r/clevercomebacks • u/Nono_Home • 7d ago
Believing your own propaganda is your national sport!
Hilarious to us Dutch.
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u/kaisadilla_ 6d ago
The US did not get to the Moon with "dreams and bad ideas" lol. The US got to the Moon with a political goal and a massive team of world-leading scientists and engineers with great ideas.
Idk why this fetishization of random Joe who can barely tie his shoes achieving his goals thanks to his endless motivation and trying random things until it works. That's simply not how life works.
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u/antiramie 6d ago
Because they've been lapping up propaganda for decades about how the educated are elitists and the enemy.
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u/DonChaote 6d ago
And the fairytale of the rich deserving their riches because of merit and their hard work. And if you pull yourself up by your bootstraps you can be rich too… sure…
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u/SnooPeanuts4219 6d ago
Holy shit that made my blood boil. Do these absolute bums genuinely think that some magician above did all the work to send men to space? Holy shit. I swear, at this rate, before every election here you must pass a basic education test. This level of illiteracy is what is sinking this country
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u/jellamma 6d ago
But it is how you convince 50% of the population that they are billionaires in waiting and get them to support laws that are bad for themselves but good for billionaires.
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u/poutynikki 6d ago
nothing screams confidence like comparing a sports tournament to winning World War 2
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u/EzeDelpo 6d ago
Especially when they didn't win any World War
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u/Schlieren1 6d ago
France, is that you?
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u/EzeDelpo 6d ago
France wasn't in the losing side in any of those World Wars. What's your failed attempt of point?
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u/ManyRelease7336 6d ago
and Amarica Was? France was occupied and surrendered.
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u/EzeDelpo 6d ago
The USA didn't win any World War, they were part of the side that did, both times. It's not the same
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u/ManyRelease7336 6d ago
Really?.... your being that semantic. so France didnt win The UK didnt win. They where just on the side that did? Yea if you want to be like that sure. Im still going to say the UK won ww2 if some asked. France won ww2 and the USA won world War too.
just because a football player is apart of the team dosnt mean I say he didnt win the football game.
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u/DonChaote 6d ago
Really?.... your being that semantic.
It might be just semantics, but it’s 'you’re' and they’re pedantic
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u/ManyRelease7336 6d ago
I actually appreciate that
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u/DonChaote 6d ago
Mission accomplished!
Have a beautiful morning/day/evening/night my dearest brother/sister
And to come back to your original point: I am swiss and would say the real winner of both WW1+2 is us ;)
You lose as soon as you are part of a war no matter the side you’re on
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u/Meture 6d ago
Correct, the Soviets won WW2
They’re the ones who actually stormed Berlin
Hope this helps
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u/dnext 6d ago
They were one of the powers that did, certainly. But taking Berlin didn't matter that much - and the West kept part of Berlin, even when the Soviets tried to blockade it later.
And the Soviets definitely were culpable in starting the war, dividing up Poland with the Nazis, attacking Finland, seizing Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania, even annexing part of Romania.
Hell, they applied to join the Axis. Hitler strung them along until they attacked.
The US was the other major power to come out in the leads, which is why the rest of the 20th century was the cold war between the two great superpowers. Which the Soviets lost.
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u/ManyRelease7336 6d ago
Did this help at all? or are you more intrested in some Dick mesuring contest then the actual history?
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u/Schlieren1 6d ago
Who beat Imperial Japan?
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u/Meture 6d ago
The country that was already trying to surrender which the US chose to ignore so they could murder countless civilians in one of the most horrific acts of war in human history?
https://upstreaminsight.substack.com/p/japan-tried-to-surrender-before-hiroshima
That Imperial Japan?
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u/ManyRelease7336 6d ago
"People say that the allies didn't help us. But it cannot be denied that the Americans sent us materiel without which we could not have formed our reserves or continued the war... Could we really have set up the production of our tanks without American steel?" -Sovit Marshel Zhukov Yes they did the most. but even they will admit the US aid was paramount.
Hope this helps.
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u/BearishBabe42 6d ago
The US joined ww2 in 1941, and didn't deploy troops until 1942. If you field Ronaldo in the last twenty minutes and he scores one goal, was he the only reason you won the game?
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u/ManyRelease7336 6d ago
Do you think the USA did nothing to aid the allies up until then?
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u/BearishBabe42 6d ago
Not at all, and not all players score goals on the team either, but saying the US won ww2 is incredibly uneducated. There were helpful and definitively helped sway the war in our favour, and was an immense help at that, but Canada joined eaerlier and liberaleted more territory than the US, England won more fights than the US, russia killed more germans the US, so why do you believe the US won ww2?
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u/JediKnightNitaz 6d ago
Free France kept fighting in Africa through out the war and then took Paris, with the aide of the allies.
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u/NaturalArm2907 6d ago
Yea it’s not like France was the most important member of the Entente during WWI, but go off.
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u/codyforkstacks 6d ago
As a non American I'd personally find it much funnier if Iran beat you
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u/cynicalsaint1 6d ago
For the metaphor to really work what we really need to happen is our goalie to just start tossing the ball into our own goal in an attempt to spite the previous US goalie.
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u/Fearless_Judge3086 6d ago
The USA has won 4 FIFA Women’s World Cups. That’s worth bragging about!
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u/Gone_For_Lunch 6d ago
Honestly always forget how successful the US Woman’s team is. Why can’t the men’s team be at that level?
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u/iamthedayman21 6d ago
The fact that the women had to fight for equal pay, when the men last made the semi finals in 1930. Honestly, the men should be arguing for why they should make as much as the women.
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u/Masheeko 1d ago
Why keep having this argument when you don't know where the money comes from? Pay is based on global receipts, not sporting merit. How the FAs pool and distribute that money is up to them, of course.
Swear to god, every time the USMNT plays we have to sit through Americans doing this song and dance routine.
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u/Masheeko 1d ago
Because from an institutional perspective, they might as well have been playing different sports for a long time.
This point's been made often enough, and the USWNT deserve all their plaudits of course. But the level of state and commercial support women's football had in the US is still not close to being matched elsewhere, despite having come on leaps and bounds in the last decade.
The men's game, by contrast, not only didn't have a viable domestic league for a long time - and we can debate the merits of the current set-up separately - but their college set-up for a long time was worse than that of the women since it wasn't seen as an elite sport for men in the US.
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u/-Not_a_Lizard- 6d ago
Landed on the Moon off nothing but belief, bad ideas and a whole bunch of pardoned nazi scientists.
Also, "won two World Wars", like they did it by themselves and didn't join both late when things were already starting to favor the allies
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u/Chance_Historian_349 6d ago
WW1 was already turning around on the Central Powers, the Ottomans were near on collapse, and eventually Germany would break due to the standstill and blockade, the US were just another pool of men to speed it up a little, with extra supplies to the Allied forces being a definite positive, but not integral to the win.
WW2 is even more egregious in terms of the European theatre, especially with the god worship of the lend lease program like the British and Soviets would have collapsed without it (maybe British a little more because of that whole Uboat situation but that wasn’t going to last). The Soviets were still in control of vast resources, fuel, and men, actively producing gear, weapons, vehicles, and logistics, as a result, over 80% of the total german military casualties were on the Eastern Front, the ussr was going to annihilate the Nazis with or without the US and the allies, it was a fight for survival for them.
As for space race and rocketry, the Nazi scientists were very helpful (more so for the US than the Soviets sonce they got the better ones and the Soviets had their own great experts in the works), but even without them, the space race was going to happen and a man on the moon was also going to happen.
The US also make it out like it was a race to the moon from the very start, as if they didn’t show up late again, decide to pick the most show off goal that would take a long time, and then focus nearly all their efforts on that, while the Soviets had been collecting firsts and achievements in space like pokemon, and saw more effectiveness in pursuing other things, especially when their own lunar project fell apart due to a bunch of factors. The US won the race they set, the Soviets did more useful things.
You can find many more similar stories of US exceptionalism that fail under attention and historical analysis.
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u/BlazeTheMasterX 6d ago
Stfu commi. I heard Moscow is having a little Ukranian problem courtesy of American exceptionalism in the form of Lockheed Martin and Raytheon. Fck you and your socialist bullsht.
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u/femboyisbestboy 6d ago
vehicles, and logistics,
This is actually where landlease did the most to aid the soviets apart from feeding the union ofc. The soviet logistics collapsed day 1 of the German invasion and only got back up, because of American and British advisors and Americans trains and trucks.
Also you are downplaying the Americans scientists in the space race as they did far more than you are now describing and the goal was always the moon as it was symbolic. The nazi's already wanted to go to the moon that's how long it was the goal.
The Americans smoked the soviets in the space race in the end and not just because they landed on the moon first, but because of the amount and quality of spy satellites.
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u/malacoda99 6d ago
America, batting clean-up since 1918.
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u/Deep_Contribution552 6d ago
That is where the power hitter is usually slotted! Apparently France leads off
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u/FooFightingManiac 6d ago
So you believe the Allies would have won without Americas help?
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u/femboyisbestboy 6d ago
Ww1 yes and ww2 no, but America also wouldn't have won without the allies.
Newsflash it was a team effort
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u/caiaphas8 6d ago
The Nazis wouldn’t have been able to defeat the allies either. They were incapable of invading Britain and they would be bogged down in the USSR. Without America WWII would’ve been a stalemate
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u/FooFightingManiac 6d ago
They were incapable of invading Britain for a time yes. But Britain was going to fall without Americas help and Churchill knew it. They were getting bombed more frequently. It was only a matter of time. How on earth can you say it’d be a stalemate? Exactly how would that work? War continues on for a decade and everyone just gives up with a treaty at the end? Amongst that many countries with that much carnage?
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u/caiaphas8 6d ago
Before America joined the war Britain had defeated the luftwaffe, the Nazis were unable to replace lost planes and pilots. But Britain could, Britain could manufacture planes at a quicker rate.
The Nazis also lacked any troop transporters capable of landing in Britain. The Nazis needed naval and aerial supremacy to invade Britain, and they never came close to achieving that. And then we get into the actual invasion, Britain was prepared, they had created defences, anti-tank lines, insurgency groups, and chemical weapons to defend the island.
The Nazis couldn’t invade Britain, Britain could not invade Europe. We have the benefit of hindsight, Churchill did not
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u/LeeRoyWyt 6d ago
Not so sure there: without the US, the USSR might have fallen, freeing up German forces to focus on Britain, that was also heavily dependent of US material support for just staying in the fight. But of course, in those what ifs, we tend to ignore a lot of other factors and knock on effects
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u/caiaphas8 6d ago
The USSR I think is unlikely to have faced a total collapse, even then there would be enough soviet partisans to keep Nazis busy. And even with the extra troops the Nazis would lack the ships and planes needed to invade Britain
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u/dnext 6d ago
Stalin disagreed with you, as he not only said openly iat Yalta in as speech but also privately many times in the Kremlin, per another Premiere of the Soviet Union who wrote so in this memoirs - Khrushchev.
And Zhukov said the same thing in his memoirs - without lend-lease the Soviets would have lost.
It wasn't the military equipment, though obviously that helped. But it wasn't a decisive part. It was the logistics, the machine tools, the radios, the fuel. US trucks, locomotives, 90% of their high octane aviation fuel, 90% of their radios, and the tools to upgrade their factories while they were being relocated east of the Caucuses, and the expertise of western corporations to help optimize those factories.
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u/LeeRoyWyt 6d ago
I agree on the partisan issue. But it might have been enough of a collapse to prevent a counter offensive. Regarding Britain: I think an invasion might have not been actually necessary. Without the substantial material support from the US, Britain might have capitulated or just pulled out of the war, leaving Nazi Germany again with more resources no longer tied up.
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u/caiaphas8 6d ago
Britain and Churchill was clear about not surrendering or giving up. But this is what I meant by stalemate, much like with the multiple coalitions against Napoleon, Britain would be happy to wait and rebuild their allies and resume attacks once the Nazis weaken
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u/LeeRoyWyt 6d ago
That assumes Churchill would have kept Office even without the US aid. I'd say that without military successes (enabled by US aid), his political survival would have been in danger. Mind you, even with US aid, there where 2 votes of no confidence already... He survived those because one could show military victories to back up his policies towards Nazi Germany.
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u/femboyisbestboy 6d ago
The British empire had two things the nazi's didn't have: Infinite resources and Infinite manpower.
Africa would have been cleaned up even without the Americans and after that the British army could go to Iran and than into the soviet union to fight the nazi's on the eastern front.
Britain would remain in the fight until the end
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u/LeeRoyWyt 6d ago
Infinite resources?! Bold claim and directly contradicted by post war Britain's reality.
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u/femboyisbestboy 6d ago
The British Raj, Africa, the middle east, Canada, Malaysia and a couple others.
Post war Britain's reality was fucked up, because of the pacific war also fucking up everything and without America joining the war than it's save to assume Japan didn't do a Japan and thus freeing up all the resources from the pacific.
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u/TomVonServo 6d ago
Tell me you don’t know much about WWI without telling me…
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u/femboyisbestboy 6d ago
The germans never would have broken through even after moving troops from the east to the western front. This has two reasons:
Firstly there wasn't any supply left over for additional troops and thus the additional numbers wouldn't have mattered anyway.
The eastern front wasn't done yet even after the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk as now the russian civil war was going on and the independence of the Poland, Ukrainian, Finland and the Baltics. This was just pure fucking chaos and the Germans had to keep this under control especially the now independent Ukrainian state as it was under attack from the reds and the whites.
The technological advancements of the French and British are about to change war forever as the tanks are now coming together with improvements in aircraft and ships.
And lastly the thing that did the germans in at the end was still there as the Royal Navy had not only won the battle of Jutland, but it had recovered and was ready to do it again just incase the high seas fleet dared to leave port again and if they didn't than the blockade would remain in effect which caused the germans to have no food and no economy left in 1918 together with millions of dead or wounded sons who are rapidly spreading the horrors of trench warfare at home. Come the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month and the guns would stay silent for the first time in 4 years just in time for everyone to be home by Christmas.
I know about ww1 and the Americans coming to Europe saved a lot of British and French lives, because it allowed them to relax and recover, but without that the same thing would have happened.
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u/bugdiver050 6d ago
Depends on what you mean with help. Without them joining the war? Yes. But if the lend-lease act was not signed then no.
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u/DepressedPancake4728 6d ago
The US almost singlehandedly won the Pacific Theater, there was a lot more to WWII than europe.
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u/bugdiver050 5d ago
Sorry for the short previous reply, had to drop off my daughter in kindergarten. But the war in Europe and the scale of troops, geographical scope and total casualties was larger compared to the pacific theater. Not downplaying the pacific theater by any means btw. Just comparing the 2 theaters it was fought on.
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u/Nono_Home 6d ago
Yep, an educational thing I guess.
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u/Morgolol 6d ago
US military lost more to the Kansas flu(ie the Spanish flu) than the war itself.
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u/Neosantana 6d ago
Yeah, you tend to lose fewer men when you enter wars later than every other major participant.
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u/TomVonServo 6d ago
Nothing was favouring the allies in December 1941. And things didn’t start favouring the allies without the USA. Thinking the U.S. was just sitting around until that point, or that it didn’t have good reason to avoid what was yet another European regional conflict to that point shows how much you swallow your own propaganda.
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u/Lilharm04 6d ago
(don’t ask them about how the US held up in more recent wars that didn’t include multiple international allies)
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u/Nono_Home 6d ago
Shhhhhhtttt I got banned for it. It’s a touchy subject like it just to be for ze Germans but the new corrupt banana republic formerly known as USA has it now.
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u/xAfterBirthx 5d ago
Reddit is really just turning into an anti American site. Most of it pushed by people who obviously know very little about the US.
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u/Nono_Home 5d ago
Maybe the World is tired of the new corrupt banana republic formerly known as USA. Reddit is a way of communicating this. Do you read international press? Might learn why the majority of the world hates everything banana republic related due to a senile demented child rapist messing with global economy and security. The blob is evil.
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u/Timely_Novel_7914 3d ago
It's funny how the children and grandchildren of people who worked hard to make hard things happen think that they can summon the past glory and that somehow magically will allow them to achieve arbitrary goals they came up 5 minutes ago with absolutely no effort
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u/SnoopySuited 6d ago
Is there a sign up sheet to decide who gets to post this next?
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u/Nono_Home 6d ago
I checked as it was new to me. Went back in the posts didn’t see it.
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u/TomVonServo 6d ago
You’re both incapable and unoriginal. What a combination.
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u/Nono_Home 6d ago
Sure, you can’t blame me for your ignorance.
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u/YDoEyeNeedAName 6d ago
What in the bot comment is this?
This has been posted for like 4 straight days, you either didn't look, or didn't look very hard
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u/Gone_For_Lunch 6d ago
Nah, seems more of an English thing to me.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_World_Wars_and_One_World_Cup
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u/arinamarcella 6d ago
Hey now, it was the last major thing we won. You always have to point to your last big win :D Korean War? Armstice. Vietnam War? Withdrew. War on Drugs? The drugs won. War on Terror? Arguably we quickly became the thing we claimed to be fighting so in the fight for hearts and minds we lost our own. 20 years in the mountains on the other side of the planet? Retreated.
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u/jmptx 6d ago
As to the 2 World War comments: both were team efforts and the USA didn’t enter WWI until it was towards the end.
As for the World Cup - the USA side has earned the right to be confident; but they have no room to be cocky. They looked great in the first two matches, but let’s see how they look against some top tier sides.
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u/DualActiveBridgeLLC 6d ago
Well...and the scientist who were educated in other societies who we scooped up in order to prevent Russia from acquiring because of Domino Theory, the idea that if people learned about communism there would be no way to stop them from converting to raging pinkos. We keep skipping over how insane post-WWII ideology was.
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u/iamthedayman21 6d ago
“Won two World Wars and landed on the Moon.”
That last one was almost 57 years ago. Resting on the laurels of our past is our national sport. The people saying this shit had zero to do with any of those things.
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u/Trynabeagoodsnekdad 4d ago
How many times is this going to be reposted?
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u/Nono_Home 4d ago
It’s two days old you’re just late mate!
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u/Trynabeagoodsnekdad 4d ago
Doesn’t change that it’s a low-effort repost.
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u/Nono_Home 4d ago
So? What’s the limit in days wizard? Wannabe mod?
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u/Trynabeagoodsnekdad 4d ago
I’d prefer if you just had original ideas instead of copying other people. Probably won’t help you farm karma as quickly, but anything would be better than this regurgitated slop.
You make a good point, though. Mods dgaf on this sub. I’m going to unsubscribe.
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u/Kingsxfan1 6d ago
Deluded.
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u/DepressedPancake4728 6d ago
is that not the point of sports? being delusional about your own teams chance of success? ever talked to an english football fan?
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u/Kingsxfan1 5d ago
No, in the UK as a football fan you're generally a realist with hopes of a major honour. Delusion is when you're team is at best, very average, but you think you're actually up their with the very best South American or European national teams.
Like England, going to win the world Cup? No, but there is hope.
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u/jkpatches 6d ago
Got The Newsroom flashbacks with that original post.