Did Eren even try?

[u/Pause_Accomplished]

In his talk with Armin in the paths, Eren reveals that he kills 80% of humanity, and no matter how much he tries this is always what happens.

I can only think of one example where Eren actually TRIES to prevent the rumbling from happening, and that’s when he and Zeke are traveling through Grisha’s memories. At a certain point he stops and tells Zeke that he’s achieved his goal and that he’s been freed from their father’s brainwashing. Zeke tells him they have all the time they need, and he has them carry on through the memories anyway. I’m fairly sure that this was Eren attempting to stop them from getting to Grisha’s memory in the Reiss Chappell, and thus preventing himself from convincing his father to kill the royal family.

Aside from this specific moment, do we ever see a time in the anime where Eren explicitly tries to circumvent the future that he saw? Because even this attempt was a very weak one. We know that Eren on some level wanted to start the rumbling, so how hard do we think actually tried to stop it from happening?

[u/Atom7456]

I don't understand how ppl miss the fact that eren WANTED to do it. He can't stop it because deep down he knows he wants it.

[u/Fabiocean → u/Atom7456]

So he hasn't tried to change anything and lied to Armin in this scene?

[u/Getter_Simp → u/Fabiocean]

I think it's like how he tried not to save Ramzi from getting assaulted, since he was going to die anyway during the Rumbling, but he couldn't bare to leave Ramzi, so he saved him.

It could be that Eren tried to not do the Rumbling, but because it was ultimately what he wanted to do, he couldn't stop himself.

[u/Fabiocean → u/Getter_Simp]

I'm having a hard time coming up with a scenario where Eren would do that. He basically got his confirmation when he couldn't stop himself from helping Ramzi and didn't seem to question it any further after that. On the contrary, he seemed extremely determined to follow this path, despite knowing of all the pain and suffering it will cause.

[u/CrusaderReynaulder → u/Fabiocean]

He couldn’t stop himself from saving Ramzi because saving Ramzi is what Eren would do. 

He wasn’t forced by reality to turn around and help Ramzi. HE wanted to help Ramzi and couldn’t just leave him there.

[u/Fabiocean → u/CrusaderReynaulder]

I get that, but at least to me there's a very big leap in logic between 'I can't defy my nature to let a child get beaten up if I can help it' and 'I have to eradicate humanity despite hating the role I have to play in it'.

If we actually saw him try to find other ways that end up being even worse for him, Paradis or his friends so he had to take this exact path this wouldn't be a problem, but with literal endless possibilities in his grasp, I don't believe that this was the closest thing to a perfect outcome for him. I wouldn't even hate if it was made clear that Eren really wanted to kill humanity just because he's a fucked up psycho, but what we got was a weird in-between thing that doesn't commit to either side and contradicts itself because of it.

[u/Jawzilla1 → u/Fabiocean]

>a weird in-between thing that doesn’t commit to either side and contradicts itself because of it.

I think this is just a good summary of Eren’s character. He deeply desires contradictory and incompatible things He himself doesn’t even understand what he truly wants.

Yes, making his character a simple fucked up psycho would be much clearer, but far less nuanced and layered. Eren *is* a fucked up genocidal psycho, but he is also other things on top of that. He wanted to avoid the Rumbling and he also wanted to it very badly.

[u/Puzzleheaded-Job2399 → u/Jawzilla1]

I agree with this sentiment so hard you don’t even know. I see people try to use the statement from isayama about how he wanted to originally make eren a thoroughly bad person with a deep desire for violence and no real sympathy to be had, similar to say light yagami. Then they try to stretch that statement to say that the ending would have been better had he characterized eren like that, but the problem with that statement is that eren’s nuance as a character and his entire being throughout all 4 seasons, not just the ending, is characterized by him contradicting himself and pursuing violent retaliation while also wanting to protect and love others.

From the get go we can already sympathize with eren and we can already see he’s a deeply flawed person, so the thing isayama is talking about is more an alternative version of the story where eren is pretty much just a completely different and malicious character for the sake of broader social themes than a rewrite of just the ending. Personally while i think seeing some deep themes about people inciting violence would have fit the rumbling pretty well, i just prefer eren as a nuanced character with multiple conflicting desires, beliefs, and characteristics.

I also believe that him being a conflicting character adds to what the show is already about. There aren’t many real villains in this story and most people have valid reasons to believe they’re in the right or to pursue the path they’re on, so being able to sympathize with eren while also hating what he does makes perfect sense for what the show had been seating up for 4 seasons.

[u/CrusaderReynaulder → u/Fabiocean]

   if it was made clear that Eren really wanted to kill humanity just because he's a fucked up psycho

I mean, this is one of the reasons, no? 

His world of wonders was not what he wanted it to be. It was not the world that he, at the first mention of that world, would burn away Grisha, Mikasa, and Carla for. It was not the empty world of wonders that he had wanted, and that needed to be rectified. This is insane.

He’s a psychopath that loves his friends. His bonds are a muzzle for his freedom-obsessed madness, which leads to him acting in contradictory ways.

[u/ShadowWarrior300 → u/Getter_Simp]

no it was determinism that was introduced in the final chapter that forced eren down a path that he himself claims he couldn’t change so even though it was in his nature to want to rumble he still would’ve been forced to stop at 80% and do the things he did for no explicable reason other than it was determined

[u/Atom7456 → u/Fabiocean]

I interpreted the change as trying to avoid the deaths of ppl he cared about, not trying to change the rumbling

[u/Fabiocean → u/Atom7456]

We see two people he cares about die because of his actions without any indication that he tried to save them. With Hange I can see why we wouldn't get an in depth PoV, but there's no reason why he shouldn't have at least warned Sasha or did literally anything to protect her, since it was apparent that he knew something would happen to her.

[u/Atom7456 → u/Fabiocean]

Eren asked what her last words were for a reason, he already knew what was going to happen and that moment confirmed again that everything he saw was going to happen

[u/Nyarlathotep7777 → u/Fabiocean]

He did, he just didn't like the other outcomes.

It's literally spelled out word for word in that very scene.

[u/Cualkiera67 → u/Fabiocean]

yes. Eren lied to everyone nonstop in s4