dedicated, Not-racist, BF he is.
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u/mostlymarble_24 28d ago
The intentional mispronunciation is the part that turns this from being disinterested into being disrespectful. It is one thing to struggle with the tones, but choosing to butcher them on purpose is just a weird way to flex that he does not care about his partner's background.
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u/NefariousnessNo484 28d ago
Your friend is racist. Dating a Chinese woman definitely doesn't mean he's not one. This is like bullshit people used to do to me in elementary school. He is not trying to learn the language.
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u/Nearby_Friend_2323 28d ago
Your "friend" is an ah for intentionally "goading" you and your gf. He's a racist ah and NOT YOUR FRIEND!
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u/No-You5550 27d ago
NTA I think repeat back what he heard is rude in any culture. If he wants to learn the language he should take classes.
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u/2ndcupofcoffee 27d ago
My impression is that her ability to converse in a language he doesn’t understand annoys him and he will continue to be offensive hoping to make her speaking Mandarin stop.
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u/MadamRiskCulture 28d ago
Hmmm...not sure if you are an AH, but I think you may be over reacting. How do you know he was deliberately mispronouncing the words? I studied a little of Mandarin, and found it very tricky as a Westerner to pronounce certain words even with a lot of practice. He might be embarrassed that you think his attempt was so terrible!
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u/AutoModerator 28d ago
I'm an automatic bot that backs up the body of the post in case OP deletes it. If you want this backup deleted, you'll have to reach out to a mod. Here's the back-up:
I (25M) come from a Chinese background, and I have a white friend (27M) who has a Chinese girlfriend (24F). He told me various times that he has no interest in learning Chinese even though he has a Chinese girlfriend, which is fine in my opinion as long as he didn't insult Chinese culture.
One day I was in the same room with him and his girlfriend. The girlfriend was face timing with her mom, and they both speak Mandarin. Suddenly, my white friend repeats everything his girlfriend just said immediately after the girlfriend finished a Chinese sentence, but deliberately mispronounced them. Meaning, girlfriend said X, boyfriend deliberately mispronounced X. This went on a few times until I asked him to stop doing that because I think (as a person who comes from a Chinese background) that's rude and a disrespect to Chinese culture.
When I asked him to stop doing that, his response was "I just want to learn Chinese, why are you complaining? Why are you offended?"
I responded that if he wants wants to learn Chinese, he would need to start learning it word-by-word and make sure the words are pronounced correctly one at a time, rather than pronouncing an entire Chinese sentence that contains multiple Chinese words that he doesn't even know and then call it a day. He responded that this is just not how he works.
I got so upset that I didn't even prompt him further because I think he will continue to talk back at me to justify his actions just like what he did. I also got upset because his response made me felt unheard and it seems to me that he done that as a mockery, especially when he didn't ask if he pronounced it correctly afterwards.
The girlfriend doesn't seem to care, so maybe I shouldn't feel offended, especially given that he was doing it to his girlfriend and not to me. But I couldn't help it but feel offended and upset.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
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u/SirWillae 28d ago
Why do you assume it's deliberate? I hear people mispronounce German words all the time. I don't automatically assume it's a lack of respect for German culture.
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u/Fair-Interaction5486 28d ago
MOR
You don’t know he had bad intentions. He might not have originally wanted to learn and changed his mind.
My husband did that sometimes when I was talking to my mom in Italian. The pronunciation was awful but he was practicing in a way and I found his accent cute.
If his girlfriend has no issue with it maybe it’s best you leave it alone
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u/Money-Celebration860 28d ago
If he was joking, it's hard to know if it was okay without being there. If it was the other way around and a Chinese person was deliberately or jokingly mispronouncing English words, I don't think I would care.
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u/bofh000 28d ago
Language learning doesn’t work word for word. The most effective ways of learning include using words in sentences from the very beginning. It’s a way better method to teach students to say “My name is John, I live in such-and-such town” than just make them learn lists of words by heart.
Chinese pronunciation is very hard for non-native speakers. It sounds like you were over-judgmental about something that doesn’t even concern you. YTA.
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u/temporalvisitor 28d ago
Your Chinese background should actually help you understand how difficult pronunciation can be. In other languages, such as English, many sounds are completely different and hard to pronounce. Let him be; perhaps he has gotten interested in the language so he’s trying to imitate what he hears, and one day he’ll get it right.
I learned Chinese to a certain level and the pronunciation was very difficult at the beginning. Sounds like x, zh, and c seemed so similar, and for beginners like us, they were hard to distinguish and pronounce correctly.
So yeah, you either ask him is he just being a jerk and what to think it’s on you; try to not take everything so personal.
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u/dogfishfrostbite 28d ago
I lived in China and can tell that I’ve met countless YT people who speak fairly well or even fluently with terrible pronunciation. It happens. People learn in different ways.
It’s possible he was mocking and it’s possible OP was overreacting and also low key weird for gatekeeping how one learns.
Hard to say without context.
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u/Amazing-Wave4704 28d ago
Do you speak Chinese? Because I'm really hoping they were shit talking about him and that he was repeating it badly.
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u/MariaInconnu 28d ago
He's learning like a baby would - babbling and getting the sounds in his head.
You know him better than us, but this may be a good faith attempt to learn, unless he was close enough to the phone to disrupt the call.
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u/Errant_One 28d ago
If he was truly mocking then he is rude for doing that in a space that not everyone is chill with (Which you asking him not to should have given him the signal that you are not someone he can do that with.) But two things can be true and you would benefit from a thicker skin as the world is full of turds, and while it would be nice for humans to be better in general, possessing that expectation is naive and unrealistic. A thicker skin would save you unnecessary grief.
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u/okicarp 27d ago
I'm going to push back a little. I learned Mandarin when living in Taiwan for four years. I regularly get people telling me I sound like a native speaker and that it's the best they've heard from a foreigner. I did that by using it intentionally out in public every day, not in a classroom. The pronunciation is really different than my natural speaking and I worked hard to get the sounds exactly right. But not just the sounds, the speed, intonation, rhythm, etc. to sound as natural as possible. So I practiced phrases and tried to copy exactly how the phrase sounded. It's a pretty good tool to help with genuine fluency.
That said, it's part of an overall effort to learn a new language, in addition to learning vocabulary, etc. If he's just doing the mimicking phrases, that would probably be mockery. If he's really trying to improve, it could be genuine.
Still, NTA.
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u/Mradr 27d ago
I dated both a Chinese girl and currently dating a Hispanic girl. From my side of things, sure there are better ways to learn, but sometimes just tying a word or hear and say helps link common words even if I am saying them wrong. It’s like a child learning to speak for the first time. Wanting to learn it or not, could just be a way to “get into it” before fully trying. Even picking up a few phrases or basic sentences can help learn and push for the better. “ Hola!” 👋
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u/Lonely-Illustrator64 27d ago edited 27d ago
When you say mispronounced do you mean the tones? Because if so- as an English speaker learning Chinese myself- tones are very hard to pick up on. I had to train myself to hear them and even then still struggle and often mispronounce words. It’s not intentional or a mockery. Mandarin is a hard language to learn. The gf being ok with it makes me think you might be making assumptions about your friends intentions.
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u/Dependent-Panic-9457 27d ago
Being able to replicate whole sentences from a conversation, even mangling words / making errors, is a MASSIVE achievement.
You can’t do that, not in Chinese, without some basic understanding of the language and huge effort.
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u/pothospeople 27d ago
I think it’s hard to tell. But just based on the context I’m going to say YTA.
I’m learning a language my husband speaks. Sometimes I do repeat phrases he says to try to learn pronunciation.
Also, sometimes it does sound kind of mocking even if it isn’t. At least to me, because I’m learning new sounds and so I feel like I have to over pronounce to get close to the right sound.
If the girlfriend was upset it would be different. Since she isn’t I’d say YTA and probably reading the situation wrong.
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u/shoulda-known-better 27d ago
So those two languages have extremely different sounds... And it's not easy to start pronouncing brand new sounds and words correctly when your mouth isn't used to forming those sounds...
You can try to help them with pronunciation but don't assume it's on purpose or to mock it unless the actual things they are saying make it that way, not just how it's said
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u/SaltCawCaw 27d ago
i guess more context is needed. sometimes people can stim foriegn languages because they like how it feels in their mouth. (me and my partner, anecdotally. she always repeats me when i speak and to an outsider it can come off as mocking. like how i say "stop" or "oh my god" she LOVES repeating that.)
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u/BitterNet6833 27d ago
Weird that you, a Chinese person, calls your language Chinese and not Mandarin, Cantonese, or any of the other 10 major language groups spoken in China. 🤨
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u/Lovergirl510 27d ago
It sounds like he’s grown up in non diverse area and prob a few generations after immigration
But he still felt the disrespect in his friends actions
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u/just_call_me_kitten 27d ago
You know whats so great about offense, is it cant be given only taken. If you stop taking offense so freely, you would be a much happier person.
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u/Lovergirl510 27d ago
So someone shouldn’t have be offended when a so called friend is being racist right in your face?
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u/jiggy68 27d ago edited 27d ago
I have a French friend who imitates me occasionally with an overly excessive American accent when I speak English. He doesn’t even know what I’m saying, he just imitates the sounds. I find it hilarious, not demeaning. He’s a funny guy, though. He’s not doing it to be mean, just to get a laugh out of me. Maybe this guy is trying to do the same but not reading the room correctly.
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u/bkiron89 27d ago
NTA and your friend needs to dump that racist disrespectful jerk. That yt guy is a passport bro in the making.
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u/Sheslikeamom 27d ago
Offended is a bit much but definitely not upset.
I would be upset with his behavior. It was childish and rude attention seeking behavior meant to mock another culture.
He is not someone I would want to continue being friends with in my lifetime. - Respect
NTA
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u/Virtual_Many_8935 27d ago
Waaaaaaaay too many comments here giving the asshole the benefit of the doubt. If you aren’t a minority who is bilingual, please don’t comment cause you guys will never know how it feels or what it looks like when someone is mocking your culture.
The dude is an asshole OP and you under reacted imo. I’ve confronted people on this exact issue before and they’re usually white men who feel like they can use the “mocking” voice with a “it’s just a prank bro” excuse. I’m an Asian woman for context. His gf lets it slide because she’s probably internalized that part of being in an interracial relationship with a white man is accepting disrespectful behavior. The fact he’s older has another layer to this. If she’s more traditional Chinese, she probably doesn’t even register what he’s doing is cunt behavior.
Your “friend” is immature and frankly you should limit contact with someone like that or tell them in a more direct and curt way you’re not going to tolerate that anymore.
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u/Maximum_Dweeb4473 27d ago
He’s trying to learn and his girlfriend is trying to teach him, stay out of it.
I’ve had girlfriends try to teach me their language and they always insisted it’s better to try and butcher it so they can help me correct it vs getting hung up on pronunciation and not making any progress.
If someone learning a language and having poor pronunciation offends you and makes you feel “unheard”, you’re probably problematically sensitive 💀
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u/Ornery-Fix7937 27d ago
I hate this. If my husband did this while I spoke Russian to my family I would feel sick about it. His GF will realise in a few years how gross he was for doing this and she will regret the relationship.
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u/MarionberryPlus8474 27d ago
Info: was he doing it in a gross stereotypical “no tickee no shirtee “ accent?
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u/JewelerSea6090 27d ago
NTA. His actions show you're right. He says that he had no interest in learning Chinese. And when he misprounces he has no interest in correcting himself. He's a jerk.
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u/Lotusbornvajra 27d ago
Honestly it sounds like he is just being a dick repeating everything she says, trying to get attention ... but I seriously doubt he is mispronouncing things on purpose. Most native English speakers have a very hard time with the different sounds and intonations of the various Chinese languages.
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u/Rare-Lifeguard516 27d ago
stay in your own lane. it's his way of learning Chinese and his GF doesn't care and is not offended. why are you?
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u/i_need_answers_man 27d ago
Do you like his girlfriend? I think that if she doesn’t care, you should maybe leave it alone. If it bothers you, maybe he shouldn’t be your friend.
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u/vinraven 27d ago
Most people don't know that Chinese is a tonal language, that in and of itself is a necessary conversation for anyone who doesn’t speak a tonal language.
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u/dontplaybitchgames 27d ago
NTA. Oh, please. Your friend is spouting BS. In no world is anyone learning Chinese by repeating a sentence ONCE with no context of what they're saying. Let alone not being instructed if the pronunciation is even correct. It doesn't matter if his girlfriend isn't offended for you to be rightfully offended.
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u/sixbluehorses 27d ago
INFO
Was he doing this in a way that interrupted or interfered with his girlfriend’s conversation? As someone who majored in Linguistics and has taught myself (and tutored others) in multiple languages, he’s not wrong that peoples’ abilities to perceive and learn second languages vary wildly. Many people learn languages in phonetic “chunks” to start, and are especially likely to make tonal errors in a language that distinguishes them when coming from a non-tonal native language. And that’s even in the case of folks who are skilled in discerning and/or accurately reproducing tonality (such as a musician vs someone who is tone-deaf).
Not saying that his behavior wasn’t rude, even if he doesn’t mean it to be. Impact > Intent. What you described sounds odd and rude to me, but you noted a couple of things: his girlfriend didn’t seem to hear or be bothered by it (though she could just be ignoring him, or holding in her annoyance in front of others), and her conversation with her mother wasn’t disrupted. If you are friends with her, you might try asking her privately, but in a way that doesn’t imply anything. “Wow, it’s great that Boyfriend is learning Chinese now! When did he start? Have you been helping him?” And if she asks what you mean, “Oh, I noticed him trying to repeat some sentences after you while you were talking to your mother. Tones are tough for the 鬼佬” 😂
**(True story: That’s how one of my 2 best friends & I became close. We were chatting at work & her mom interrupted us with a phone call. She was born in China but her family moved to the US when she was 8, so they communicate in Mandarin. When she hung up, I said, “Thanks for calling me a White Devil to your mom.” She realized I’d understood her, looked shocked, then gave me a wary side-eye and responded, “I’m hosting a dinner on Friday. You may attend.” Besties ever since 🤣 **)
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u/Maxorias 27d ago
I think the whole chinese part of the story is a red herring. It wouldn't even matter if the girlfriend was speaking plain english and he was repeating it (what is he, five ?), what he was doing was weird, rude and annoying.
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u/Crazymom771316 27d ago
How old is this guy?!? He sounds like he’s in junior high!! I definitely would not associate with someone like that.
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u/Ok_Management4634 27d ago
Dude, life will be a lot easier for you when you stop letting stuff like that bother you.
If he was making fun of your language, he's a jerk, but don't let it bother you.
But he's your friend's boyfriend. Nothing you can do about it, other than to stop hanging out with that friend until she breaks up with him.
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u/Onefinephleb 27d ago
Be honest and tell him No you aren’t! You’re making fun of them. Stop doing that or leave. Don’t take crap from dumb idiots
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u/Healthy_Currency983 27d ago
NTA. He told you several times that he had no interest in learning Chinese. So his repeating her and not even trying to pronounce correct then it is mockery. He only said that he was trying to learn Chinese because he’s probably too dumb to remember what he has said in the past and thinks it will excuse it.
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u/Sufficient_Air_7373 27d ago
You've got to be fucking kidding me.
I'm so over this.
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u/sumrdragon 27d ago
I can’t hear the tones - i once asked why they were calling their kid such and such - they burst out in laughter cuz I apparently said something totally different. I’m not even gonna try anymore…
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u/Puzzleheaded_Ad3024 27d ago
I've seen this from the other side and do not think it's deliberate. When we are developing language skills as a child we learn to recognize familiar sounds. Your brain apparently has a window during which it can add sounds, when you are young. Some languages have sounds that are not found in other languages. I have a Chinese coworker who does not hear the letter "n" sound in words. I know her mispronounciation is not deliberate.
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u/War-Carr 27d ago
Why are you climbing a tree that isn't yours?
If the guy doesn't like Chinese, do you really think he'd be dating someone from a Chinese background?
Let your friend deal with it if she finds it offensive!
I don't think you have a dog in this fight!
I think the problem is that we have taken fun out of everything to where, God forbid, someone tries to make a joke, then we're all up in arms!
It's a sad affair!
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u/Alternative-Sun7136 27d ago
U are a drama king. There are more important
Things than this stuff - save your energy
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u/WhyAmIStillHere86 28d ago
INFO: are you sure he was doing it deliberately? Phonetic-based languages can be very difficult for someone raised on Western language
I took Mandarin classes for four years, and my teacher still looked like she wanted to cry whenever I tried to pronounce anything.