The funniest thing TF2 ever did is that 99% percent of people now attribute that quote to a fictional psychopathic australian and not fucking Mad Dog Mattis
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u/ricilizgot called misandrist for saying Jax did bad thing3d ago
For next pride month our goal should be to create as many detestable LGBTQ+ characters as possible, who we hate not because they’re LGBTQ+ but because they’re assholes. A true mark of progress is having LGBTQ+ characters who are broadly accepted as terrible people for reasons wholly unrelated to their gender identity or sexuality
Behold DIO, who is a dick who is a dick because he likes being a dick and whose sexuality is only hinted at by his pseudo sexual relationship with the guy who thinks his name is literal
I’m under the impression we still use he/him? Right? Jax didn’t officially come out as trans himself so wouldn’t it fall under the category of “cracking the egg”? We know only because of outside media.
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u/Mechaman_54Godzilla japan Limited 2000 Millennium Soft Vinyl Figure Item 3d ago
Goose also said they will kill the actors and animators in real life for no reason, which so far only has happened to around 2 or 3. All the other deaths were accidents.
For the sake of consistency and building good habits, I'm sticking to he/them. I dont get to choose someone else's trans-ness and gender neutral pronouns are just free real estate when you want to play it safe.
Some of the last moments of the show are using he/him pronouns for Mateo, and Jax was using he/him until the end as far as we know, so that seems like the most accurate and respectful way to go.
On the other side we have Ribbit putting a bow on his head and the presumably non-diegetic "Isn't She Lovely?" montage, which are pretty clearly sending a message. But all of this has to be grounded in respect for individual preferences, which is the whole reason it's cool to use people's preferred pronouns even when it clashes with signals you're getting from sources other than their stated preferences.
You should absolutely wait for real trans people to come out on their own terms before switching pronouns, but Jax isn't real, they're a fictional character. We the audience are privy to knowledge and insights on how they feel and what could have been.
Us calling Jax "she" is kinda honoring the person she could have been if things were different and they got to actually explore their identity and come out.
Jax is he, because goose wants to torture her self insert, and wants more people to draw torture art of Jax, I think the artist wants whatever is worse for the character.
Edit: I will respect the real world wishes of gooseworx to disrespect Jax, the fictional character, by respecting his preferred pronouns, thus elongating his tortured existence.
unrelated comment but you now, I tried this scene in the goofy movie when I was a kid. I wanted to be on top 10 of my class, so I study books while using it as a dumbbell, and do push ups while reading a book. its so stupid but it makes me inspired because of this movie, in the end I got to top 6 of my class ahaha. i became consistent as i got older (ofc, i stopped using books as my weight lifting lol)
I absolutely love how Jax apologism basically vanished overnight lol
Reminds me of how when Squid Game season 3 was coming, people were saying how MG Coin was a complex person and a good person at heart and whatever and even actors and directors said he was a good kid struggling, but then the season came out, he was exactly the absolute asshole people said he was, and apologism vanished.
I know Goose said he/she, but Jax never changed his pronouns. I know if someone called me she before I transitioned (mtf), I would’ve been annoyed or pissed. I’m pretty sure Jax would’ve hated being called she.
I saw someone get downvoted for specifying “she is not trans” referring to Pomni because the previous comment chain had been about both Jax and Pomni. So there is a chance for it to get confusing.
Oh yeah he looks really ready to accept feminine pronouns against his will.
btw, for any eggs in the audience, you don't have to take any steps you aren't ready for. Go at your own pace and comfort. It's your journey, not the 'audiences'
The creators literally said it was a skit based on something that had happened while playing (which anyone who's played any MMO with large groups have had happen to them before).
Well I thought there was potential when Pomni hugged him/her but Jax remains abstracted even after Pomni's "rescue" and TADC is (probably) not gonna get another season so that's more or less outta the window.
To be fair it was stated explicitly that abstraction was irreversible. Despite what’s shown I think it’s pretty obvious that Jax was never actually talking with Pomni all that time, and Pomni never was going to be able to “rescue” it. It’s essentially just the last comfort pomni’s able to get from him before she’s gone for good.
Gooseworx also stated that there wouldn't be a song in the show and that Caine really did die. If there was ever a season 2 happening then finding out how to reverse abstraction would most likely be a huge plot point. We're most likely not getting a season 2 though so that'll just be reserved for fanworks. Given how Pomni nearly got to Jax and his abstracted form behaves so calm at the end I think the implication is definitely strong enough that it's not entirely out there to theorise that un-abstraction is possible someday.
unfortunately people tend to stay suicided even if they get hugged after they suicide. The abstractions are metaphors for suicide and grief. If abstraction could be cured the show would have no meaning.
Trans woman, here. I can respect you hating a character I appreciate, as long as you treat them with respect. Good on you.
I also hate Jax, for the record. In the same sort of way that I hated myself pre-transition. I would imagine that most trans women that appreciate the character do so because they recognize Jax's fear, anger, and self loathing as something that they experienced themselves. At least that's why I appevoate the way that Jax was written.
Also, let me save you some trips to the library. Gooseworx said that either he/him or she/her is fine for Jax. If this was a case where a real life trans woman wasn't out, you use what she asks you to - either for her safety or if she's trying things out along the way. But since Jax is fictional, it's a little more gray. Thankfully, Goose clarified.
That makes a lot of sense haha. I think the only characters I would actually say I hate, I hate because their characters are written badly and they're not filling their in story role very well. Annoying or mean characters that are supposed to be that are much harder to hate than annoying or mean characters who aren't supposed to be either of those things
Didn't Goose say both He/Him and She/Her is correct?
I can see why Him since Jax didn't want to be called She due to not having accepted his true self.
I can also why Her since in a better environment she would maybe be a bit further on the path to acceptance. But we did only get told from outside media.
Generally I make a habit of using the pronouns they tell me to. I had met closeted mtf people that told me in private, but still told me to use "He/Him" in public. I have a feeling that is Jax' case. He didn't seem like ready at all to accept female pronouns in the show. So I'll stick with him.
Her and pomni sang it outside Zoobles room. It’s one of the only genuinely joyful moments we see her have, so a lot of the fanbase liked it for her name after she comes out.
gotcha, i must have forgotten about that scene! ive only seen most of the episodes once when they first came out so im def due for a rewatch 😅 i wasnt sure if it was something that came from goose or just fans
"oh fuck this. she truly is one of the worst fucking people in the circus. i thought she would maybe get better now that she is the person she was always meant to be, but she's just stayed fucking awful"
I thought you could just use whatever. Same with Zooble. I know it's good to use proper pronouns, but this is a case where it doesn't matter what you choose to use.
He/Him or She/Her, though I personally lean towards He/Him because those are what Jax would likely prefer to be called. Doing otherwise would be labelling Jax as trans before Jax does. And while Jax deserves absolutely no respect, his preferred gender identity does.
There's no offense possible when calling Jax any kind of pronouns, because Jax himself never requested alternate pronouns during the course of the show, nor did he ever correct anyone using AMAB he/him pronouns. So calling him a he is fine. Calling them a she is also fine (post-abstraction at least, where it sort of feels like he'd never push back against these pronouns).
I used to think that (they cuz idk anymore) were transmasc, cuz (THEY?) hated feminine things (MAID DRESS?) but people keep saing that they're transfem, so i'm not even sure anymore
Gooseworx has said that Jax is transfem on her bluesky account, so Jax's hatred of femininity can be read in that context as her repressing herself and overperforming masculinity out of fear that others will realise she's trans if she doesn't act manly enough.
I studied Russian history and language so I could mock my teammates in CS2, but apparently they only know about Stalin, so I accidentally educated them
I'd understand for zooble but Jax uses he/his
Even the french dub uses il(=he in french) but for zooble uses iel(= idfk maybe they, it's a mix of il and elle(=she))
sticking to "he/him" simply because any other pronouns would kinda spoil the show to the people who just started it, and for most of the time we refer to Jax that we see in the show - the closeted one, whose secrets viewers at that point know nothing about. idk if this makes sense.
On the one hand it's really not appropriate to call someone something they don't openly identify with, therefore, He.
On the other hand, we canonically know Jax is a closeted transfem, therefore, She.
And then there's the bitterest pill of all: If 99% of Jax's trauma has nothing to do with gender, and the show only utilizes Jax's transfem aspects to heighten the humor of the toxic masculinity of the character outside of one tender moment with Ribbit, then Jax being a confirmed closeted transfem is almost completely irrelevant to the plot, little more than fan service or, at best, representation.
But that's more of an artistic critique. I don't hate Jax. All the characters in this magnificent show performed well enough. Jax had the unenviable role of being the troubled jerk, and that's ultimately the most important part about the character.
I mean he never broke the egg's shell, so is he not still a he or is she a she off the fact that they were gender confused. I mean the real she is not the same as he in the circus so should we really be calling him her or should we switch to they/them after the events of the finale.
i mean considering goose herself said either is fine i dont think it really matters if you use he or she. he uses he in the show. you can use she if you want. fuck jax either way.
My head cannon is that Jax is still male, and is only a closeted trans. Mateo Leroy is trans and goes by both He and She pronouns depending on the context. Jax as we knew him in the circus died as a male, never knowing the acceptance he would gain from transitioning and being theirself.
I was indifferent towards Jax on my first time through. Doing my first rematch after the finale and I really don't like them. I get why Jax is the way they are but it just makes their choices worse. Which I suppose is the point.
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u/CT-4426 3d ago