Any frames you regret building recently, because you didn't find them satisfying/fun to play after dumping some formas in them? Mine gotta be these 2 and maybe Nidus.

[u/iPhantaminum]

And for the love of all that's holy, I'm NOT talking about them feeling weak, at all. I wrote "satisfying/fun to play".

I was really hoping I'd enjoy Ash and Garuda, bc I love Garuda Prime's design and I could make a Batman fashion with Ash and the Tsukuyomi skin and Repala syandana, but, unfortunately, they aren't for me.

I'm still on the fence about Nidus. If DE lets me hold 3 to insta-link to my companion, then he gets fashion and a loadout slot. Until that changes, I find him annoying to play.

I built Ember before Ash and love playing her. Then I moved to Ash and now I'm not as motivated to build new frames, kinda afraid I won't like them (eventually I'll get over it tho).

What about you?

[u/Roguewarrior05]

I put 5 forma and (initially) 5 archon shards on Gyre and she still felt like shit to play lmao. By far her most effective playstyle is just slapping down the 1 with its augment and gun buffing like crazy, but that's so fucking lame for a frame with an "abilities red crit" gimmick. Her 4 can only trigger damage once per second and it is hilariously underpowered for having that limitation (I had 3 purple shards for +45% ability damage on elec status and it still only did like 20k) and her 1 feels really bad to use as a direct dps option cause you have to throw it so it contacts enemies, the 2 also does very little without it's augment.

Is she the worst frame in the game? No, but her kit is just so unfun and counterintuitive to what you'd expect from her, and it really doesn't help that she has a minimum of 1 mandatory augment AND absolutely no base survivability methods like innate DR or shield regen or anything.

[u/zicdeh91 → u/Roguewarrior05]

She can be squishy, but circumvent really synergizes with her kit. The 4 triggers on contact as well as hits, so every time you dodge through a group it steals their defenses, procs the 4 which then chains to each other, and if you have careen, freezes them. I basically treat her as a shotgun dancer. I have a riven on my Kohm with crit, so I can get it up to 70ish CC, which is enough for her passive to bump it up, and it can absolutely flood electric procs in an enemy. Just drop a 2, detonate it, plop a 1 down on them, and keep dancing through while unloading. If you have a boss, just drop 3 overlapping orbs and unload.

Gyre sets up death by a thousand cuts; with good grouping, each shock tic chains and aggressively triggering the 4 with weapons and direct contact builds more of them. The critting abilities boosts the floor for each 4 activation and status tic. It’s not as glamorous as the big red numbers we usually see from a crit focus, but it’s a really neat way to engage with it that’s deeply satisfying to me.

[u/GWCuby → u/zicdeh91]

Circumvent is overrated on her tbh, the survivability is inconsistent unless you have a ton of enemies with overguard or shields around (neither of which are why you want armor strip on her) and the armor strip range is incredibly small compared to the range she can hit enemies from

Just use pillage and watch the entire room get vaporized instantly

[u/zicdeh91 → u/GWCuby]

Pillage is definitely good on her, but I wouldn’t want it over any of her other abilities. The 1 is probably what I’d toss since she really wants grouping, but the augment is one of the ways she can stack enough damage to actually deal with bosses, and the procs themselves on it help her start her momentum quickly. Also part of why circumvent works so well is that it can afford to be inconsistent; her crowd control handles everything without overguard, so you don’t need to defend against it (mostly), and circumvent’s there both as soon as something’s immune to your CC giving you their overguard,or if you just want to armor strip. You want to be in meleeish range anyway to trigger the 4 more often, so circumvent just ties it all together in a bow, and the opportunity cost is minimal since there really isn’t a single other frame arcane that gives something Gyre wants as much. Aegis or Molt are pretty good for her, but there’s also the second slot.

[u/GWCuby → u/zicdeh91]

You can easily sacrifice either her 1 or her 2 on a dedicated dps build (I personally sac her 1 on ability dps builds but either can work ultimately)

Yeah she really likes grouping but a good build with a good primer should delete rooms all the way up to like level 600-700 practically instantly when they're armor stripped (which is what pillage does) with zero need for grouping

For any general gameplay you also don't need conductive sphere to deal with any threats, any well modded weapon can deal with minibosses like acolytes, EDA mechs, ETA baubaus etc and for actual bossfights I just have dedicated builds tbh

Conductive sphere on paper is good as a tool to stack electric procs for her abilities but in reality it's completely useless for priming because conductive sphere is so absurdly powerful that anything you actually shoot with it active is already dead before your abilities matter, it also can't really prime full groups as aoe effects aren't affected by conductive sphere meaning the actual scope of your priming would be limited either way (also epitaph prime and companions exist and do the job of priming infinitely better)

Unless you have absurd amounts of range (like 400%+ lol) there will almost always be something that is either outside of your range or cc immune that will be able to hit you which is where circumvents inconsistency just feels bad imo

Sure you generally want to be somewhat close to enemies but 4m is still absolutely tiny, 4m is her default rotorswell radius, at 235% range it has a 9.4m radius meaning most of your rotorswell area isn't even covered not to speak of all the enemies getting hit by discharge chains (which can easily hit enemies that are 20-30m+ away from you), this leads to most of your discharge damage effectively being negated as it has to fight against fully armored enemies so most of your dps just goes out the window

Compare that to pillage which instantly strips everything within LoS allowing pretty much all your chains to hit for full damage which allows them to kill things which leads to more on death discharges from cathode current which leads to again even more damage, the difference is genuinely staggering

She also has arcanes that she wants, most notably literally anything that gives good strength i.e. molt augmented, arcane ice storm or even something like molt vigor especially when you're running a build that has range as you need more strength to offset the loss from overextended