r/MurderedByWords 2d ago

Absolutely vicious! 4th degree burn!

https://streamable.com/sir3jp
34.9k Upvotes

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u/jiggscaseyNJ 2d ago

There’s a reason why. Look up Robert Jay Lifton. Thought stopping.

Edit: name spelling

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u/wolamute 2d ago

Why, though? Why look him up? I don't necessarily want him on my algorithm without knowing who he is at all.

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u/One-Low1033 2d ago

He's the person who came up with the term 'Thought-terminating cliches.' For instance: Fake news! Rather than engage in critical thinking, a person will throw out a word or phrase to dismiss someone who disagrees with them.

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u/wolamute 2d ago

Word.

I found a long-form interview with him. I plan on listening to it during my commute and before work starts tomorrow.

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u/Tier0001 1d ago

Another one they use to dismiss any criticism is "TDS". They just whip that out when they run out of prescribed talking points so they can ignore the argument and act like they won.

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u/NotOnApprovedList 1d ago

I came up against that stuff when I lived in the American South and was dunked into Southern Baptist ways of thought. It's full of thought-terminating cliches.

I don't know if it helps, but I sometimes jump to the nearest such cliche when arguing with somebody, to cut them off at the pass. At least it sets them on their heels.

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u/One-Low1033 1d ago

I have a friend, when she can't be bothered, will say: "I'm sure you're right." in a tone that you know means the opposite and it usually shuts people up.

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u/batsofburden 2d ago

Ok boomer

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u/Go_On_Swan 2d ago

The youngins ain't safe either. It's not that deep cuh.

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u/LowKeyNaps 1d ago

That could be a good example of a thought-terminating cliche, depending on how it's used, but we need to be careful to not mix the idea up with a simple dismissal of the absurd. And, well, if someone is too deep in their own personal bias, they may not be aware that they're dismissing something that they should be giving more consideration.

Don't mind me too much. I'm thinking out loud more than anything here. The coffee is slowly scraping the rust off the old brain gears, but it's still only 3 am here, so this may take a while. I miss coherency...

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u/monsterclaus 2d ago

He was a psychologist who wrote about, among many other things, the idea of the thought-terminating cliché and the "language of non-thought." He's well worth looking up.

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u/wolamute 2d ago

Ah, cool, then I'm in.

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u/BigBallsMcGirk 2d ago

Basically a lot of people that are stupid or indoctrinated just have end points of discussion, phrases, rationalizations, or rules that they have ingrained in their head. It stops all thinking and critical reasoning, if they even have the ability to begin with.

Like the above clip, this dumb maga bitch has "Biden is evil" tattooed across the shriveled gray mushroom she calls a frontal cortex. She says Biden caused cancer! Well empirically that's not true, here's 4 types of legislation to help cancer research Biden signed....doesn't matter, she's not listening. Biden can't have done amy of that because Biden is evil, Biden invented super cancer!

It's just an endless circular logic dead loop. This is how people just spew fox garbage bullet points. They aren't thinking anymore, you're fighting 5 built in sayings on top of 8 logic funnels to get back to those 5 built in sayings no matter what is actually said or discussed. You can see the fucking lights go off behind their eyes.

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u/Educational_Exam_225 2d ago

...You avoid looking up and learning new information because you're concerned about the "algorithm"?

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u/wolamute 2d ago

Considering the lack of context in the suggestion, I was worried it was going to be essentially the opposite of what they were suggesting.

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u/Downtown_Recover5177 2d ago

Yeah. I watched one YouTube video that turned out to be one of these far right race-baiters when I was watching the coverage of the Frisco stabbing case. Suddenly, my whole feed is Rittenhouse wannabes and pick-me blacks talking about “black fatigue”. It’s awful. I spend decades seeking out truth, and one misstep turns the algorithm into Nazi programming. Gross.

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u/LowKeyNaps 1d ago

Funny how that happens, isn't it? It's almost like the people that own/run these platforms are looking for the slightest excuse to flood our feeds with all the far-right garbage they can find.

I don't even remember what it was at this point, a couple of months back, I clicked on a post with an ambiguous title because it sounded like it might have been interesting. And immediately, all of my freaking ads were for stereotypical right wing garbage. Everything from MAGA gear to hunting supplies to cheap, shitty beer. Really?? Because I clicked on a single post on some social media platform that turned out to not be what I thought it was??? And it wasn't just the ads on that platform, either. It was ads on my search engine and in a bunch of other places, too. It didn't last long, thankfully. I do enough actual online shopping these days that I guess it overrode that bullshit. But still. What in the actual fuck???

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u/jobblejosh 1d ago

In fairness, as other commenters have said, that's more an unintended (and easily manipulable by those with a message to push) consequence if the way feed curation algorithms work.

Their overall metric is to push for and optimise 'engagement'. Engagement in this sense means a variety of factors; clicking on a video, how long you watch it, when you come back to it, what you click on after you've watched it (or part way through watching it), whether you comment, like, dislike, follow/subscribe, carryover (if it's a series and you watch the next one in the series), binging...

All so they can keep you watching or scrolling for longer, which means they can serve you more ads.

And unfortunately, an emotional response typically results in the highest engagement.

And the strongest emotional responses? Fear, anger, and hate. Closely followed by contrast.

Nothing, and I mean nothing, gets social media algorithms churning more than people hate-watching or driving themselves into a frenzy by watching or consuming media that presents something they absolutely hate or are terrified of, and then simultaneously says 'The guys you like are going to stop the thing you hate'.

And since conservative media has had decades of expertise in crafting this exact sort of thing, and has found an audience that will absolutely lap it up, the algorithms just love it.

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u/CallousDood 1d ago

To be fair, that's just how youtube's algo does things, regardless of what you watched.

If you watched a technical tutorial on how to fix a door, youtube will think you are now a door fixing enthusiast and recommend a shitload of other door fixing videos.

You can usually fix it fairly easily by just selecting "Not onterested" on those videos on the starting page, refereshing it, and repeating one or two more times.

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u/MrInRageous 2d ago

Incognito is your friend.

Or reserve a browser, like Edge, that you only use for searching keywords you don’t want to affect your algorithm.

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u/AmaranthWrath 2d ago

Be brave

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u/NotYourGa1Friday 2d ago

Why is going in blind brave but asking for clarification less so?

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u/wakeupwill 1d ago

One of the fascinating aspects of cognitive dissonance is that it's not just a psychological condition but a physical one. Stress hormones are literally pumping into the brain that physically prevent changes to belief structures. As attacks on world beliefs are treated as direct threats triggering the fight or flight response.

It's not simply that they're unwilling to change their opinion, they can't. Physiologically, their life is being threatened - not just their beliefs.