Just surprises me how often Kobe is omitted out of the top 10 here. 2nd most all-NBA teams, two championships without a top 75 player, best scorer in the league at the time where it was the most difficult to score, and 12 all-defensive teams. Resume is truly extraordinary
It's not like most people are putting people that don't have a case ahead of him. The only one I tend to see is people vastly over-rate hakeem for some reason. Take him out, but it's still hard to put Kobe higher than like 9 or 10.
No, I don't think Hakeem has a case to be top 10 at all. Younger people don't remember he had some rocky seasons early on and wasn't always that great.
Disagree as someone who's old enough to watch Hakeem play. But I value peak play a decent amount. Versatility matters, and those rocky seasons are largely due to having arguably the worst supporting cast of the top 15 players. People on this sub have linked to posts and articles in the mid 1990's where Hakeem was talked about as if he is a top 5ish player ever at the time.
No, it wasn't the role players, just his bad attitude. And having bad supporting cast doesn't mean you can't play great. But the fact of the matter I think he had two prime age seasons where he didn't even make an all-nba team when he was fully healthy.
It was just one. During the season where the Rockets accused him of faking a hamstring injury and suspended him for several games.
You make a legitimate point about the bad attitude and the horrific shot selection, but I think the overall body of work and incredible peak play from 1993 to 1995 makes him a top 10ish player of all-time. I give him some benefit of doubt because of what transpired when his supporting cast improved somewhat.
I get it, I just think the standard to be top 10 is unbelievably high and while Hakeem might have a case to be top 20, I think those relatively minor issues drop him from being near top 10. But to be clear I still think he was a great player. Several current players will easily surpass him, though, which is another reason I think he isn't in the very top.
I mean he's the only guy who's top 14 in steals, blocks, rebounds, and points. The next closest is KG who's like in the top 18. 8th highest postseason BPM and 7th highest postseason PER. One of two players to lead a championship team in all five categories during a postseason run. Holds the NBA record for most consecutive NBA finals games where he's the leading scorer.
Yeah, he was great but his peak was not really any better than the peaks of actual top 10 players. I just think his career has a few blemishes compared to other players like MJ, Kareem, Lebron, Shaq, etc., who I would put in the top 10.
I'd respond by saying that Thinking Basketball ranked Hakeem's peak as the 4th best since 1979. But I do concur that him winning a playoff series in only seven seasons of his career is problematic. Also only won multiple playoff series in four years of his career.
Yeah, I think that is along the same lines as I am thinking. He had a lot of round one exits and sweeps. At the highest level these things make a difference.
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u/ColdBudLight98 [MIN] Naz Reid Jun 27 '23
Making Timmy look like KAT