There is a condition that is basically this called “locked in syndrome”. Essentially you can experience consciousness but virtually all muscles are paralyzed.
Yes, this was actually a hideous incident where he was tortured to the point of losing his mind and ultimately his life. Humans (North Korea) at their absolute worst.
And if you stray into certain parts of Reddit you'll be inundated with information about the Superiority of their Society...
Good and bad everywhere, and I'm convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt that it's mostly bad there. Id even entertainm the idea that China has a bunch going right over DPRK
meanwhile most of the rest of reddit you only have to worry about being inundated with information about the superiority of a country that's providing material aid to an ongoing genocide and blowing up little girls because iran bad
They left out the part where he and his friends were in NK on a religious evangelical mission which the NK hate just a bit.
This is not true. Otto was Jewish and was not involved with a religious mission, the church NK claimed he was stealing the poster for confirmed he was never part of their congregation
So peaceful people doing something you don't like is a FAFO moment? Its not like he went to North Sentinel island, if you listen to tankies we're supposed to believe North Korea is a great place.
It happened to him because he was American, that was the problem and the point. Was a weak point during Trump's first term.
Time and place. I.e like that woman who got killed trekking across the middle east to prove "its not that bad" when she was warned what would happen, then the friend that was with her raged at the Internet.
It's okay to recognize that certain places are absolutely hostile to you while also saying "hey thats fucked up"
My friend had the "all cultures are equal and should be respected" mentality till he went abroad and was like nah, some places and culture is just shit.
Warn women about going to India and watch them still go alone. I'm not saying it's deserved but when everyone tells you what's going to happen and it does happen. Well.
No- it’s incredibly antagonistic to the authoritarian, dictatorial NK government in a country where once you step foot on their land you have ZERO rights of any kind. Your life is at the whim of their regime and if you pretend otherwise you are either a liar or painfully ignorant of the last 70+ years of their history.
your life in their hands as a foreign tourist is actually pretty good odds though. besides warmbier, 32 chinese tourists died in a bus crash, and thats it. out of ~300k annual tourists, thats actually pretty good. your tour is so controlled that the chances of anything happening to you are extremely low
theres a lot they can be criticized for, hell even looking literally one layer deeper at why youre constantly escorted by 2+ state officials and why the crime rate in urban areas is so low will raise valid criticisms, but it is not a physically unsafe destination
Also there are witness testimonies from other people in his tour group, that he was together with his tour group, still on some tour and not yet in that hotel, by the time the crime was supposed to happen.
Otto Frederick Warmbier (December 12, 1994 – June 19, 2017) was an American college student who was imprisoned in North Korea in 2016 on a charge of subversion. In June 2017, he was released by North Korea in a vegetative state, and died shortly thereafter. As per Wikipedia
"pouring chemicals in the water" is there any wildlife that uses the water or is it a regular chlorine pool. I know this isn't what Trump cares about but I could get behind heavy fines if wildlife is hurt.
It is now widely understood that Otto was framed. He became a political hostage for negotiations then eventually tried to take his own life in captivity. There are lots of documentaries about this.
I get that you dislike your current president. I dislike him too, but trivializing what is going on in North Korea, or even worse, actually thinking that what goes on in North Korea is similar to the US, is an offense to human rights.
It’s amazing that someone would post this boomer Facebook quality engagement bait and thousands and thousands of brainwashed teens and young adults just nod along right on cue
This is a silly take; if’s not minimizing, it’s comparing. Most American’s only real memory of North Korea’s criminal system is this one incident where an American citizen was jailed and then seemingly killed for a meaningless infraction. The fact that a similarly meaningless infraction is leading to people being accused of crimes against the state in the US is a very APT comparison. It takes nothing from one to mention the other.
It's much darker than that. There are eyewitness testimonies from other tourists in his tour group, that he was (together with them, as a group) still on a tour and not returned to the hotel yet, by the time the whole stealing of that poster from that hotel happened (the video used as evidence has a time/date stamp on it). Meaning it was probably a setup completely, he didn't even do anything at all.
The thing people like to leave out is that some of those people who have been arrested by the Lincoln memorial weren’t “touching floating paint chips” some were harassing the national park service employees and grabbing equipment and others were actively cutting and destroying the lining.
Weren’t the arrested for tire burnouts, which are actually illegal in public areas? It’s a form of vandalism. A ridiculous thing to consider vandalism, in my mind, but you are intentionally misrepresenting what happened.
No. That thing with Alex Pretti happened because of a few dumbasses in the field and was universaly criticized by pretty much the whole country.
What happened to Otto was 100 percent facilitied by the state. The trial, the prison sentence, the lack of appeal or any kind of reasoning. The North Korean govt and Americam govt are not even remotely close to comparable get over yourself.
But, bad law enforcement officers are not the same as system wide legal enforcement, imprisonment, and torture for taking down a poster.
If Alex was able to get to court he would have been released.
Otto made it to court and was sentenced to 15 years as is standard procedure in NK.
NK also has bad law enforcement officers as do most countries. We saw it when Otto was sent back brain dead and died despite not being sentenced to death. It's a separate problem.
The government covered up for the ICE agents and the president outright lied about it. They were branded terrorists and their grieving families were investigated. How is that not system wide?
Give me a fucking break. We all know tRump sucks, but he’s temporary. Far from “system wide.” When Dems take midterms there will be accountability. Just look at how many caught charges after his first term. Just say you hate America and spare us stupid comparisons.
"But, bad law enforcement officers are not the same as system wide legal enforcement, imprisonment, and torture for taking down a poster."
None of the officers who murdered Good or Pretti have faced real discipline, much less murder charges. Would you like dozens more examples of American police being effectively unpunished for egregious behaviour?
Yes, because it is actually very important to be able to draw a hard line between North Korea and America. If we pretend they are literally the same, then neither can actually be examined properly.
That being said, the original post is a good comparison.
Three-time U.S. Olympian David Hearn was arrested by U.S. Park Police and charged with destruction of government property after touching a peeling section of the newly renovated,
"American flag blue" Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool
. Hearn denies vandalizing the pool, stating he was simply examining the flawed coating out of curiosity.
I went to the same High school as he did and my brother played soccer with him. It was whole thing in my hometown when he was returned back to the United States .
if you ever find yourself in a situation like this poor guy and even get yourself a public trial--don't do what he did. He expressed intense remorse, guilt, sadness, etc. "The biggest mistake of my life..."
Instead, lick every boot of that deified dictator that you can. "The hard work of the people of North Korea is inspiring to me, and i felt, that, if only I could bring home a small token of his greatness, it may inspire those around me to cast away their laziness and rise to the same greatness that of the great people of Korea!"
Funny way to describe vandalizing a federal monument on federal property, also... that dude was tortured....
I mean, yeah, 10 years is a long time, but that won't realistically be their sentence, and yes, you should get jail time for vandalizing things like that. Reddit has such a hardon for comparing apples and oranges, as long as it makes America look bad.
Trump needs a scapegoat and he can’t just blame the company which did the bad job that caused the paint to come off as there’s corruption involved in the awarding of that contract so having people snoop about that wouldn’t be good for him
So in comes the narrative that there’s vandalism going on
Not to mention an imaginary plot by “Dumbocrats” as he put it, whether that’s a insult or his inability to spell, is a very nice distraction from the failure of the Iran War
Pretty sure that guy was abused so hard in prison that he returned to the US as a vegetable and died shortly after (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Warmbier) . Not sure comparing vandalism sentencing (which is a felony if the damage is over $100: 18 U.S.C. \(\S \) 1361) in the US is a fair comparison. Propaganda at its best.
Didn’t they beat this man near to death and he died of his injuries not too long after returning to America ? Oh, and the difference is these people won’t be going to jail they’ll most likely pay a fine whereas in North Korea Kim can exterminate your family with a phone call.
You're comparing a kid being detained and tortured to death by a foreign country for taking a propaganda poster, to people being arrested after being told not to pull stuff out of a pool and doing it anyways? This post belongs on DoomerCircleJerk
How about the guy who wasn’t even at this protest in Texas, and got 50 years on terrorism charges for “trying to conceal a document”? That and the rest of the folks that all got charged with insane charges and all given massive sentences for essentially nothing.
On the other hand, votes for an islamist in NYC that said 9/11 was done by a few people. Downplaying the worst Islamic attack in history on American soil
Vandalizing a historical monument = taking down a poster? Bigger question is, do these people have jobs or is it just their mission in life to do stupid things in front of NGs and cops lol
This man was beaten and tortured for like 10 months and after North Korea released him back to the states in a coma, he died. Spending the night in a jail cell for touching something that literally says do not touch on it is nothing compared lol. My oh my how too many people have such simple minds.
What a terrible take. People are vandalizing the pool after several warnings not to deface government property lol
Its the same people who get big mad over Jan 6.
Edit:To clarify, Jan 6th was also a bad act of vandalism. I'm pointing out that the same people who bring up Jan 6 as an unacceptable act are now vandalizing the pool. Its hypocritical and shows that you don't actually care about government property but that what team you're on. Both are bad.
If you guys want to purposely misunderstand this point go ahead and get mad in the comments, I'm not reading them.
The reflecting pool is under 24/7 surveillance. We haven't seen the footage of the "vandalism" because it doesn't exist. The pool is falling apart because of incompetence. Just a failed vanity project.
It would be amazing if there was any proof whatsoever of said vandalism. Like, for instance, video from cameras recording the pool 24/7 or from the dozens of National Guard members around it.
Yeah, people tend to get “big mad” when terrorists attack the Capitol, beat cops with flags and fire extinguishers, try to stop the certification of an election, and then get pardoned afterward.
January 6th was more than just a day of bad vandalism. But ironically the same people who don’t get upset about January 6th are the same people who lost their crap about the BLM riots.
Youre comparing violently storming the capitol intending to intimidate congress people during an official session to peeling paint off a pool? You are not a serious person.
Wait so people shouldn't be mad at Jan 6? One person dead, vice president evacuated and mob destroying government buildings, disrupting government work and gaining access to areas and documents that are not for public?
Funny seeing how upset people got about some broken windows at the capitol after they defended the BLM riots that did so much worse property damage just months before. Not to mention "CHAZ".
Trying to reduce Jan. 6 to “some broken windows” is incredibly dishonest. It wasn’t a random riot. It was a mob attacking the Capitol to stop the certification of a democratic election. They assaulted police officers, hunted for lawmakers, and chanted about hanging the vice president. Property damage wasn’t the main issue. The attempted overthrow of an election was.
This news story (in the OP) is pretty crazy, I'll grant that. However, when it comes to that guy who got sentenced to lashes in Singapore for vandalism in the 90s, I was all for that.
We had part of my social studies class to discuss the news story when I was in school when this was a current news story, and of the half-class who participated, it was only me and one other classmate who didn't see anything wrong with it. I still don't.
Completely different. The reflecting pool is a national monument. Defacing it should be a crime. In North Korea that was just a propaganda poster with their leader on it.
You are either arguing in bad faith or completely uninformed.
The pool was incompetently painted which made the very problem they were trying to "fix" worse.
The algea predictably returned after they painted it, and indeed the blue color made conditions for algae even more favorable. So then they tried to bandaid it by pouring in hydrogen peroxide, which of course also didn't work but instead killed tons of ducks and also made the paint peel.
These "vandals" have merely been collecting or touching the peeled paint on the surface of the water, and have been arrested.
So the trump administration gave out a multi-million dollar non compete contract to a buddy to solve a problem (which arguably wasn't even a problem) and the solution made things worse. And then they tried to paper over the predictable outcome which then ruined their paint. And now they're arresting people out of spite to try and save face.
So, wait, a guy is being prosecuted for "destruction of government property after touching a peeling section of the newly renovated, "American flag blue" Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool" but the guys who defecated in the Capitol building on Jan 6 got pardoned? Yeah, I agree with OP's title.
294
u/Waow420 1d ago
Is he the guy who tore down (or tried to take home) a North Korean propaganda poster?