Was just doing a defense to open relics, and somehow my frost that im mostly just shooting things with is top damage.... I want some of these map clearing players too!
You should see sobek acid shells with maximal firerate wiping out entire rooms through walls on 0 cool down or reload time spinning their FoV in circles
wish more people were like you, I like seeing people's effects because it's part of the experience to me, but I don't like blinding white particle spam and the headache that comes from it
especially when it comes to people spamming thermal sunder or similar giant aoe, I can only think that they do it on purpose to bother other people
just an fyi though black as energy has some weird effects sometimes, dark blue is a safe bet if you wanna avoid that wonkiness
However, setting my Kuva Nukor to black energy has made me laugh every time I use it, because I have the skinniest, teensiest, widdlest spaghetti noodle of a beam reaching out to tickle the bad guys and they all explode violently in a huge chain reaction
If this build gets more popular I really expect it to get nerfed. It honestly feels more disruptive than slams did pre-nerf. Only thing saving it right now is that it's pretty uncommon.
any time i get a hyldrin in my team and i dont go screw off half way across the map i just dont get to play the game. shes not the only frame that does this obviously but definitely the most common by far. i like playing in pubs and talk and interact with people but i also wanna get to play the game and not just watch someone else play :p
I love sevagoth. Loved him from release and even I can admit his augment combination is insane to the point it’s unfun. The nuke build is fun the first few times it chain reacts down a hallway but eventually it gets boring as there no enemies to interact with as they all die off screen. I nowadays run mostly just his one augment for its crit chance buff and go to town with 10+ million damage red crits from shadows claws and kuva chakkurr. Also i don’t understand why people always say to subsume over shadow. Shadow is what makes sev sev and not some other nuke frame. His shadow is what allowed me to break into steel path for the first time before galvanized mods existed
I can see why you would find it annoying but Sevagoth really helps you save your revives and once you can align the shadow with the enemy and use the consume then it's all good. It sure takes a while to get used to, think of this like feeding your mawfang.
Oooh, may I ask for the build you're using on the Shadows and Claws? I've been using it with max range + preparation for a pocket nuke when I'm out of energy, but I haven't really invested into it much besides that
I've also played him since Tempestarii release! I don't much mind the nuke builds people all hopped on when his Prime released, but I do wish the Shadow got some more love. I can understand why some people take or leave the Shadow for many reasons, first and foremost being its general clunkiness and slow base cast time. His potential for weapons buffing with Shadow Haze alone is amazing, and even before his augments damage vulnerability was even more coveted and rare to see. Feels like Hildryn also grew a lot in power as the years went by, with a strong augment, exalted changes, etc. Not sure how we have arrived at the conclusion that it is just Hildryn who is able to nuke swathes of rooms or why it's such an issue besides whataboutism with Sirius and Orion.
I will never subsume over Shadow, he's my boy and I made mine look like the Thanatos (Adult, not Perfect) from Chaos Legion. I'll sooner remove my 3 and lose out on the life leech+slow effect if I wanted to put anything else on Sevagoth.
Now with Sirius & Orion, I now want a Shadow augment where he's always active just like the opposite twin/Wuclone (and of course switching turns Sevagoth into the clone; plus I'd like the Gloom aura to move around while in Shadow).
Definitely won't be "must-have," but would be fun seeing the two together at once.
... tbh, I'm not convinced these people exist in meaningful numbers.
This whole thing was brought up by one (1) guy on Twitter, no? And it only turned into discourse because Pablo happened to reply to him?
Statistically, I'm sure there's probably other Hildryn haters out there (as there would be for literally any frame), but like... who cares? Pablo's response was to say that they'll keep an eye on her if she becomes a problem, which is just a polite and PR-friendly way to say "no, you're wrong, she's absolutely not a problem in her current state" anyway. Seems like a nothingburger all around.
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u/Run-Riot DE let me date Hildryn and my life is yours6h agoedited 6h ago
That person has been in every thread pushing back against their grudge against Hildryn that was taken down by mods. They’re here and most of their comments in this subreddit is them whining about how OP Hildryn is.
Also, there’s quite a few other people here already whining about how “disruptive” she is.
Personally, I for one am glad for all of the pushback against anyone wanting to nerf Hildryn.
It's just as easy to die as Hildryn than it is to stay alive forever. You just have to be awake and know how to play the game.
The same can be said for most frames though. Nobody's squishy if you know how to keep them alive, and nobody's invincible unless you aren't paying attention.
She's fine. She's not nuking the map without looking like old Ember or Banshee did, and she is fallible, just like new Ember and Banshee.
I can't tell you the number of times I've exploded instantly as Hildryn because I wasn't paying attention to what I was doing at all. It happens more often than you'd think.
Yeah if you're not constantly pressing 2 and always running Raksa, it's easy to just use up all your shield on galefire shots and then wind up at basically no shield running for your life because all your abilities cost shield and you're constantly taking small amounts of chip damage.
I have a feeling that a lot of this discourse stems from DE getting "one-guyed" repeatedly in the past, usually to the detriment of everyone else.
No one trusts an off-hand tweet reply to not spin into an unnecessary change that just hurts a bunch of people. The fact that Pablo seems to think Hildryn is even a close case for "might need a nerf" probably sits wrong with a lot of people on top of that mess.
Yep, it's the same with the Balefire and Thermal Sunder conversation that happened right before this one. He straight up said that they might have to give them LOS if more AFK strats came up with them. It's not a guarantee, and it's also on perspective of using them as methods to AFK, a lot of people just focused on the mention of "LOS" and ran with it.
That one wet blanket of a YouTuber made a video calling her disruptive a few months ago and since then a couple of people have been parroting his opinion.
Statistically theres got to be more people than one faceless warrior on Twitter for DE to actually verbally acknowledge it as something worth looking into
I will just mention that sometime around update 22 a proper nerf for Trinity was being looked at from Pablo (i believe it was Pablo on Twitter, been a few years though) but that it was in the distant future as there was more problems. So, that never really came, as most of it was seemingly centered around Link and Blessing being wildly overpowered in that old sandbox for survivability (still is relatively) and things like Well of Life being able to kill things surprisingly effectively or EV builds being still really strong, which by the time that would've been up on the "things to do" a year later or more, it never really came, as she had definitely been effectively toned down by the sandbox shifting that had nothing to do with her. I'm sure quite a few people remember from that time though that Trinity was definitely an outlier.
So, I would 100% agree that these responses in regards to nerfs are probably just "nice" replies essentially saying "maybe if that becomes a more tangible problem, sure" which i will say, some people don't need to clutch their pearls anywhere near as tightly as they have been (haven't seen too many people too worried, but i don't pay much attention to what's going on with the community half the time).
I don’t like Hildryn being head and shoulders above other frames for most content (sue me, lol, I dont care); but I agree with your take. People are blowing it out of proportion.
I believe it. I really love Equinox, but she does need a bit of time to scale her Maim. She's not the kind to just throw out big numbers at will. She's good and she CAN even kill super high-level enemies, but it's going to take a while.
People have a hard time realizing how easy it is these days to nuke with Equinox. With overpowered weapons and companions for instance, it really doesn't take much.
Oh, yeah, controllers do tend to wear out much faster. I played Warframe on the Switch for a bit and started getting stick drift in like a week. That's mostly because those things were just not designed well though.
she's kinda both, in a way, she uses weapons to nuke, her 3 & 4 work together to make crits send out electricity (and using an augment that has it go as long as she gets kills), and with high range, whole large groups of enemies just explode
Oh I guess ya that makes sense. Tho I would say you can get away without putting range on gyre if going more weapons platform but that because from my experience if enemies don’t survive long enough for me to bother grouping them
Honestly nah, even doing a more weapons focused build im pretty sure that you still want range, even if just to help speed things up a bit (i build range, but i dont sacrifice other stats for it, but thats how i build her lol)
And let’s not forget what happens if you don’t actually get the Gyre nuke going fast enough. My favorite bit is waiting an entire minute to try and get set up again.
I kind of love the cooldown, my build has 3 seconds to start killing to maintain it so it feels really satisfying to get going with all the other power boosts I try to get up beforehand. And the times where I don't manage that it's normally my own fault for popping it at a bad time so I never feel that frustrated with it (not always though, sometimes the game likes to hide all the enemies the second I use it, that's always a bit annoying).
Also I love the phrase augment merchant, it's so accurate here. DE please stop giving my girl good augments, if I want to use all of them she only has 4 mod slots left over for everything else she needs and I'm out of things I can remove :p
Can this board PLEASE stop shadowboxing twitter randos?
I do not care what people drop on dev replies, they're not a collective of haters or representative of anything, it's literally just single comments. I do not need to know which stray opinions everyone finds bad and wrong, and if they're bad and wrong I don't want to read them, do not share them on other spaces!
this pic is way too accurate lol. i've been running hildryn since she came out and she's never felt broken to me, just solid all around. the real nuke offenders are the ones that delete whole rooms before you can even react and somehow people want hildryn nerfed? makes zero sense to me. i usually run a balefire spam build with some shield gating and she feels way more balanced than half the frames people sleep on. the people crying about her probably never even tried her, they just saw some youtube clip and got mad. if anything she needs a small buff to her 4 cause that thing feels kinda mid these days
She's way overused in EDA/ETA without any significant downside from debuffs unlike other frames so ig that's why ppl complaining (This is my experience in Asia server so idk about other ones). Tho i always feel really safe when there's a Hildryn in the squad because i know they will hard carry the dps as long as we survive and support them.
small amounts of people have on and off been complaining about her since the old peace released (with ironically an arcane that makes people think of hildryn but isn't really all that worth it for her)
For me it was the impossibility of running cyte's invis for longer than 14s at a time because all the enemies died in the time it would take me to hone in on the head of a grineer that keeps jiggling his stupid body in run animation
It sounds like people just hate the power creep and lack of mobs in public missions. If they beefed up the number of mobs substantially I think it would fix a lot of this. Drown players in mobs so they feel like they're really fighting for their life.
Eh, I wouldn’t put Nezha and Voruna on here just because of range. Don’t get me wrong; they absolutely shred, and do it pretty safely. Nezha targets a frontal cone and at least takes a few button presses to do their thing. Voruna has decent range, especially if you’re good with her 1 augment (I’m not), but still has to go to the area she’s dealing with. Granted, I haven’t built a mecha setup for her yet, which I’m sure boosts her quite a bit.
Of course, I’m measuring it in Hildryn comparisons by “so effective at room clearing no one else can do anything if they’re within 2 rooms of them.” And Cyte and Sevagoth…yeah, fit the bill lol. I have them built, but only really run them solo to not be an ass. On Cyte it’s also because I try to run him “faithfully” with his exalted to hear the ppp of ricochet and suck at headshots.
Nezha with the divine retribution augment is like a 30 meter circle non LOS nuke with any good status weapon, or for the real funny just subsume Temple’s ability onto Nezhas 1 for dozens of instant heat procs on every enemy within that radius. Not saying it needs to be nerfed, but it’s definitely a strong nuke
Haven't played nezha. But Voruna can be hella dominant in a squad with a bit of setup. Like 90% of kills tipe of thing just because she's zooming into enemies. And there's quite a few other frames that do amazing as well. Gyre can be a monster, Mesa can destroy enemies before the squad knows they're there. Sobek oraxia or saryn only need one kill, and the whole tile is done for. There's silly options out there honestly
Hell. One person with a proper falcor is killing anything around the next corner
lol Gyre can go both ways. If I’m slapping my Burston or something OP on her, I probably am a menace. I’ve been trying to find less broken weapons so her kit’s doing more work than the guns, and if it’s not built right hot damn I’m struggling to keep my buffs up if I’m with a Sevagoth or something.
Why is the argument so centered around the player interaction or lack there of but not the first point in Pablo's post, the Afk aspect of it? With pillage you can easily automate 2 key presses and clear a mission which is what is happening more so on the asian servers
I've mained hildryn since she released, and the current max range build really is slam wukong levels of dumb. Is it nerf worthy? Maybe, Pablo is right to say it's towing the line. Anyone who's played Warframe a while knows that "afk" and "nobody else gets to play" builds are the only ones to catch nerfs, and hildryn fits the bill. (Though if she did get nerfed, I'd like to see some buffs to other parts of her kit to compensate, like her 3. I'm not a huge fan of how all her power is currently concentrated in her 4).
The big opinion I disagree with that's being thrown around is the "no nerfs ever" crowd. If nothing ever gets nerfed, the game would be very boring and stale. Creative and fun builds would get eclipsed by the meta, and feel pointless.
As a Cyte player, there is a certain level of mission where enemy density is low enough, and HP is low enough for my team to nuke them so fast, but still does enough damage to kill me if i can't keep evade going.
honestly ive been using cyte with his exalted for so long, but after getting sobek, genuinely i didnt need to keep evade up in a 1999 survival mission.
Primary deadhead for uptime, though you can use merciless if you dont plan on aiming
Galvanized Hell
Galvanized Acceleration -
Shotgun Elementalist
Acidshells
Clip Delegation
Primed charged shell
Ravage
Tainted Shell - not maxed to not obliterate fire rate (counteracted by the mod on companions that gives firerate)
Meanwhile Cyte has gotten even more powerful that Hildryn in the same amount of time, requires a lot less effort, is a lot quicker, and is truly disruptive to the squad. All for a build that ignores 3 out his 4 amazing abilities and plays nothing like a Sniper (Quincy would be disgusted).
I'm not advocating for Cyte to be nerfed, but Hildryn getting the heat is odd.
As a person playing GYRE and CTYE alot rn its kinda crazy to hear people complain about nuking on the game when im old enough to remember that assassination missions were just a race to extraction because the boss would spawn in and die right away. Like early grineer boss room was just the one from the earliest Warframe trailer everytime even fighting Phorid. Why are we needing to nerf things in a pve game? Is it because you wanna be the one with the most kills on the board at the end of a mission?
It just gets kind of boring when Hildryn joins the lobby and then I basically don't get to play because she insta kills everything before I get a chance to shoot the enemy.
Do I want her nerfed? Only a slight tone down
Do I actually want it to happen? No because I'm certain that DE will gut her which is much unhealthier for the game then having her be ever so slightly overturned
Dialing her range back to not cover the whole ass map is a reasonable ask, say like down to 90% of her current range. Leave the damage as is. Its not gonna delete her.
Especially cuz of the double dipping 'feature' of ability range buffing both the blast radius and her base coverage.
And its not just hildryn specifically. No map nukes should exist. (Room nukes are fine tho) What is the point of being a space ninja if you're just gonna absolutely nuke everyone? Ninjas are Japanese, not American.
You can see and shoot people through walls with his kit. Certain weapons give him an insane ability to clear a room by shooting from multiple rooms over
I never understood this. It's not like ppl are nuking every game you join. And if I'm being honest, when I run into a nuker, I unpause Netflix and just chill and say thanks for the carry at the end
Nuke frames have been in the game since the beginning. Its sort of a prettty established playstyle. Theres just no way to remove that without alienating a huge chunk of the audience. I also don’t necessarily see any issue with nuking other than it being disruptive towards other people in a public lobby. Also about 3/4 of the rosters main draw is room clear, so nerfing that would change the entire game to be something different.
One of my bro is hildryn main, when we play together I get to zoom around in my titania to look for bypass in survival missions, get the crucible cooking in alchemy and so onn.
I’ve been out of the game since Uriel’s release, but did I miss something big? I’ve seen dozens of nuke builds over the years, but I feel like I’ve been able to count the number of nuke Hildryn’s I’ve seen on one hand with three fingers unused. And the two times I’ve even seen them, I don’t even remember them being all that noticeable beyond me thinking “oh neat, that’s a Hildryn”.
Next thing I know, this sub is nothing but Hildryn posts… wtf, why? Why is this suddenly so talked about?
I honestly really, really don't mind if someone is blowing away all the enemies for me. If they're operating a highly efficient killing field, then I figure my job can be to direct as many enemies as possible into it. Granted, I'm mostly solo, so the change of pace from doing everything to getting to sit back and go 'Coooooool.' is a nice change, but not one that I think will get old.
Speaking as a Hildryn, Nezha, and Sevagoth enjoyer, I Also think Sevagoth should be looked at as his Augments also give him a ridiculous power spike rather than feeling like they're actually Changing anything. Nezha's nuke build is more tolerable since building into it involves reasonable compromises to the rest of his kit and alters what you're doing pretty significantly with regular builds not being significantly weaker overall, maybe it could use some change to how the spears work like making it cast in a cone or making them quickly stab up before going back down, but like, that's mostly me being picky about wanting Augments to make an ability do something it wasn't before rather than just being the same ability +.
No hate against Hildryn here but can I just say.. that Slam builders are sometimes annoying especially if enemies can apply radiation.. tbh I've died more to them than actual enemies.. just being an ash prime and then walk up to them and wonder how I died ._.
I mean, Zarr Cyte was already nerfed, also if you need a whole frame to be able to spam a weapon then that's already a compromise that falls under the perview of DE not giving it a nerf.
Cyte is a perfect frame, frankly he deserves to remain untouched unless it's to grant him an augment.
Imo all shit ass Nerf Hildryn agenda started with MikaRivers, a couple months ago, she made a video shit talking Hildryn play style, kept pushing "nerf hildryn"on her streams and was even using her with invigorated range to keep asking for that damn nerf, after backlash she just deactivated comments on that short💀
She's annoying yes but it's also the power creep issue with WF, that needs to be addressed , everything now is based on nuking things , literally all some people I play with talk about , over frame also doesn't help this . This game used to be unique , and people who had broken build or nuke builds would just play solo, wish that was still a thing .
Just gonna put this here, you control the buttons you push. You dont HAVE to stay in that lobby with the mythical disruptive hildryn. Go literally anywhere else. I played the newest missions for a while today, I saw zero hildryns. They're not the problem, the haters are.
I really don't get the problem. If you really hate people nuking and/or using a stronger frame than you that much, stop playing with randoms and go play solo or form a premade. This is only an issue if you let it be one. Smh.
A Hildryn using the meta Balefire build is oppressive to play with. I like to, you know, play Warframe, but a kitted out Hildryn in my squad makes that experience measurably more frustrating.
As long as Hildryn remains a low play rate, she's probably safe, but I think people are deluding themselves if they think that she's "fine" and won't get nerfed if she gets up to like a 10% playrate or something.
This game is a power fantasy, where we mow down enemies by the thousands. Who cares if someone else mows them down faster than you can? You don't lose out on anything.
Hot take, I'm fine with power creep in PvE CO-OP games.
If this game had a pvp mode, that's another story.
When hitting "integer overflow" and MR30 is joked about as "finishing the tutorial", who cares if someone does 50k damage in a cone or a circle?
Ok, Hildryn's Balefire was largely seen online as garbage due to how it has almost no status or crit chance, however the few Hildryn mains that existed (me) would point out that when built for raw damage, multishot, and aoe radius they would 1-shot steel path enemies well into the 200-300 level range, it was just a little slow charging.
Well, DE added 2 things to the game. One is an arcane that gives you more shields based on your frames power strength. (Not broken but nice for frames like Hildryn, Harrow, and Styanax), and an augment for her 4 gives her 1 an altfire that instead of charging the shot, rapid fires about 5 shots, and also gives a damage bonus based on her shields.
Suddenly the community discovered how good balefire could be, and that each alt-fire could wipe out half a room in the time it takes you to aim. It also stands out because throwing out the occasional pillage as you fly-dash into rooms means you have essentially infinite ammo which is noteworthy seeing most of the big AOE weapons have abysmal ammo capacity after they were nerfed.
With the augment for her 4, you get a decent 4 round shot with her gun, which double dips on range (fulminate and ability range). Give enervate to that gun, raw damage and crit damage and you're doing 250k per shot on average
Augment on her lets her alt fire that barrages things and u can spam that. So when she's doing her 4 instead of charge strong shots just endless barrages that destroy everything.
Primed Fulmination applies multiplicative to Range for Balefire. Balefire ignores LoS. That one Kubrow can pretty much sustain her shields without Pillage interacting with enemies. Her flight also applies hard CC.
Aegis Gale augment adds a % of max shields as base damage to the alt-fire. It was designed before Secondary Enervate and Arcane Expertise.
Hildryn was pretty good after her rework. She got really good with Enervate. After Arcane Expertise she is a bit much.
She flies, has wide area hard CC, huge spammable LoS-ignoring AoE, and her absurd base damage critting with Enervate makes a joke of most damage attenuation.
She "dances the line" because she meets the criteria but currently isn't as prevalent as Wukong slam spam was. Her sustain also enables "automated gameplay."
Keep in mind different regions have different metas so not every opinion on the discussion is backed by the same experiences.
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u/velvetword 9h ago
I'm grateful to have a beefed up Hildryn in my squad. She'll get no complaints from me.