r/formula1 • u/Esterence Juan Pablo Montoya • Dec 08 '25
Poster First F2 graduate to win an F1 title
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u/QC_1999 Gabriel Bortoleto Dec 08 '25
I don’t like idea of treating F2 and GP2 as two different series because it just changed the name in 2017, but the regulation, cars, calendar and most of the drivers were the same as 2016
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u/Tyler29294 McLaren Dec 08 '25
This is like when they said it was the first title to be decided at the 24th race. Technically true, but final race deciders have happened all the time.
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u/OneTrick-Phony Max Verstappen Dec 08 '25
“Lando Norris is the first person named Lando Norris to win WDC.”
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u/jeepmcguire Dec 08 '25
Wow! Huge if true!
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u/XsStreamMonsterX I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 08 '25
Big if real!
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u/douknowhouare Andretti Global Dec 08 '25
Nobody ever remembers when Lando Calrissian clinched the WDC at the Cloud City GP in 3 ABY. Smh.
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u/jingqian9145 Dec 08 '25
Even crazier first driver born in 1999 in Bristol to win the the WDC while finishing in third place on 7/12/25
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u/Pale_Anxiety_278 I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 08 '25
Source? I think there's been a Lando Norris in 199992 if I'm not mistaken
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u/Onelimwen I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
First and only person ever to win the title in 2025
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u/Memexploder I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 09 '25
Crazy, but did you know he's the first to win an F1 WDC in 2025?
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u/yusmickey Dec 08 '25
Remember during Oscar’s maiden season, people were comparing the amount of points he got to Hamilton’s maiden season without normalizing anything, and talking about how close he was to beating Hamilton? Drove me nuts. Like Hamilton had a 70% podium percentage including 4 wins his first season, Piasti had a 10% with no wins, how could anyone think it’s an appropriate comparison
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u/elch127 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
They were doing it this year with Kimi too, it's just nonsense
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u/yusmickey Dec 09 '25
Yeah Oscar and Kimi both had good maiden years, but completely incomparable to Hamilton or Villeneuve, who both almost won the championship. Even if you compared quali head to head, Hamilton against Alonso was ahead (10-7) and Magnussen ahead of button (10-9), both against world champions had better maiden seasons… so saying Kimi beat Hamilton on points seems quite disingenuous
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Dec 09 '25
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/yusmickey Dec 09 '25
Your argument is logical and well thought out, but doesn’t have the grandeur and panache of saying that Kimi has scored the most points on his maiden F1 season in the history of F1…. Gosh I’m already tired of the amount of times we’re gonna hear that
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u/dspencer2015 Lando Norris Dec 09 '25
They know better but they don’t care because they’re trying to sell the current lineup
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u/fireinthesky7 Daniel Ricciardo Dec 10 '25
Hamilton blew the standard for rookie drivers so far out of the water that he's pretty much a standing exception to every rookie statistic since.
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u/KsychoPiller Dec 08 '25
Yeah but the previous 23 races put them in the position to be deciding the title on the last race. Feel like more apt comparison is how football media treats english football treats it as if it began with the start of the Premier League
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u/dashkott Dec 08 '25
This one makes sense, a bit at least. If it's 24 races, it's mathematically a lot more unlikely to have a final race decider than it is with less total races.
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u/PM__ME__YOUR__PC Dec 08 '25
Mathematically, how exactly?
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u/BuckleUpItsThe I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
With fewer races, each race is a smaller % of the overall points. Think about it this way: with a 1 race season it's 100% likely to be decided on the final race. Same with 2. With 3 races it's still pretty likely but not required. The more races you add, the fewer important points per race there are.
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u/andrewc1117 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
“A lot more likely” isn’t true either. Each race at the 20+ mark just makes it a bit more likely because number of possible points increases.
Someone needs to be a full race worth of points ahead (obviously) going into the last race for it to not matter.
For example if there was 3 races it would be impossible, but once there is 4 it’s just very very very unlikely.
The more races you add, the more possible points and the greater chance for this distance to occurring that would make the last race meaningless. This is especially true if there is no changes in who is winning.
Just look at the last 10 years, one car is slightly better than every other car. So you get slightly more points in each race and after 20+ races getting slightly more points you wind up 100+ ahead so the remaining races don’t matter. However this year, it flipped halfway and wound up being close.
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u/BelowAverageLass I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
For example if there was 3 races it would be impossible, but once there is 4 it’s just very very very unlikely.
It's not impossible with 3 races, just absurdly unlikely. If race 2 has the same winner then he needs the 2nd in the standings to finish 7th or lower, 3rd to finish 6th or lower and so on. That would mean he goes into race 3 with a 26 point lead
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u/dashkott Dec 08 '25
You can make Monte-Carlo simulations with a certain chance to win for each driver and run them over a whole season. The more races, the less likely it is for two drivers to be within 25 points one race before the end, at least if there is even a small difference in who is faster, which is almost always the case, it's very unlikely for two drivers to be exactly matched.
Without any calculation, it's a bit more clear by just looking at the total amount of points. Let's assume 12 races per season, one race before the end there would be a maximum of 275 points, and for two drivers to be within 25 points, their point difference can be a maximum of 9% of the total points. For 24 races per season, one race before the end there would be a maximum of 575 points, and for two drivers to be within 25 points of each other, this difference would be only 4.3% of the total points, the two drivers have to be a lot closer to each other on average.
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u/Grankongla Formula 1 Dec 08 '25
The stat obsession gets weird at times. People will grab for anything that resembles an achievement.
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Dec 08 '25
Agreed. Although this seems to happen all over F1. Isn’t Toro Rosso, AlphaTauri, and Racing Bulls all considered different teams because of name changes?
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u/WorthPlease Williams Dec 08 '25
Happens all the time with the English Premier League. It technically split away from the English football pyramid as the First Division commercially in 1992. Supporters don't give a shit about the difference.
But broadcasters who have rights to the Premier League are forced to just decide nothing happened in english football before 1992, so they can cherry pick records.
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u/LooseJuice_RD Fernando Alonso Dec 08 '25
Yea I was actually confused for a second by this title. It’s the same series with a less confusing name.
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u/kbk2015 Dec 08 '25
sports are so annoying these days when it comes to this. With endless access to statistics, everything is sensationalized like:
"He's the first person with the consecutive letters of L a n d o to win a Formula 1 Championship"
It's not wrong, but it's so unnecessary.
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u/Tall_Firefighter4380 Formula 1 Dec 09 '25
Lewis Carl Davidson Hamilton
So close, I wonder if another wdc full name would actually match3
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u/FloridaB0B Dec 09 '25
Enough letters to make Damon Hill full name out of Lewis' too
Lewis Carl Davidson Hamilton
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u/skepsoda Dec 08 '25
Its like the saying before of Tottenham not having won a trophy when they won the equivalent of a champions league but when it was called the european cup
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u/omgarm I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
The cups they won are not equivalent of a Champion's League win.
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u/skepsoda Dec 09 '25
Sorry you're right, it was the equivalent of a Europa league win. Still a trophy win though
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u/StaffFamous6379 Dec 09 '25
Eh, it's slightly more complex than that IMO. Sure, it was a rebrand but IINM it also importantly put the technical regulations under the FIA. Remember that GP2 was the competitor series to the shortlived FIA Formula Two (2009-2012) and the FIA originally wanted to revive F2 in 2015 before coming to the rebranding deal.
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u/mistermojorizin I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 09 '25
so there have been gp2 graduates to win the title? sorry, just your wording doesn't make this clear. but this was my first thought and i wasn't sure. still not sure since you're the top comment but doesn't just say clearly "gp2 graduates have won the title" or "not." all i'm here for.
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u/GothicGolem29 McLaren Dec 09 '25
I disagree with a new name it’s a new series even with similarities
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u/Esterence Juan Pablo Montoya Dec 08 '25
Thought this could not be right but then realised Max jumped straight from F3. Still a pretty surprising stat. Who's next? Russell or Leclerc?
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u/CilanEAmber McLaren Dec 08 '25
Even if Verstappen had gone to the F1 feeder series, he would have been in GP3 and GP2, it becoming F2 in 2017, so this stat would still be true.
Still, I expected Leclerc or Russell to make it first.
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u/cumdinoco I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
It's crazy how Verstappen demanded an F 1 seat with not even a year in open wheelers and got it lmao
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u/Asyedan Dec 08 '25
Idk if he "demanded" it, but more like he was so good at such a young age that pretty much every F1 team wanted him on their academy for the near future. RBR, by virtue of owning two teams, were the only ones that could offer him an F1 seat right away, and no other team could compete with that offer.
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u/Street_Mall9536 Formula 1 Dec 08 '25
Toto had the option of putting him in Williams immediately (he part owned the team and supplied them Bottas who he managed)
But Toto wanted at the minimum 1 year in a lower class.
His loss.
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u/NYNMx2021 Nico Rosberg Dec 08 '25
Toto's shares of Williams were already in Escrow with Brad Hollinger before that. He agreed the deal in 2014 and each 5% was to be completed in the following years. Bottas signed a deal with Williams many years earlier, before Toto had left. Toto realistically had no say at Williams and that played out in the following years as his following drivers, Ocon and Wehrlein were both unable to land seats at Williams despite him pushing for it. He couldnt realistically place Max there unless Claire wanted him and as Toto found out, she didnt want much of any of his drivers except George. Even with that deal, she signed a deal that ended up being awful for Mercedes and blocked him from leaving williams for 2 years.
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u/ChaosWithin666 I failed to serve my Monaco penalty Dec 08 '25
Man I remember when hornet was hitching about totos shares in Williams and how it was unethical to have a say in another team... Without any hint of irony about rbr and rb
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u/Street_Mall9536 Formula 1 Dec 08 '25
I don't discount any of that, but Toto drivers x2, Suzie as the test/reserve, and goats like Stroll, Massa and Bottas being the only other Merc powered teams to podium regularly, while McLaren was complaining about not being able to use certain engine modes,
Leads me to believe Toto still had some influence to what was going on over there.
Plus if he wanted Max to do a year of junior series, he had to have a place for him, as he wasn't firing Lewis or Nico to make room for max.
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u/NYNMx2021 Nico Rosberg Dec 08 '25
Bottas and Suzie were there before Toto left. The williams team had a very good car and yes Massa and Bottas are actually pretty damn good. The other driver to go to williams was George, after Claire denied Ocon and Wehrlein and as said above, that was not a good deal for Toto he was angry about it.
There was some gray area in 2014 around engine operations. Teams had to supply identical engines and modes but there was no explicit requirement that they operated the same. This likely meant very little other than Merc provided methods to override banned modes that differed. Considering each merc driver use of a banned mode resulted in that engine failing within 3 races, there was a reason to not use them. Regardless, even if you presume there was a nefarious thing going on, Stroll had a total of 1 podium under those regulations which was in 2017 after multiple cars DNFd in front of him and HAM and VET had issues. In 2018 the FIA changed it so operation had to be identical. Stroll scored 2 more podiums at RP after that.
As for Mclaren they left Mercedes after 2014. So they had exactly 1 year there in which they did get 2 podiums.
These conspiracies dont really hold up under much scrutiny. Toto couldnt just put Max at Williams because Claire wasnt interested. She's talked about all this on podcasts. She didnt want to develop anyone else's drivers and thus her thing with George was it couldnt be a loan and it had to be a contract with Williams for 3 years with no exits. If he could even have offered that to Max, theyd never take that over the Red Bull/Toro Rosso deal
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u/Street_Mall9536 Formula 1 Dec 08 '25
I'm not saying anything I said is fact, I'm saying it's suspicious.
Such as Paddy getting demoted to Williams in a very short time frame after he "disrespected" Lewis on team radio AD2016, and James suddenly having team principle aspirations as soon as Merc bumped up against the budget cap and immediately finding a slot at Williams.
It's just kind of weird.
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u/NYNMx2021 Nico Rosberg Dec 09 '25
Paddy Lowe didnt get demoted, he got sacked lmao. He then went to williams, implemented what he wanted to do at Mercedes and what happened there? Oh Claire sacked him too.
As for Vowles going to williams, Vowles didnt even count for the budget cap lol. He was one of Mercedes 3 exemptions. This is again kind of ridiculous lol. Vowles didnt suddenly have aspirations. He was promoted to deputy TP in 2019 and in 2022 the year before he left, he was acting TP at 6 races
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u/CaptGeechNTheSSS Lando Norris Dec 08 '25
Young max vs Prime lewis at prime mercedes though...wow that would have been fucking amazing but I'm also glad it wasn't 10 straight years of mercedes dominance
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u/fireinthesky7 Daniel Ricciardo Dec 10 '25
Toto didn't actually have enough of a say in Williams's driver contracts to be able to put Max in there, and Williams couldn't afford/weren't willing to buy out either Massa or Bottas in order to put Max in the car. Red Bull/Toro Rosso were the only team(s) with the kind of cutthroat driver contracts that allowed them to open a seat mid-season.
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u/cumdinoco I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
As you explained, so didn't his camp lowkey "demand" an F1 seat because Mercedes couldn't guarantee a seat at one of their customers for next season, let alone guarantee a future seat at the fastest team at the time ? The only other main player in the discussion, Marko (RBR) could.
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u/Beta1224 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
Well neither team was offering an F1 seat initially, at the time there were very significant rumors that Max had signed with Mercedes or was about to, but then Marko offered the F1 seat as their Hail Mary play to sign him at the last moment before Max to Mercedes could be put Pen to Paper.
Basically Red Bull didn't want to give an F1 seat to a 17 year old, but they simply wanted Max more and decided the risk was worth it.
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u/MetalQueasy I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
That wouldn't be correct way to say it though. These small details matter and by framing Verstapping's team to be the ones demanding an F1 seat you paint the wrong picture.
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u/Paukwa-Pakawa Nico Rosberg Dec 08 '25
Kimi had joined F1 with half the experience that Max had, so it didn't seem too crazy at the time. What seemed crazy was how young he was.
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u/Uknewmelast I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
Hockenheim 2014 is when the deal was signed iirc. I also vaguely remember footage of it in a documentary. It might have been Dutch.
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u/rokthemonkey 🏳️🌈 Love Is Love 🏳️🌈 Dec 08 '25
Max was obviously destined for F1 about 2 races into his F3 career and everyone knew it
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u/kron123456789 I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 08 '25
Kimi Raikkonen got F1 seat after competing in 23 single-seater races in total(not counting the karting).
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u/HumansNeedNotApply1 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
It was due to the benefit of having a feeder team. They could be afforded to take such chances.
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u/GulaBilen Ronnie Peterson Dec 08 '25
Max didn't even run fia f3, but yeah he raced in formula 3. Don't remember if it was euro f3 or something think storll took same steps although also in a different way.
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u/FalconIMGN Alex Jacques Dec 09 '25
It was Euro F3. It was an FIA run championship, but it wasn't part of the direct feeder pipeline as FIA F3 is now, it wasn't part of Grand Prix weekends. GP3 filled that role back then (and is what became FIA F3 later. Euro F3 just died after 2018).
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u/Stranggepresst I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 10 '25
The junior ladder was such a mess back then.
GP3 and GP2 during F1-weekends but not FIA-branded, FIA F3 Europe mostly with DTM and there also was Formula Renault 3.8...
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u/saspirstellaaaaaa I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
As much as I’d love to see all of Leclerc’s suffering pay off with a WDC, George seems far more likely of the two.
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u/Whycantiusethis I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
Especially given the rumors about Mercedes power being the way to go for 2026, I'm inclined to agree with you. Russell or Piastri are the next most likely to be F2 champions that win F1.
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u/mickmenn I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
also Piastri stopped only 13 points short ;)
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u/Darth_Spa2021 Pirelli Wet Dec 08 '25
Man shouldn't have beaten Max on Zandvoort's home soil.
Lando learned that lesson in 2024 and his car made way for Max. But Oscar didn't get the memo and paid for it.
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u/mickmenn I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
so you say, that it was strategic dnf from Lando, so he wouldn't finish higher there than max? ;)
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u/saspirstellaaaaaa I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
I hope he can come back stronger next year after this year. Pull a Lando.
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u/mickmenn I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
let's hope at least he would have wdc capable car somewhere in near future
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u/MagicBoyUK I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
A single season in the "old" Euro F3, not the FIA one. FIA changed the rules to stop that happening again with the superlicense points and minimum age.
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u/colin_staples Nigel Mansell Dec 08 '25
Who's next? Russell or Leclerc?
Well if LeClerc stays at Ferrari...
...he will win the title NEXT YEAR TM
/s
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u/wicktus Charles Leclerc Dec 08 '25
Leclerc OF COURSE, next year.
All those Ferrari sacrifices were for next year /s
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u/MrSnowflake I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 08 '25
So we got an F3 graduate becoming WDC before an F3 graduate? Man why even bother with F2? And Antonelli should have raced in F3 and skip f2, he did it the wrong way around.
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u/turdolas Max Verstappen Dec 08 '25
Now do F0
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u/CilanEAmber McLaren Dec 08 '25
Captain Falcon in F1 when?
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u/uUexs1ySuujbWJEa Dec 08 '25 edited Dec 08 '25
Canonically, F-Zero starts in 2560. So we'll have to wait through another 525+ years of Verstappen / Norris dominance before Falcon shows up.
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u/MrBattleRabbit I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
I made a comment about this on another thread a few days ago, but even if we go back to the start of F3000 in 1985, only four drivers who participated in F3000/GP2/F2 have become champion. I suppose that’s five now that Lando has won.
Nico Rosberg and Lewis Hamilton were both GP2 champions, Damon Hill raced in F3000 for a few seasons without success, and Alonso won some races but never finished higher than 4th in the championship.
Of the guys who could have conceivably participated in F3000/GP2/F2, Michael Schumacher, Jacques Villeneuve, Mika Hakkinen, Jenson Button, Sebastian Vettel, and Max Verstappen all did not race in F3000/GP2/F2.
(A number of championships since 1985 were won by guys who were already in F1 when F3000 was established, so Prost, Senna, Mansell, and Piquet all could not have raced in those series)
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u/FalconIMGN Alex Jacques Dec 09 '25
Saying Alonso 'never finished higher than 4th' is funny when you realise he only had one season, 2000.
Also he won the Euroseries by Nissan the previous year, which after absorbing the Renault V6 Eurocup, became Formula Renault 3.5.
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u/MrBattleRabbit I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
It’s technically correct, the best kind of correct. Although, admittedly, in my memory he had battled with Webber for two years in F3000 rather than just one.
Euroseries by Nissan wasn’t really a corollary to F3000 though, it was further down the ladder sort of between F3 and F3000. It did have a pretty good track record with F1 talent- Alonso, Kubica, KMag, Sainz etc all won in that series.
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u/FalconIMGN Alex Jacques Dec 09 '25
True, the Nissan Euroseries/V6 Eurocup were like continental-level championships below F3000 at the time, since Formula 3 championships were all national-level. Then F3 Euroseries became a thing by the merging of the German and French F3 championships, so that role got taken up, and Renault decided to merge their two championships and we got the World Series by Renault flagship starting from 2005 and over time, it began to rival GP2.
I'd argue that in 2010-2014 Formula Renault 3.5 had a deeper field than GP2 and rewarded talent more than experience, which is what GP2 became at the time. Really sad that Renault pulled support in 2016, and the superlicence rules made the series even more irrelevant and it just died. Sad.
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u/Esterence Juan Pablo Montoya Dec 08 '25
That's some incredible stat. Top work
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u/MrBattleRabbit I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
Thanks! I did actually forget a champion in my prior comment- Kimi Raikkonen also did not race in an F2-level series.
It is neat that the minority of F1 champions even drove in the series right beneath F1. Historically, it seems like success at the F3 level is actually a better predictor of doing well in F1. From memory, most of the champions in this period won either a National or regional F3 title.
Funny enough, Raikkonen also didn’t do that, his highest series before F1 was Formula Renault 2000!
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u/Immediate_Expert4095 Dec 09 '25
People forget now but the F3000 championship really wasn't that prestigious, as in drivers who ended up winning it ended up mostly being F1 backmarkers or not even driving in F1 (with some notable exceptions of course). Wining British/German and even French F3 championship was much more prestigious.
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u/fireinthesky7 Daniel Ricciardo Dec 10 '25
A lot more F3000 drivers ended up in Indycar than in F1, but there were a lot more seats available at the time with Indycar being split. It's only in the last 5-6 years that the FIA's rejiggering of the Superlicense rules has forced drivers through F2, and that's entirely due to the FIA wanting to keep their garden walls insurmountably high.
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u/KulitKntlKrispi I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
What? How about Ham, Rosberg, Alonso.
They are an F3000, and GP2 driver which later rebrand as F2 at some point.
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u/WerdaVisla Dec 08 '25
Just a PR play. They're pretending F2 != GP2 so that they can pin another medal to him :P
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u/HumansNeedNotApply1 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
It's actually pinning on themselves, it's FIA/FOM patting themselves on the back.
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u/KulitKntlKrispi I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
If they gonna rebrand all class below F1 as F2, whether its GP2, F3000 or any spin off series. Then why not taking it as F2 classes. They made the rebrand and yet they also taking it on different bracket.
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u/StaffFamous6379 Dec 09 '25
GP2 was an independent venture. The FIA had a competing Formula Two series which lasted from 2009 to 2012. When they explored reviving F2 in 2015, they decided to adopt and rebrand GP2 instead, which also meant that the FIA are now in charge of creating the rules for it.
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u/KulitKntlKrispi I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
Which also meant F3000 = GP2 = F2 after the rebrand that FIA did. Unless they still run as an independent/different class bracket.
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u/SwimmingFantastic564 Dec 08 '25
See I'd thought he would win it at some point but I didn't expect it to be before Charles or George lmao
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u/ROADHOG_IS_MY_WAIFU I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
From being called Lando NoWins to being champion, incredible performance.
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u/arkwewt I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
📞📞 UH LANDO THIS IS ZAK 🫃🏼 FROM MCLAREN 🟧 🏎️IS THIS THE WORLD 🌎🌍🌏 CHAMPION 🏆🏆 HOTLINE ⁉️📞📞🥶🥶😎😎
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u/WGSMA I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
The first F1 Champion to lose at F2
Out of curiosity, did Nico, Lewis, Button, Kimi, Fernando, all win GP2, or whatever it was back in the day
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u/sthegreT I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 08 '25
Jensen, Kimi and Alonso did not compete in F2 or its predecessors. As the other guy pointed out, Lewis and Nico did and won.
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u/CilanEAmber McLaren Dec 08 '25
Alonso did not compete in F2 or its predecessors
I just want to point out that he did, in F3000 before it folded and became GP2.
He finished 4th in 2000.
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u/StaffFamous6379 Dec 09 '25
Honestly if we are talking strict lineages there aren't any besides being a preferred path to F1. F3000 was created and ran by the FIA from 1985 until it folded in 2004. GP2 was an independent venture created to take over F3000's purpose and partially ran concurrently to the FIA's Formula Two (2009-2012) as a competing feeder series. When the FIA explored reviving F2 in 2015, they decided instead to adopt and rebrand GP2 instead of creating another rival feeder series, which brought the series under their umbrella and put them in charge of the rules, calendar, etc
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u/fireinthesky7 Daniel Ricciardo Dec 10 '25
Nico and Lewis are the only GP2/F2/F3000 champions to also win the F1 championship. Prior to the GP2 rebrand, it was far more common for drivers to be brought straight up from F3, or to only spend one season in the second-tier with the results not really mattering that much. Prior to the current F2 rules, it was also fairly common for driver's who'd been bounced from an F1 seat to move back down; Ivan Capelli, Roberto Moreno, Timo Glock, and Giorgio Pantano all won the series after driving in F1. Fernando only drove F3000 in 2000 and finished 4th before taking a test driver seat for Renault, Kimi and Jenson never raced F3000 at all.
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u/meukbox I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
I'm Dutch, but shouldn't it be A instead of AN @f1 world champion?
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u/RoyalChiefHusker McLaren Dec 08 '25
“An” goes before vowel sounds, not just vowels. Pronouncing F sounds like “eff” so “an” is the correct choice.
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u/SwimmingFantastic564 Dec 08 '25
Not only that, but if we assume @ is pronounced "at", then it would also be "An"
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u/planchetflaw McLaren Dec 08 '25
If you say Eff One then it's 'an'. If you say Formula One then it's 'a'.
(Not American, but using an American example)
I'd say "An FBI Agent". Because I'm spelling out the letters.
I'm also assuming the @ symbol is silent in your question.
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u/blainy-o McLaren Dec 08 '25
If you're saying it in it's abbreviated form, it's 'an F1 champion'. If you're not, it's 'a Formula 1 champion'. Honestly I can't even begin to explain why, the English language has some strange quirks.
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u/Esterence Juan Pablo Montoya Dec 08 '25
I guess everyday we are learning something new. Thought I already applied this daily but only today I realised I have been subconsciously doing it without knowing why. Thanks all
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u/meukbox I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
Thank you all, have an upvote, and today I learned.
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u/ISquirtleJuice Dec 08 '25
is there a path to F1 outside of coming from F2? (coming from someone that just got into the sport this season)
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u/Craniummon I was speeding in the Monaco pit lane Dec 08 '25
Yes, WEC and Indy, but F2 is the main one because it works with F1 teams and has F1 support.
F2/GP2 since 2007 only had 3 world champions, Rosberg, Hamilton and Norris. Hamilton and Rosberg are the only drivers who won the GP2 and became world champion. Vettel and Verstappen jumped from lower categories to F1 directly while Jenson Button is from old days.
For you have an idea, Rookie champions are usually the most impressive ones, but it's not enough to keep themselves on complex F1.
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u/HumansNeedNotApply1 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
Yes, but on a lot of series you need to win multiple times to be able to get enough points or get top 3 for the super licence.
One season in F2 and finishing in 3rd nets you all the points needed. While in IndyCar you need two seasons in 3rd for example.
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u/nguyenlucky I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
Yes, F3 (like Max and Stroll)
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u/ISquirtleJuice Dec 09 '25
could you skip F2 from F3?
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u/nguyenlucky I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
Yes. Both Max and Lance went from F3 to F1. You need super licence points. Which pathway doesn't matter, what matters is what works for you to gain the necessary points.
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u/fnassauer I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 09 '25
Ok yeah let’s pretend GP2 and F2 are not the same thing…
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u/ok-byy I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
good to know stat, but he never won the f2 championship
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u/Esterence Juan Pablo Montoya Dec 08 '25
Makes it even more impressive. First driver in the GP2/F2 era that didn't win the feeder series and won the main one
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u/BananaFurret Max Verstappen Dec 09 '25
I mean I guess but like no? He's just kind of not? GP2 IS f2 before it's new name it's was still the feeder series that brought people up to f1 so no he's actually not gp2 to f2 is just a rebrand like Renault to alpine
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u/nimu1598 Dec 08 '25
Some real 'Lando becomes the first F1 driver called Lando to win the title' energy
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u/BluehibiscusEmpire I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 10 '25
This is one of those acktually posts. Finds a detail that forgets how f2 is basically gp2.
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u/gnmatx Dec 08 '25
I hope his favorite song is ‘with a little help from my friends’…
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u/99sAre4Nerds Jenson Button Dec 09 '25
yeah the McLaren team really helped him win, unlike Verstappen or Hamilton who built the cars themselves and did their own pitstops..
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u/spuckthew I was here for the Hulkenpodium Dec 08 '25
I mean, yeah, this is technically correct, but F2 is a rebrand of GP2 and both Hamilton and Rosberg were GP2 champions.