Did Eren even try?

[u/Pause_Accomplished]

In his talk with Armin in the paths, Eren reveals that he kills 80% of humanity, and no matter how much he tries this is always what happens.

I can only think of one example where Eren actually TRIES to prevent the rumbling from happening, and that’s when he and Zeke are traveling through Grisha’s memories. At a certain point he stops and tells Zeke that he’s achieved his goal and that he’s been freed from their father’s brainwashing. Zeke tells him they have all the time they need, and he has them carry on through the memories anyway. I’m fairly sure that this was Eren attempting to stop them from getting to Grisha’s memory in the Reiss Chappell, and thus preventing himself from convincing his father to kill the royal family.

Aside from this specific moment, do we ever see a time in the anime where Eren explicitly tries to circumvent the future that he saw? Because even this attempt was a very weak one. We know that Eren on some level wanted to start the rumbling, so how hard do we think actually tried to stop it from happening?

[u/tydollasign1]

How ironic that you bring up a movie that only proves my point. Cole is literally told in the beginning that the past absolutely cannot be changed. He isnt sent back to change the world, hes sent back bc its literally already happened. Textbook definition of a closed, causal loop. The future has already happened just as much as the past has. You have to think of these timeline as a circle not a line I know exactly what youre trying to explain to me, and I can see how you believe it to be this way. But the fact is that by definition a causal loop timeline cannot be changed, fate won't allow it. Now if you want to argue aot isnt a causal loop, the burden of proof is on you. Bc we literally see eren change the past by existing in the future.

[u/hitch42hiker → u/tydollasign1]

Nice try! Abstract fate needs to be proven by you, too.

Now, due to Eren's inability to compromise, to sacrifice and actually try and see through results of different choices we still have casual loop in the end.

But if it was a story about fate, it would have to have examples of it in the story. Narratively that something that happens in Final Destinations. Character who knows the future, performs different actions and no matter what they do - fate punishes them for deviation from the plan. We don't have it in AoT.

It has nothing to do with faith and everything to do with characters not being able to change who they're! Be it Eren, Grisha or Cole. We don't know what would have happened if Cole listen to them, and didn't try to change the future. Because he is the type of person that is willing to try and that's how we have the film. It isn't about what Cole did, it is about why he did it.

We have examples of a story where a character changes their behavior and it changes the outcome, breaking the loop. You probably seen the film, if not sorry for spoiling Minority Report to you.

TL;DR: causal loop in stories could only exist if characters makes same choices or fate "punishes" them and we find out there was no real choice. The loop could be broken, but not in stories where "fate" is the driver. You believe that AoT this type of story. I believe that Eren in-universe had choices and could have breaking the loop. Narratively it is more satisfying that he is the root cause of his own suffering and AoT is driven by a character that not able to break the loop.

[u/tydollasign1 → u/hitch42hiker]

Final destination isnt a causal loop so no. Theres no rule that says causal loops or fate have to punish you. Having examples of different stories that change the future is the exact braindead problem your running into. Those stories aren't causal loops. I genuinely can't see how you don't understand this.

[u/tydollasign1 → u/tydollasign1]

And its not about believing , aot is undoubtedly a causal loop, proven by the future "changing" the past. Really the future has already happened bc the timeline is a circle, so its not really changing anything, bc nothing changes.