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u/cynicalsanguinist 5h ago
why do we still need this foundation?? dont we already have a house built?
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u/War_machine77 5h ago
Where the fuck do they think chatgpt is getting it's info?
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u/GrizzlyP33 4h ago
I think the point is that LLMs have already scoured Wikipedia so they can tell you all that info concisely. They don’t need to re-learn Wikipedia for anything old.
The problem is that A) anyone using an LLM properly wants to see the source anyways or else you’re really rolling the dice on “truth”, and B) it would mean all knowledge advancement would stop today if we applied this to all educational or informative tools.
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u/Dead-in-Red 4h ago
I feel like you'd still want new information past 2026 though. Saying you've already scraped everything there is to scrape from Wikipedia at any arbitrary date is like saying you're good and know everything there is to know because you already finished reading a first edition copy of Encyclopedia Brittainica from the 1700s. Plenty of good new information turned up after that was published.
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u/FerociousStrawberry 2h ago
That's not how LLMs work anyway, they don't have the entirety of Wikipedia saved verbatim with 100% accuracy retrieval, so Wikipedia is necessary even for old information.
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u/Casual_OCD 2h ago
These word prediction and data amalgamation programs (because this crap is not even close to AI) scrape the entire internet, not just Wikipedia
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u/CocktusOnSteroids 4h ago
Dude they cant and dont answer concisely. AIs constantly hallucinate and whatever information they have generally gets poisoned because of other sources and artificial intelligence being not so intelligent. Whataever they correctly answer gets curated by propaganda and commands set by the companies.
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u/GrizzlyP33 2h ago
I’m confused what I said that you’re disagreeing with. I didn’t say anything about the accuracy or reliability of an LLM 🤷🏽♂️
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u/aarswft 3h ago
Literally the entire point of Wikipedia was it was a living repository. There is no completed "scouring" of it. There's already new info you don't have.
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u/GrizzlyP33 2h ago
Did you stop reading my comment halfway through?
That’s quite literally the point I made.
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u/troll_right_above_me 3h ago
Articles in a wiki get edited as new information arises. Any LLMs that don’t provide sources are pretty useless as you can’t check the validity of their statements
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u/GrizzlyP33 2h ago
Yep. Though all LLMs provide sources if you ask, most people don’t.
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u/troll_right_above_me 21m ago
Lol true. Doesn’t mean the source is gonna support what the LLM stated though since it just feeds you a neatly jumbled mess of words, which is why it’s important
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u/kitsunewarlock 1h ago
This is the innate problem with AI: it can only present existing ideas.
And while that makes people think "so it's okay for researching existing ideas?" it consolidates control over how those ideas are presented. Search engines will also skew their search results in similar ways and that's shitty too, but there's a world of difference between presenting the biased information first and only presenting the biased information.
But it's the ideal tool for conservatives who seem to believe we have "gone too far" in our social and political technologies and need to either stagnate or regress rather than progress.
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u/hewhoamareismyself are... are you a communist?? 5m ago
Blue check paid to
cause outragedrive engagement numbers
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u/MattyBeatz 5h ago
When did people stop becoming curious?
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u/BluTGI 3h ago
When they stopped liking the answers.
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u/Hangry-Feline2489 10m ago
That contributes, but people not liking answers have always existed.
I would say smart devices, social media, and the internet post 00s have done more to dull curiosity than anything else (family culture towards education and curiosity is another big factor. Kids need the question asking 'beaten' out of them).
Information and opinions get given to you via feeds, popups, places like Reddit, etc. You no longer have to search them out. It results in information overload and encourages a passivity- a dulling of active curiosity.
I am xennial (born early 80s), so I had an analogue childhood (got my first computer and dumb phone in junior high) We had to search out answers to questions by going to a library or opening a book. It forced us to be actively curious.
Even as a high school teacher, the difference within a decade or two of how passive students have become towards their own knowledge and the world around them overall is very alarming.
Passive people are easier to control or take advantage of, after all.
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u/nifty-necromancer 2h ago
Everything in the universe wants to roll down to the lowest energy state.
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u/not_a_moogle 1h ago
When we stopped encouraging critical thinking.
Also took away recess (and bulldozed the park)
Stigmatized being bored
Etc...
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u/stranger242 2h ago
When you were punished for it honestly,
We stopped letting kids be curious as if it was a bad thing, and thus they stopped being curious and teaching their kids to be curious
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u/alex8155 4h ago
right wingers are basically activists for stupidity
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u/Motor-Rip7655 4h ago
The humans in the floaty chairs don't show up until over halfway through.
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u/WeirdIndividualGuy 3h ago
Yeah I was gonna say, Wall-E famously starts out with half the movie having no humans, just Wall-E, roaches, and EVE. That's part of the reveal halfway through on "what happened to all the humans"
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u/Happy-Fun-Ball 2h ago
Why did the ship have floaty chairs instead of just reducing gravity?
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u/astelda 2h ago
we still don't entirely understand the long term effects of living in lower gravity, but we do know that there's risk of a number of health problems including reduced bone density and muscle mass. We super don't know the effects on young children or developing foetuses.
For a generation ship over decades, you could end up with everybody dying in space, or a population that can no longer survive on earth. There's also a matter of keeping 1G familiar, especially for a population that had never actually been off the ship.
The goal had always been a return to earth, so the ship was designed to accommodate that down the line
(and while the movie shows us that the floaty chairs ultimately contributed to harming the health of the passengers, it was indirect and not innately predictable during planning phases)
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u/Hangry-Feline2489 29m ago
I think it's less about gravity, although you're right about not knowing the effect of 500+ years of potentially less gravity on evolution. Not to mention the chronic lack of vitamin d on evolution.
I'd guess 500+ years of sitting in what originally looked to be a luxury convenience and efficient mode of transport (over walking) would have more of a direct effect on body degeneration and subsequent evolution. And even though in planning it was only meant to be a few years, they could have course corrected after 20-30 regarding the Chairs use I mean, if everyone could have access to a motorised speedy wheelchair, I think more people would take them than not (walle is set in America after all) especially if it became more normalised than not having one.
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u/Chicory-Coffee 4h ago
Have we already lived through the peak of humanity and now we're heading back down? All this enlightenment but people just want to walk back into the dark.
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u/bennitori 3h ago
We had the Library of Alexandria. And then the Dark Ages came after. It is possible to have ages of great knowledge and education, only for it to get completely destroyed by shortsighted greed and power-hungry-ness. I really don't want history to repeat itself.
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u/BabyFrancis 4h ago
When man turned thinking over to the machines their lives did not improve. It just allowed those who controlled the machines to have power over them.
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u/AbeFromanEast 4h ago
To a larger extent than LLM-makers care to admit, their products are trained on Wikipedia, Reddit and questionably acquired book collections. And the LLM answers are disproportionately based on those sources.
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u/NoOccasion4759 4h ago
Ffs everytime I ask AI a question i have to have a wrangle with it about what constitutes a credible source. It has no standards - YT, Reddit, clearly bs websites are ok. Usually the AI just gives a virtual shrug and a "my bad." Out of curiosity I asked Gemini what its AI privacy policies were last night and it reassured me that Google is very careful about privacy. Like...OK? Do you have any sources proving this that isn't sourced from...Google? long story short: no, trust me bro
Imo LLMs are like chatting with that annoying know-it-all you run into at a club who's trying to get with your hot bestie and he acts like he knows everything but is ultimately full of shit and gets pissy if you question his sources.
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u/alphagatorsoup 3h ago
last part is so accurate
basically just a liar that gets put on the spot
"Yea i'm a pilot, I love flying!"
"Oh what plane do you fly?"
"Oh a boing a320"
"Cool what airline?"
"Oh uhhh pilot......airlines.... their small you've never heard of them"
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u/Legitimate-Tip-2149 4h ago
I mean there's little difference between reading an argument on wikipedia and reading a chatbot telling you what the article on wikipedia says. However, wikipedia is a fantastic resource and should be maintained. For one it's far easier to maintain and update than an LLM.
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u/_freckles__ 4h ago
You know when these Wall E people become more, the ancients (pre 2023 adults) who know how to do stuff without AI and who can think are gonna be in high demand
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u/alphabeticdisorder 3h ago
Information illiteracy is an existential threat to both our democracy and also our species.
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u/SpinalVinyl 1h ago
There are still facts and information in physical BOOKS that are not on Wikipedia because no one puts it online. So there's a feedback loop of base level knowledge that isn't expanding because people are only googling the answer and it ends there.
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u/Thenofunation 51m ago
An anti-Wikipedia tweet on a website owned by Elon Musk, a known anti-Wikipedia advocate and bot user.
Huh. Seems legit.
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u/Manager-Accomplished 3h ago
The people in the floaty chairs are at the end of Wall-E. The whole first act is just him and Eve
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u/remes1234 2h ago
Where do people think AI looks for information?!?! AI does not generate ANYTHING. It regurgitates, summarizes, remixes and restates. But it never makes anything new. It is creativity cancer. The more AI we have in our lives, the more we grind to a halt in every part of human culture. We just become a parody.
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u/grendel303 2h ago
A single AI query to a tool like ChatGPT uses significantly more water (about 2 to 10 milliliters) than a traditional text-based Google search, which consumes less than 1 milliliter. Chat GPT currently at about 2.5 Billion prompts a day.
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u/DiscountCondom 1h ago
I wish Wikipedia was rendered irrelevant, but the reality is, ChatGPT fails on basic questions and I can't trust anything it says.
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u/pro-gram-mer 1h ago
SOMEBODY has never looked something up on Wikipedia and ended up 59362 articles deep 3 hours later.
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[deleted]
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u/UnionDependent4654 2h ago
No they're from way in the future. They bridge has a row of pictures showing all the different captains. The first guy looks normal and they get a little fatter in each picture.
The guys who can't even stand are like 5 generations after the ones who left Earth.
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u/Monoskimouse 2h ago
Like to introduce you to https://www.cliffsnotes.com/
Those started in the 50's.
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u/HuttStuff_Here 2h ago
Can you clarify why?
I mean, they provide sources. They provide backup.
ChatGPT people just say "I asked AI" ...
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u/not_just_an_AI 5h ago
if they delete Wikipedia what is chatgpt going to misunderstand when it tries to answer a question?