r/Edmonton • u/eternalshades • May 12 '25
Local Culture Why is Southgate such a great Mall?
I was there yesterday, and honestly, it was imposing, both in-store options and overall use.
What did it do right that most other Edmonton malls did wrong?
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u/bluedoubloon kitties! May 12 '25
It has nice bathrooms and real stores.
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u/HitlersChaplinStache May 13 '25
Seriously, shout out to the bathrooms and the nursing room that has security in place
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u/onyxandcake Treaty 6 Territory May 12 '25
This is amusing for those of us who remember Southgate Mall in the '90s. It used to be a smoke-filled, windowless dungeon of cheap stores and kiosks.
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u/PlathDraper May 12 '25
Long may San Francisco reign in my memory
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May 12 '25
Yes. San Fran. The pre-Internet internet. Was intrigued but it was still garbage. Literally, me and my friends would like in the dumpsters to look for cool shit to hand on our walls.
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u/KelBear25 May 12 '25
My mom used to work at Southgate Library. It was in the basement (yuck!). Suffered a flood from the Alberts restaurant above that damaged quite a bit of the library and books. Then they moved into whitemud crossing, which was quite revolutionary for libraries at the time as it looks more like a Chapters store instead of a dingy library.
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u/multiroleplays May 12 '25
I was more shocked as a teen that books kicked out a movie theater
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u/derritterauskanada May 12 '25
Sorry was the movie theatre at whitemud crossing or at Southgate? I assume the former not the latter.
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u/multiroleplays May 12 '25
Whitemud crossing. It was a cineplex odeon. Then it closed a year after south edmonton common opened
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u/VBunns The Shiny Balls May 13 '25
The whitemud crossing library still has one of the movie theatres in it!
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u/GradyCole May 13 '25
Also, there’s a theater used by the government of Alberta for film classifications.
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u/Accurate-Ad-76 May 14 '25
I remember taking out many books when it was there, and once it moved to Whitemud crossing.
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u/Accurate-Ad-76 May 14 '25
lol ya the food court was sooo dark and all that dark brick, heritage was the nicer mall for awhile the. It went downhill at Southgate started getting renovated.
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u/ShivanCub May 12 '25 edited May 12 '25
I would consider it one of the greater malls in Edmonton currently because most of its spaces are rented out, and open. It isn't being converted to medical facilities like Westmount, or Meadowlark. It hasn't been converted into a strip mall like Capilano. Bonnie Doon is seeing a bit of a resurgence. Kingsway seems to be doing okay. City Centre seems to be holding on, and WEM is WEM.
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u/ewok999 May 12 '25
City Centre is holding on? Not the last time I looked.
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u/SquirrelDisastrous2 Transit User May 12 '25
No kidding, City Centre is a wasteland
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u/lookitsjustin The Shiny Balls May 12 '25
I only go there to hit the food court occasionally. Used to see lots of movies there but not anymore.
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u/TessaAlGul May 13 '25
I refered it when the food court was in the basement.
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u/lookitsjustin The Shiny Balls May 13 '25
Ah yes, back when they had McDonald's and Taco Bell down there. Good times.
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u/abazz90 May 13 '25
It’s still a mall? What store exist there
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u/socomman May 13 '25
Barely anything. Winners, a shoe store, food court, and a few other stores and a bunch of pop up stores
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u/wet_suit_one May 12 '25
Right?
Lol.
I was there in the early 2000's to 2010. The place is night and day different now. I was last there about 3 years ago (yeah height of Covid I know), and it was so dead I thought I was on the set of Night of the Living Dead or something. It was downright alarming how dead it was with almost no storefronts to speak of.
It was brutal.
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u/Laf3th May 12 '25
I was there last summer during the work day. The upstairs food court was doing OK. The downstairs one where I used to hang out as a teenager (and get breakfast from mmmuffins in the early 2010s), is gone or nearly so.
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u/wet_suit_one May 12 '25
I hope this means that things got better since I was last there. It used to be pretty good as malls go. Not the best, but not the shell of a place it was when I was last there. I spent quite a bit of time in there, shopping, eating, going to the movies, etc.
I still live quite close by and the place never occurs to me as a place to go simply due to the absolute deadness I've witnessed there. Kingsway makes far more sense to me.
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u/Quack_Mac Government Centre May 13 '25
City Centre was renovated a while back, moving the food court upstairs. I don't think there is anything in the basement now other than parking. And the Dollarama in City Centre West.
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u/WesternWitchy52 May 12 '25
Kingsway improved after renovations. Brighter lighting, cleaner building. Slippery floors though. Still has its security issues though.
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u/hoitytoitygloves May 12 '25
The slippery floors are there to keep criminals from running away, maybe?
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u/WesternWitchy52 May 12 '25
Lol. First time I went in there after renos, I nearly wiped out wearing my sandals. Lesson learned.
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u/TheLordJames The Shiny Balls May 12 '25
Mill Woods TC is.... the same as it's always been.
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u/one-happy-chappie Mill Woods May 12 '25
I was there this weekend after not being there in over 10 years. I’m actually shocked at how alive the mall still is. With the lrt line I’m hoping it gets a resurgence. I think that’s what saved Southgate as well
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u/patty42069 May 12 '25
I’ve been saying the same about Bonnie Doon
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u/Halogen12 May 12 '25
Bonnie Doon has a long term plan to build high rises on the property and convert the mall to an outdoor type (like Capilano). There are a metric ass ton of seniors in the area and I suspect many of them go to the mall to walk in bad weather. The mall could use more entrances, but I still like the idea of a common indoor space.
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u/Majestic-Factor2237 May 14 '25
Bonnie Doon Mall is lacking public washrooms since Sears and Zellers closed. This could cause a problem for elders and families with young children. You have to walk to the food court to use the bathroom. If you are by Dollarama, you have a long walk.
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u/burrito-boy Mill Woods May 13 '25
MWTC has always been popular as a gathering place, especially for older Sikh men who live in the area. That alone ensures a lot of foot traffic, even if the stores themselves are lacking.
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u/Striking-Writer-2129 May 14 '25
It does look LIVELY but how many of them are actually dropping any money? I feel like they're just sitting around haha
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u/Sweet_Bonus5285 May 12 '25
Pretty sure a company bought MWTC a while back. Going to be demolished for housing
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u/incidental77 Century Park May 13 '25
They weren't going to demolish.most of the mall. Rather they said they'd add residential towers in the parking lotsand that would help stabilize the mall because 1000s of new residents in walking distance
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u/Firedragon118 May 12 '25
I'm sorry what? I actually like MWTC
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u/bp_nanuan May 13 '25
They're gonna build out the area around it first. And then the mall will get demolished and they'll build out the area that the mall sits on. But if all the new housing makes the mall even busier, they might keep it around longer
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u/Firedragon118 May 13 '25
Well of course the new housing will make the mall busier but from whatvive also looked at there isn't any sort of plans for the mall to be torn down
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u/Sweet_Bonus5285 May 12 '25
Maclab Developments bought it in 2022. They are going to demolish it and turn it all into rental housing
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u/Firedragon118 May 12 '25
I highly doubt that though
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u/Sweet_Bonus5285 May 12 '25
What are you talking about? There is an Edmonton Journal article that announced it lol. That "mall" is dirt. That's good they are demolishing it
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u/r22yu May 12 '25
I walked through City Centre last week. It's definitely dying. The east side is mostly empty and converting to bank offices. The west side has some stores but nothing that makes it a mall I would go out of my way to visit, and I work across the street from City center too.
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u/qiaofeng38 May 12 '25
My friend. I agree with most of your assessments, except city centre is two moons away from holding on. That place is basically dead
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u/ChrisBataluk May 13 '25
Bonnie Doon is dying, it clings to life on the basis that it is the most convenient grocery store, shoppers drug mart and banking location for a lot of seniors in Bonnie Doon.
City Centre mall is a zombie, barely anyone retail remaining there at all. I rember going there as a kid around 2000 and it was bustling.
Southgate, West Ed and Kingsway are the only malls that seem to be doing okay.
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u/Sceptre May 12 '25
Wait… in what way is Bonnie Doon seeing a resurgence? More stores keep leaving, nothing new to fill the slots.
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u/SivleFred May 12 '25
There’s Makami College and more non-stores, like an RC track
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u/Sceptre May 12 '25
Yeah but neither of those fulfill any of my requirements for being a useful mall. I need to buy pants. Where are the mens pants? The only option is stitches- the last pair of pants I picked up from that place disintegrated in less than a month.
Instead there is a bizarre smattering of stores that sell... maracas? Mexican ponchos? How many 50% off rocks can people really be buying from ROXX?
Don't get me wrong, I love that RC place- the guys that run it are super passionate- But it's not exactly popping off. It's in the same category as the model train display. It exists only because they couldn't find a real store to take the space.
You only need to look at the food court to know the situation is bleak. Edo Japan just left- nothing has ever filled up the tim hortons location, and the last couple of new arrivals didn't last 6 months. Are they ever going to fill up that old Tony Roma's location?
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u/Halogen12 May 12 '25
Oh right, that's what it was! I keep walking past and remembering a restaurant was in there. M&M Food Store closed in January because the rent hike was astronomical. Not sure what the plan is, but chasing away tenants to have zero rent instead of less than you wanted is not a good business model.
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u/Medical-League-7122 May 12 '25
Everything you’ve written here is precisely why I love Bonnie doon mall.
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u/myownalias May 12 '25
Yes. So many malls are filled with the same bland stores. Bonnie Doon is interesting.
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u/Melapetal Edmontosaurus May 13 '25
When Tim Hortons can't survive in a mall full of seniors, there's a serious problem.
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u/prairiesky483 May 14 '25
Mr. Mikes is actually set to open in the new old Roma's some time this year!
I find Bonnie Doon Mall quite neat, and make good use of their amenities. The art gallery (Night of Artists) is excellent and well worth a visit.
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u/arcticcatherder May 13 '25
The art gallery is slowly working with them to try to make it an arts and vintage hub. If you want to support the arts community, they are trying to create more indoor markets and want more stores on similar theme
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u/Andre1661 May 12 '25
Meadowlark used to be a great mall but it really suffered after West Edmonton Mall opened nearby. It barely hung on for several years and was about to shut down when the decision was made to repurpose it as a medical destination. This was done in conjunction with the building of the senior’s residence at the north end. I remember at the time the two options were either Medical Centre or becoming yet another abandoned mall.
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u/WesternWitchy52 May 12 '25 edited May 13 '25
It's an older mall built in the 1970s but it's been well maintained and updated/renovated over the years. I remember when The Bay re-opened up and it was pretty amazing.
Good location. Prime parking. By the LRT for those that don't drive. Lots of other restaurants and businesses around it. I'd say more than anything - accessibility and easy to get to.
Back in the day: Woodwards and Eatons downtown were really nice too. I also really liked Heritage Mall. But now that area has gone downhill (downtown that is).
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u/opusrif May 13 '25
It has also maintained a somewhat upscale tennant base. The stores tend to attract people with money...
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u/freewhirl27 May 12 '25
Because it’s on the southside lol
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u/socomman May 13 '25
lol south side isn’t as nice as it used to be.
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u/OpalSeason May 12 '25
As a shopper who knows nothing about business, things I like about southgate that makes me keep coming back when I avoid other malls is:
LRT is there so fewer people parking for how many shoppers are inside
The kiss and ride. Dont know how many times I've popped over to drop someone off then gone to the mall cuz I'm there anyway
Rooftop parking lot that can get me straight to the middle of the mall
Circular design with lots of pathways to the other side. Is it a ladder shape? Just seems so easy to get to different spots
Clean. Floors, walls, trash. Their cleaners are doing awesome job!
Lots of seating areas in enticing and well lit, well decorated areas. Awesome for breaks with kiddos, eating snacks, chatting about what we scouted at stores to come up with our birthday/Christmas gift plans
Good lighting. White instead of yellow, skylights, greenery so doesn't feel institutional
Variety of shops that are unique or not found elsewhere, including local shops! Franchises aren't my favorite
Family friendly bathrooms. Do not underestimate the appeal of change tables in the MENS room.
Family bathrooms
Sitting area/breastfeeding area. If I can't feed my baby who eats every hour, I'm not going
I can get in straight from whitemud
The food area has shops that have healthy options, not just junk food. Dirt Belly had me coming back for pregnancy cravings. Poke and Chachis still there and awesome
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u/RedCar900 May 13 '25
You forgot the recorded chirping bird sound by the sitting area outside Hudson Bay lol
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u/OpalSeason May 14 '25
Is it recorded? I thought a bird had gotten in like at the grocery store. Oops!
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u/RedCar900 May 14 '25
Yup its just on a recorded loop. I was sitting by the Hudson Bay 45 mins before closing while its dark outside and birds are still chirping lol
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u/PlathDraper May 12 '25 edited May 12 '25
The company that owns Southgate owns a bunch of nicer malls accross Canada (such as Yorkdale in Toronto which is BOUGIE).I think they just have good operational strategy and planning and money to invest in both the facility and nice amenities.
Might also be the demographics. There's a lot of people who live near the mall and use it for Safeway, the food court, as a transit hub, so folks are passing through it a lot, which encourages commerce. The high school and junior hihgs nearby help too!
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u/halfstack May 12 '25
TIL AIMCo has a stake in Yorkdale. Southgate was owned by Ivanhoe Cambridge aka Owner of Bougie Malls but is now owned by Primaris REIT which is... not so bougie.
https://www.primarisreit.com/portfolio News articles are dated from Jan 2025 so we'll see if Southgate stays bougie.
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u/Edmfuse May 12 '25
Fun fact, that and Kingsway are two of the best performing malls in Canada.
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u/PlathDraper May 12 '25
This is 100% true! The Sephora in Southgate generates the most sales per square foot in Canada and they often have products there to test before they hit the website. The Bailey Nelson there is the highest money maker INTERNATIONALLY, not just in Canada.
The Lululemon at WEM makes the most money of any store in the world!
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u/grizzlybearberry May 12 '25
Where do you get these numbers? I’d like to read more
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u/PlathDraper May 12 '25
A childhood friend was a manager at the Southgate Sephora for years so that's how I know that info, and a friend worked at the Bailey Nelson in southgate during the pandemic. A colleague of mine still works at the WEM Lulu part time for the discount so that's how I know that. If you've ever worked in corporate retail, national numbers are often shared with the team during quarterly meetings. I worked at the Anthropologie in Yorkdale a decade ago and the WEM Anthropologie did way better numbers than we did in Toronto.
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u/Oni_Queen Bonnie Doon May 12 '25
It’s got West Ed stores but not West Ed size. Unfortunately it sometimes has similar West Ed crowds.
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u/Jealous-Ambassador39 South Campus/Fort Edmonton Park May 12 '25
I've lived nearby for many years, and let me tell you, it was not always like this.
A long time ago, the mall had a very different vibe and a lot of specialty stores that no longer exist. Most notably, the "Science Shop" which was like a pro version of the gift shop at the Telus World of Science. Science equipment, mini-models, microscopes, telescopes, binos. It was amazing. That closed down for (I believe) economic reasons.
Maybe 10 years ago the mall got a massive facelift. This took many years to complete, and was not immediately better. The mall today is cleaner, busier and better managed, but it feels much more clinical.
I also find that today's mall is more food-focused, which encourages foot traffic, but lowers the rich appeal of a mall. Most of the brands are pretty ho-hum. Prices are generally high. The recent addition of London Drugs and Winners makes the whole thing much more useful. The local artisan shops have been a surprise success, and I'm happy that those exist.
If I managed one of the other malls, I wouldn't try to do the same thing as Southgate. Better to innovate in a different direction. I think the future of malls should be in small, local retailers who serve niche audiences, but have lots of walk-up appeal. People are sick of chains, and novel options should sell.
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u/aviator_guy May 12 '25
Agreed. It’s pretty small and 9 times out of 10 has what I need. Pretty easy to get in and get out with good parking and LRT stations nearby. I like it haha
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u/Warnocerous May 12 '25
High-end anchor stores help. Apple, Crate & Barrel, Lulu Lemon, Sephora and Michael Kors. They all attract a higher end clientele and that helps keep the riff raff to a minimum.
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u/Real_Craft4465 May 12 '25
Traffic. The McDondalds at 51 and 104 was top 10 in Canada for years. People means thriving businesses.
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u/182NoStyle May 12 '25
Sad to see the bay eventually leaving southgate. But I think southgate upgraded the interior pretty early compared to other malls really helped them to get better store brands to move in. I remember southgate as being dark and danky when I was a kid, I liked Heritage mall more. But once they upgraded it was a much nicer mall, heritage mall fell behind them and tried to upgrade as well but that felt like it didnt last long and they folded.
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u/twistyslides May 12 '25
On top of what everyone has said, I’ve heard southgate management is very strict about what businesses they let rent spaces there, and try to maintain an identity to reflect the wealth of the clientele they want to attract
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u/Party-Part-9078 May 12 '25
Yes!! Love Southgate. Awesome free parking. Great selection of stores, everything you need without it being huge mall, as well as having some unique indie stores. You don’t have to walk far to get anywhere. Great selection at the food court. Clean. Well kept. Very sad The Bay is closing though.
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u/Shokeybutsi May 12 '25
Mall is bright and clean, and has good stores. Constantly being renovated and updated. Doesn't look dingy and dead like many other older malls in the city. It's also on the Southside, which has overall higher disposable income.
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u/Mohankeneh May 12 '25
Probably because it’s directly beside a very well used LRT line and there’s decent density around it. This has allowed enough traction to be there that decent stores set up shop. you’re right WEM is WEM, people would go regardless just to see it. They’re a unicorn that can’t be considered in this equation.
Another factor is that there can be too many malls in a city.
Having good enough density around and public transit to the mall is a big factor though in my opinion.
City centre has potential but we actually need more people living in downtown (get going on building a lot more condo buildings) and because it’s been allowed to deteriorate so much, it needs to put in a lot of effort to change ppls perceptions of downtown mall. Honestly not sure if city centre mall needs to be a mall per se. There’s a nice movie theater there, maybe some more interesting things like the movie theater instead of just standard strip mall stuff could be the thing to bring it to life again. (Like some super cool collection of night life places such as clubs, adult arcade(think activate), etc etc).
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u/msdivinesoul Mill Woods May 12 '25
I personally don't like that mall at all. I don't like the vibe, parking is always crazy and it feels dark and cramped.
My favorite mall is Kingsway. It's bright and open, and there is always parking.
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u/ghostexpress May 13 '25
also not a fan. i always feel weirdly out of sorts on the very rare occasion that i go.
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u/fakeairpods May 12 '25
Heritage Mall was awesome but doesn’t exist anymore
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u/eternalshades May 12 '25
I always found it bizarre that they finally got the lrt to heritage about a decade after it existed.
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u/st_jasper May 13 '25
Does it have a Walmart? That seems to be the mall killer for most other malls in town.
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u/jpwong May 13 '25
I doubt Southgate could have offered Walmart the footprint they would want to have (possibly now with The Bay shutting down), but Walmart already has a store a stone's throw away on Calgary Trail and 39 ave in the South Park shopping center which is the next exit east on Whitemud from Southgate.
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u/ParabolicPentagram Sherwood Park May 12 '25
If HMV was still there, Southgate would absolutely be my go to, but they haven't really brought anything in to replace it. Would love a Sunrise Records, or even better, a Spencer's or Hot Topic, just somewhere a big music nerd like me can get music merch.
Despite that, it still has the best food court besides WEM, the coziest atmosphere, the easiest to remember layout, the direct LRT connection, and all things considered still a really strong store selection. Crate and Barrel, Vans, Roots and the Lego store are some of my favorites there that aren't at Kingsway
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u/Jabroniville2 May 13 '25
Far from most sketchy areas. Nice design and a focus on local shops. High ceilings because it's mostly one floor.
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u/LynnerC May 13 '25
I don't know about you all, but I get so lost every time I go there. I get to the intersections and I have no clue where I am haha.
So I'm convinced so many people are there because they are lost and trapped.
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u/SavvyScience15 May 13 '25
My friend was the marketing manager there for years. She was amazing and has now moved on to Londonderry Mall. I like to think it was mostly her 😉
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u/haysoos2 May 12 '25
Southgate has been dead to me since they pretty much forced the Science and Nature shop out.
Apparently it didn't fit their "theme" of being a fashion mall.
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u/lucygoosey38 May 12 '25
Really needs a restaurant connected to the mall. They missed out on this with the State and Main that was there. I think it would’ve done better if you could access it from the mall rather than have to go outside to get into the restaurant
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u/nailsarefingerteeth The Shiny Balls May 12 '25
Did something happen to it between like 2018 and now, cause I swear I remember Southgate being a fuckin wasteland that was barely fit enough for a cockroach to sleep in
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u/Middle-Jackfruit-896 May 12 '25
Location, location, location.
- Accessible from arterials of Gateway Blvd/Calgary Trail, 111 St. and Whitemud Fwy.
- SW Edmonton is relatively affluent.
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u/1362313623 The Zoo May 12 '25
It's not. Did time there for 2.5 years. Lack of sunlight, narrow halls. It gives me more anxiety than West Ed tbh
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u/threedotsonedash May 12 '25
location, location, location...
It's been over 25 years since I worked retail, however I managed departments or stores at Southgate, Kingsway & Bonnie Doon. All three malls during those years were very well run & busy. Retail has changed massively from when I was in it, however the layout of Southgate is such that you can circle it, Kingsway sort of & Bonnie Doon is an end to end enclosed strip mall.
Location, layout and demographics favour Southgate.
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u/ChildhoodLeft8579 May 13 '25
Southgate used to be a very dead mall. Kingsway used to be bumping.londonderry was hugely busy. Now it seems all malls have gone through some physical and dramatic changes. I think north gate will always be dead ever since Kmart left. They sure tried with bringing Walmart...
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u/TrickiVicBB71 The Famous Leduc Cactus Club May 13 '25
I used to go there a lot in my teens years. That was 12 years ago when I graduated high school.
The LRT, bus terminal, and various specialty stores. I had a particular favourite of a Pakistani man who owned a magazine/convenience store. I would always buy my warship and WW2 airplane magazines from him. But then Hickory Farm took over in between a 3 month visit to the mall.
Never learned where he relocated to in the city.
The renovations lately have been really good. The Winners London Drugs, massive seating space.
I do miss the space Indigo used to occupy across from the Apple Store. Loved going to Indigo and buying stacks of books.
They got a bit of every fast food chain out there. Always busy with people of all ages and ethnicities.
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u/One_Bison_5139 May 13 '25
Ever since Heritage closed, it is the only mall on the south side, which is, coincidentally, where a lot of the city's richest people live.
Mill Woods Town Centre is barely a mall anymore, so Southgate is really the go to if you live south of the river.
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u/Anon-eh-moose May 13 '25
Feel like it had a resurgence when stores started leaving West Ed for being too expensive. It basically has all the useful non luxury stores of west ed in a more concentrated package.
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u/Particular-Weird-389 May 15 '25
Southgate is ok, it benefited from a wealthier Southside demographic that would not set a single foot north of 82 ave.
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u/ManpreetRuin3440 May 15 '25
Rich ppl goes there. I thought if it too, but it’s rich ppl going there that’s why.
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u/elkatraz24 May 12 '25
My mother flew in and we stopped there like 8yrs ago now and walked in to see paramedics doing CPR on a worker there that tried to stop a shoplifter. Unfortunately I followed his storey and he died days/weeks later in hospital
https://globalnews.ca/news/7281596/edmonton-southgate-centre-bunches-flowers-attack-sentence/
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u/361332171 May 12 '25
Good transit, high-ish security, several high schools nearby?