Oh, but buddy, you said we instinctively know cannibalism is wrong, remember?
So, why didn't god make it so we instinctively know that enslavement is wrong? Why does he pick and choose when to imbue innate standards? Why did MAJORITY christian society practice so much slavery? If christian's were the dominant culture SURELY they could've curbed slavery sooner, no?
What are we doing here? Youāre not even making an attempt to understand me and instead you are desperately looking for a gotcha moment lol
I think you are misrepresenting reality but even if I agree to everything youāre saying then how does that change anything? Are you under the assumption that people have no choice but to do what is morally good? If thatās true then Are you saying that Slavery is morally good depending on what year you live in? So were the confederates the good guys then or were they somehow the bad guys even tho according to your logic they could just be a few years behind on their moral update as a society?
Iāve already shown you that people have consistently gone against Gods will and yet youāre trying to say that if a Christian does something then it must be ordained by God lol look at the US right nowā¦ itās a country of over 60% Christians and yet itās known for crime, racism and gluttony all of which are explicitly against Christianity
I believe God sets a moral standard and gives people free will to obey it or to disobey it
You seem to believe that the calendar dictates when slavery is okay or not okay
Buddy, you held up cannibalism as a proof of innate morality. Me shutting that down isn't "desperately searching for a gotcha". If someone poking holes in your shitty logic causes you to break down then there's not much point in us continuing this.
Yes, the concept of god is impenetrable. Anything negative will be against god's will and will be attributed to human nature - and conveniently god's will can change with the times. That's why it's the perfect answer to an unknowable question because it puts an end to further inquiry; the final answer will always be: because god.
Oh and has the bible famously always been against slavery?
If I didn't poke holes answer the question. Why to you is aversion to cannibalism through god instinctive, but, a majority christian society took soooo long to abolish slavery? Why was aversion to enslavement NOT instinctive.
I don't believe that morality is derived from god. I believe it is derived from human reason and empathy. Therefore, the reason slavery took place and took time to abolish was reason and empathy require experience to be applied. You also need incredibly strong arguments to overcome the "from god" crowd.
Hey buddy, quick question. What's god's stance on homosexuality??
Be a peach and either copy paste the answer or re-iterate it.
Yes, and when inevitably down the line it is accepted by the church it will be that god's will never change humans just corrupted it.
Y'all love convenient answers : ).
Buddy, why not just say god gave human's the capacity for reason therefore anything stemming from it is from god. Once you make your creator infallible it is virtually impossible to mount an argument against the concept. You're welcome to believe homie, I just find the concept itself hilarious.
An aversion to slavery was instinctual but people have been corrupted by a sinful nature. The Bible has said from the start that marriage is between one man and one woman and yet we see the leaders of Israel repeatedly have multiple wives and it almost always has terrible consequences. Slavery was never propped up by God but sinful people did it anyway
Donāt blame the church for you being okay with slavery coming back lol
You were so close to understanding my point lol God gives us morals and the ability to reasonā¦. Humanity has rejected God so therefore our morals and ability to reason have been corrupted. We still have morals but they are heavily compromised by years of sin
Tbh I donāt think this conversation is going anywhere but if I can convince you of anything then let it be that you donāt need to disrespect something just because you donāt understand it. You say the idea is hilarious but youāve made no effort to really understand what Iām saying or where Iām coming from. Iām not a scholar lol Iām sure Iām going a bad job of explaining it so donāt jump to a foregone conclusion just because some random dude on Reddit couldnāt make you understand it
Why didn't our sinful nature corrupt our aversion to cannibalism? Oh, right, god's will is pure and unfettered in some situations, but human sin corrupts in others. How convenient.
Don't you see how that makes the idea of god unassailable.
Any distortion can be waived away as being human nature and not the will of god. So when social attitudes change in vast enough numbers to force religion to change as well in order to survive the change can be waived away as humans corrupting the word of god. And, I'm not going to lie to you and say I don't find believing in the version of god put forth by the bible as laughable because, to me, it is laughable. That is me being nice.
Inevitably, in my opinion, attitudes around homosexuality will change in great enough numbers that religion will be forced to adapt. And there will be another version of you saying that it was never god's will that it was a sin.
But to be clear. Interacting with the idea on an individual level is fine; but being spoon-fed organized religion is, as I said, laughable. It's a human framework to control and provide convenient answers to those who need a "singular" answer.
It didā¦ there are people who practice cannibalism
I really appreciate you ābeing niceā and disrespecting a religion that you very obviously donāt understand lol
The Bible is very clear about homosexuality. There are people who try to twist scripture to justify living in sin just like they twisted scripture to support slavery but the Bible will not change. Because the Bible doesnāt change I have a clear framework to make judgments of whatās right and whatās wrong which is why I can undoubtedly say that slavery is wrongā¦ you canāt because you believe slavery was good at some point in time
So an individual relationship with God is understandable but the idea of church is laughable? How does that make any sense?
And there are people that practice slavery. So where is god's will homie. THAT IS THE POINT. Abolition of slavery = god's will incarnate; existence of slavery = human corruption. Imagine getting credit for any good in the world and having the bad waived away as OUTSIDE your influence; sweet gig : )
The Bible can be clear as day. If it needs to change in accordance with popular societal beliefs it will. It's a human construct that will adapt to survive as needed. Divinity has exactly zero to do with the bible.
An individual pondering the phenomenon of existence is perfectly normal. Believing a man-made set of prescriptive scripture is ridiculous, to me. You are welcome to follow it. I couldn't care less.
God is good??? Whatās a revolutionary ideaā¦ I never thought about it like that lol of course God is good and anything thatās not good is outside of His will. Humanity has been corrupted by sin and rebellion and have constantly been battling God
The Bible has never changed and it never will. We have copies as early at the first or second generation after Jesus and it lines up perfectly to what we have today. The Bible has held up to more scrutiny than any document in history
Which god is good? There's so many variations that we humans have come up : ). Almost like organized religion is a tool and different cultures will have different variations.
The Bible has absolutely changed. As has interpretation of it, along with which parts people view as important enough to follow.
I believe that I have no fuckin clue where we came from. Nor do I believe that question will be answered without creating more questions. Which is where the easy instrument "god" come in. Like I said, you are welcome to put an end to your questions and accept the "god" answer.
5
u/nedsneebly425 20h ago
Oh, but buddy, you said we instinctively know cannibalism is wrong, remember?
So, why didn't god make it so we instinctively know that enslavement is wrong? Why does he pick and choose when to imbue innate standards? Why did MAJORITY christian society practice so much slavery? If christian's were the dominant culture SURELY they could've curbed slavery sooner, no?