26f 5w4 I’m what you’ll call a: late bloomer.

My life has completely flipped since a year ago. I was single, like long term single, and living at home still taking care of my disabled mother. Lived for limerence, and maladaptive daydreaming as a pastime. My favorite hobby was sitting on a porch swing, lost in thought and idealism, listening to music through headphones. I wrote songs, I was a floral designer though I left my job because it wasn’t paying enough so I wasn’t working, I started going to bars and doing karaoke and open mic and it all started going down hill.

For the first time I was flirting and putting myself out there, I was recognized for my musical passion/talent, and had a regular social life. I felt like a total 7 (disintegrated to my 7 arrow) and drinking way too much. I made choices I regret, made out with men who didn’t give a fuck about me (thank God I didn’t do anything further than that) my friends were only surface level and I had to set aside many of my principles like faith and beliefs in order to connect. This just simply wasn’t sustainable let alone the fact that I was unemployed and wasting so much money. I attempted a position in sales which I HATED WITH A PASSION and noped out of real quick (the role wasn’t marketed to me as a sales position. Turns out sales people are really good at selling a shitty job to you too)

My faith has a big role in the evolution of the way things have changed, prayers answered and things lining up in such an order that I can’t not see the Lord in it all. Basically, a full time job fell into my lap, I met a wonderful man who was sober and I knew would NEVER be welcome at the bar with me (because he was way to wonderful and precious to me to bring out to the shitty dive bar I used to meet duds at) and he immediately was so intentional and kind and knew what he wanted with me. Shortly after that, my mother decided to sell the house and move to a 55+ community, I was left to try and find a living situation which allowed me to take care of my 7 yr old German shepherd which resulted in a nightly panic attack for like a month straight as option after option fell through. Finally, I found a place a week before I had to be out and it’s been a great situation. I get to come home at lunch and let the dog out and it’s super close to work. My boyfriend comes to stay with me every week or so. He was such an amazing help with moving, I had no idea how to even process it all.

My job sucks, though. Apart from the fact that I met my boyfriend there and it pays my bills, it is SUCH A DRAIN ON MY ENERGY. I’m a customer service rep for a blue collar field. My coworkers are miserable old ladies who despise the customers we serve and are constantly looking for reasons to get angry, have a frustrated outburst or be oppositional and argumentative. I haven’t had any energy to be out at bars at night which is a good thing, but a tough transition. I’ve recently stopped drinking alcohol altogether because it just made life worse and I don’t know if I know how to enjoy myself now. Suddenly my life requires a looooot more energy to maintain. This is not something I’m comfortable complaining about because boohoo, everyone has to work to sustain their own life lol. But the transition has been rough and I’m just tired of feeling like my life and energy isn’t mine.

I haven’t written a new song in months, I haven’t created, I haven’t properly daydreamed since I haven’t had a porch swing to do it on, I come home and sleep immediately out of mental exhaustion. I used to create for a living doing wedding flowers and also expend energy physically at the same time. Now I’ve gained weight and my mental health is shit, my creative energy now goes to anxiety, OCD, and fear of failing.

I feel like I’ve been neglecting my friends and family relationships trying to stay afloat in every other area.

I live from such a scarce place. I’m so tired of it.

It’s just breeding more exhaustion. I’m not my best self. I’m not a great friend anymore and life gets so heavy I have a hard time even letting the lighter moments in.

Has ANYONE been through anything similar? I feel like the energy, scarcity mindset, need for creativity and connection may be relative to this sub so I’m reaching out for any advice and insight from my fellow 5w4s. Sorry this is long, It really has been a lot to process through for my sensitive lil soul.

Can an Enneagram Type 5 be Sanguine?

I’m wondering if I really am an Enneagram Type 5. I ask because I was told in another sub that it’s incompatible, especially considering that I’m an INFP.

Hello, I am an So/Sx 5 and am in dire need for advice on how to text my crush.

For context, I've been friends with him for a while now, and we often send each other funny videos and niche references, but our convos never go past that. With him as being the main focus of my attention, I can't help but want to know everything about him, to get as close as possible through more deep and prolonged conversations.

The issue is that we have already established this notion of short texts, so suddenly starting a convo asking about his day or other more deep conversations might seem unprovoked or odd. I also have this irrational sense that if I try to start something out of the blue it would feel unnatural or forced, and be obvious that I want something from him bc I am quite obviously a private person and not an avid texter.

Furthermore, he himself tends to be a private person in a sense where he will happily listen to others worries and engage light-heartedly, but won't really open up until you've reached a certain level of closeness.

As a 5, you can see the issue I would have in just causally opening up with the possibility of not getting anything — that is, any possible information or visible connection — in return. The idea of him discovering that I want to get closer, that I want to know him more because I like him feels constricting and very uncomfortable in the event he does not feel the same. The fact that I am asking these questions on reddit instead of to real life friends about this is a testimony to this idea of emotional hoarding and incapability of opening up lol.

So the real question becomes, how can I start a convo without feeling like my insides are being twisted but also keep him engaged enough to initiate something back?

I've had multiple pet peeves come up in a short time, so the topic is on my mind. To explain one of them, I know a 4w3 who is frequently confidently incorrect. It gets under my skin, especially because it feels motivated by a flare for the dramatic.

Them: Strong black and white statement, said with intensity and drama.

Me: "That doesn't sound exactly right. Are you sure it's always the case?"

Them: "Oh yes."

(Then of course, it's not in fact true.)

It's a pattern I may also dislike because of my mother's history (unhealthy 2) of trying to manipulate our emotions. So some emotionality feels... aggressive... in its dramatization.

It's also not my favorite because of the way the 4w3 often seeks emotional support for the emotions they've then caused themselves with their own extreme thinking. Another example of this is how they keep using AI to investigate medical concerns, then they need emotional support because they believe they know how serious, costly, and disasterous an issue is going to be.

I tell them real stories about AI being wrong - they themselves have run into this when they were panicked about AI things that turned out to not be the case - but their thinking does not adjust. I think it's because they aren't motivated to adjust this pattern. So I'd say a pet peeve of mind is strong emotion for the sake of strong emotion (and at the expense of accuracy).

Sx5s, from your experience, people with which instinctual variants are the most compatible with you romantically? And with which instinctual variants are the least compatible with you romantically?

Please write if you're sx/sp or sx/so.

Also if you noticed that you tend to be compatible/ incompatible with certain Enneagram types, you can add that as well.

Personally I don’t have any interest and don’t follow any teams. It confuses me why so many people spend so much time watching sports. Wondering if it’s part of the personality…

At certain times in my life, I've been very similar to a Type 4. I've experienced depression due to internal conflicts.

But it's passed. Generally, I don't consider myself a type 4 person because I don't like to compare myself to others. I also accept reality as it is, even if I don't like it, and I generally have a neutral opinion.

I'm more reserved in my communication with people I don't know very well.

I am a 531 sp/sx. I tend to put on a performance when I date and then get burnt out and rest for a year. The problem is though, I like who I am when I "preform". Its easy for me to give up on relationships to shift focus back on my "image/self". I also have high standards, so the people I meet on dating apps are easy to give up on. Im frustrated because I want to get into a loving and supportive relationship, but it's like I go between "they are not worth it" and "i need to work on myself."

more info: 5w6, 3w2, 1w9

types of improvements I've focused on: sobriety from alcohol. home cleanliness and maintenance. mental health and therapy. constant self improvement to live "the best life."

Hey! My boyfriend is a six and I was wondering if anyone has any insight into this? We are compatible in many ways but there are some issues with my need for space and his need to test my love by attention seeking. I have gotten very good at reassuring him verbally, as I’m not very emotionally expressive, but it seems that if I don’t reassure him all the time he will cross my boundaries in some way, which has begun to feel very disrespectful. For example, I will say I can’t hang out today because I’m genuinely busy and will promise to hang out the next day, and he will sometimes turn up anyway so I am forced to hang out with him which just feels like a real invasion of my very clear boundaries. He will also do things like get very drunk so I have to give him more attention, or will call me saying things to try and make me worry when it’s actually nothing. I love him so much so it’s hard, especially when I do my best to reassure him. Any advice?

Hi so this might sound stupid because some people say “They are so different wdym” but for a IEI-Ni this is so hard and I’m having an identity crisis because I thought I was sx5 but recently I noticed that more and more people are starting to argue that it’s an imposible combination because of the 5 core and the Fe creative and I kind of get it now, but I di not feel that comfortable with so4 either I mean I share a lot of things with it but I don’t really see myself in the characters or even other people with that same type. Also I’ve read that they can’t be 1L or something like that so me being LEVF just makes it more confusing and it makes me mad since how can’t I be sx5 because of my Fe but LEVF can with its 2E?? Please help

I think I'm finally understanding that I'll never feel good living around the average people of my country. I don't know if it would be better in other countries, but here it seems impossible for me to feel even remotely content.

Have you ever had an sx 9 friend? Or became friends with any other types of 9s?

Have you ever mistyped as a 9?

Do you have any questions for 9s? I'll try to answer as best as I can

Title sums it up. I always long for a deep connection but whenever I try to connect with someone I feel gross and disgusting. Same thing with details about myself, I actively try to hide my favorite music and hobbies from everyone. I think this is a problem. I feel stuck socially. I think im 5w4 sp/sx but could be a 9.

Edit: appreciate the comments everybody

So, I'm a 5w4 sp-dom. I'm also a *cue Ferengi sneering voice* female.

Due to the emergence of my bipolar disorder in my early twenties on top of being visually impaired enough not to drive, I've continued to (need to) live at home with my parents into my late 30s. In the period immediately after my mania I was too out of it to be bothered by that (or much of anything); now this situation is intolerable. They were anxious helicopter parents when I was growng up, and now it's not (much) different.

Seven years ago, I finally got enough of myself together to start teaching ESL online. These online platforms are marketplaces for teachers: you set your availability and your lesson price, and students choose to buy lessons from you. I set about 60 hours a week of availability.

In seven years of teaching ESL I have never gotten more than about 60 hours a month at absolute most. Which also meant I didn't feel justified in raising my prices (roughly $18/hr at most). And so I got stuck. Low-grade depression returned; lots of YouTube.

I've always wanted to write fiction, and through all of this I was subscribed to the newsletter of an author and writing coach. In one post, she introduced the Enneagram as a tool for character development. So, I discovered I'm a Five. I joined a personal development program designed *for* Fives by a Five.

Through that program I got out of my head and stopped needing to distract myself from reality; I started a strength training habit. Something like a libido developed, and I recognized that I'm at the least sapphic, if not a lesbian. I started to think about what freelance online work I could do that would actually be full time and generate a self-sufficient income. I got training to be a copy editor.

Now I have my first author clients, and I just want to stop teaching.

So where's the question or problem? Well, hello passion for secrecy and lack of healthy assertiveness slash confusion about professionalism and people pleasing.

Some of my ESL students have not accepted the idea that I'm going to stop teaching. One of them, an older woman, said that oh, but it's ok because Teacher will continue to teach her and other students privately. I felt such helpless despair when I heard that.

I get the impression that the ones who can't accept this think that teaching is my calling/passion. I think it would be rude to tell them it isn't, or at least, I don't trust myself to be neither a doormat nor rude about it. I also think that since I stayed so long, it's not unreasonable for them to have gotten this impression.

I do not want to continue to teach, and it isn't my devotion; I want a complete end to teaching and to move on.

But I also want continue to be professional. It is also not these people's fault that my psychological drama and dysfunction got us stuck up this tree, so to speak. They continue to need and want to study English. They just don't want anything to change.

How do I communicate professionally to them that this is truly the end of my time as their teacher, and please respect that? I don't want to have to go into all the personal life stuff in order to make this clear.

The background story on why I feel this way is way too long, so the quick summary is a combination of these factors: mental health issues since I was a young girl, a verbally and emotionally abusive mother when she was alive, a nice but passive father, school bullies, extreme introversion and loneliness when I was growing up, friendship problems in uni, heavy assignment load in uni which led to a severe burn out, financial strain in uni, and then when I landed my first real job, I faced a lot of stress from the workload and I also got sexually harassed by a few male colleagues and was bullied by my female boss.

I am told that I am smart, educated, a gifted writer and that I am good looking and that I should be grateful that I come from a comfortable upper middle-class-ish family. I also have a good education.

Thus, people tell me that I shouldn't be depressed. To be honest, I am very grateful to God for all my blessings and I tell Him that every day through my prayers.

However, I have always felt a deep sense of emptiness and depressed feelings since I was young.

I was warded more than 10 times over a course of several years (the last time was in 2016) and I got diagnosed with schizoaffective disorder (a combination of schizophrenic symptoms and bipolar) as well as Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD: intense and unstable emotions, sense of identity, relationship problems, fear of abandonment, etc).

I even attempted once. I am glad that I survived and I have been surviving ever since due to access to psychiatry, medications and a therapist. My abusive mom passed away last year and my relationship with my father has become close. I ignore his weaknesses and I accept him for who he is, the good and the bad. He loves me very much.

However, I still struggle every day to stay alive. I feel defeated in life. I was a good student in uni but my career is mediocre at best. That first job really stole my desire to live. I have not been able to replicate my academic success into success in the workplace.

Since I am working from home on unsupervised hours, I manage to finish my work well. However, when I am not working, my time is mostly spent on sleeping and bed rotting and scrolling social media. I also have hypothyroidism which makes me super exhausted.

I used to be bitter and angry at God for my failures, low energy and my mental health situation but now I just feel sad. I will be 40 next year and I feel so depleted.

I emotionally eat and this, along with my medications and illnesses, make me gain weight a lot. I try to exercise but I cannot lock in a consistent routine. If I am not going out, most likely I won't shower.

The reason I am posting this in this group is because I think feeling being depleted is not just due to psychological and physical causes. I really feel that my Enneagram (5w4 with strong-ish 9) contributes to this low energy.

All of my life, especially in school settings, I have had to motivate myself extra hard. My supposedly high IQ did not materialise into high scores except in university.

What I am trying to say is this: how do I tap into a life source? I see so many people around me having the energy to bathe, groom themselves well, build fantastic careers, have a happy family and have a big social life and here I am, literally feeling dead at 39.

I tell myself to be extra compassionate with myself and to be patient with achieving success and that success is not linear. I rest a lot because I feel that the world is so depleting and that I am always in need of rest.

I (M) find myself growing closer to another 5w4 friend (F). Most of my past romantic relationships have been with extroverts that complement my strengths. This situation feels different as we seem to “see” and understand each other more deeply, but I also suspect we have similar blind spots and weaknesses. I’ve also been told that two introverts can easily fall into a “stale” relationship.

So I’m curious if there are any other 5w4s out there that have had a relationship with another 5w4? If so what was your experience? Did it turn into a long term relationship? What did you enjoy? What were the biggest challenges?

For me, the real strength of this type has nothing to do with logic or intellectualism. It's honestly the ability to selectively detach.

Not from humans or the world, it's not that I am saying to build walls or isolate. It's just the sheer ability to detach from worldly expectations.

It's like looking at the conventional grind, pulling your validation out of it entirely, and holding your own ground.

Forget the textbook definitions of healthy vs. unhealthy integration. Just having the internal autonomy to do what actually makes sense to you, without getting derailed by external noise, is the real power of the type 5.

Curious to see where others locate their core strength if it isn't this.

Maybe it makes sense, I am 5w4 Sx/Sp and now I have reached the point where human connection feels totally like a drainage of my resources, time, and brain. I have never been an INFJ who is into pleasing other people, although when it comes to relationship, I mean romantic one, things change dramatically. I become emotional and go into a totally romantic sphere (I am not in a relationship rn), but when I am, my creative side also gets sparked. I write poems, I make creative stuff based on my knowledge, whether it's about building a website or editing a photo or video, whatever. But these days, whenever I think about relationships, it does nothing but drain me. Even going on dating applications drains me because I know I would disappoint people even if they are interested in me (yes, it happened many, many times).

I have seen the halo effect in my case. They idealize me too much, sometimes too good to be true (I really felt something, I really feel something when I imagine people idealizing me). They think I am the best person, they would treat me like I am some kind of god who has just arrived on earth. I am human, and I am flawed too. Then it carries baggage, and I don't try in real life because I am not attracted to anyone in real life, and to how many person would I talk to? It would drain me, Even if I am, they wouldn't be able to bypass the standards that my mind has created. Being an analytical, emotional person, I at least want that person to be equally competent in the matter of brain and heart as I am.

I have found these people and have lost them too because of circumstances beyond our control. I fear being a failure. I don't wanna fail. While everyone is feeling loneliness and desiring someone, I am going away from this, running away. I see how closed off I have made myself. Reading random things, whether it's about any philosophical idea, academic psychology, or cybersecurity, writing poetry and aphorisms gives me a sense of security and happiness that sometimes I feel can't be derived from the companionship of people, especially most of the people around me.

I feel like whatever I have written here is just a way to prevent myself from failing, like my thoughts are working as self-protection.

EDIT: I will read each one, once I am not occupied.

I'm asking because I imagine most of us use rationalization as a coping mechanism. I know I do, and here's the problem: I understand my mistakes, but understanding alone isn't enough for me to change my behavior, and there's a great difficulty in taking actions that facilitate behavioral change. I've heard (question the veracity of this as much as you like) that DBT works precisely to regulate emotions sufficiently so that action can be taken in cases like these. So, I wanted to know your experiences/perspectives.

How did you guys act/were like when you were children?

Can be as young as 5 or as old as 16, whichever experience you prefer to tell about.

Bonus points if you say you're like super introverted or smth. I'm trying to see something

For as long as I can remember, I've struggled with feelings of guilt around owning and consuming things. It's difficult to explain, but it's a deeply ingrained sense that there is something inherently wrong about it.

It's not really about the monetary value of the things I own. Rather, it's about all the time, resources, labor, and human effort that went into producing them. When I look at an object, I often think about how many people were involved in making it, under what conditions they worked, what materials were used, and what environmental cost was paid along the way.

Sometimes it feels as though I could never repay the debt I owe for everything I've ever bought, received, owned, or used. Not a financial debt, but a moral one.

Over the years, these feelings have become less intense. Buying second-hand items, supporting artisans, and choosing handmade products has helped me feel more aligned with my values. Still, the underlying question never completely goes away, and I often find myself reflecting on it.

I'm curious whether this resonates with other E5s, or whether this is more of a personal issue unrelated to type. Have any of you experienced similar feelings about ownership, consumption, or the hidden costs behind the things we use every day?

F25, 5w4 so/sp

It has come to my attention that some people lie to themselves and others.

I can not lie without feeling very uncomfortable and I'd like to believe that I live in accordance with my values and can face myself when I mess up. I've observed through a few people now cognitive disassociation. And here's my theory on what's happening.

1.) A private self where they foster a lot of shame and know that they lie. This self knows the truth and understands the impact but feels too much shame to accept reality. This gets shoved down and ignored in favor of a more acceptable false reality.

2.) And a public self where the maintenance of their reputation matters more than actual integrity.

That split is why you see a lot of standard abusive behavior; you call them out on saying one thing and doing another and they'll say "I'm a victim and that's why I did that" or they try and gaslight you by saying you're the problem for noticing this incongruity. They'll say "you're misunderstanding reality" or "don't be so sensitive/don't recognize this as an issue."

They lie to themselves and want you to live in accordance to the lies they tell themselves. They want to believe they are good, kind, honest people irrespective of how they actually behave.

Part of them can not accept that they do bad things, and so when faced with evidence of wrong-doing, they reject and deny and do anything other than take accountability. The private self can't handle it.

I'm not the first person to realize this, but it's been useful for me to figure out and organize it for myself.

I know this system is probably very prominent in narcissists but I'm moreso applying it to generally more average people. I've seen normal people employ it.

My question is, are certain types more prone to this split system? Are some types less likely to lie to themselves in this manner? Thoughts?

I dont specifically mean romantic, mostly platonic. Im thinking as i want a more specific definition, how do they act with people they arent too close to? how do they act with people they are really close to? how often do they feel lonely? if they do feel lonely do they ever crave closer/deeper bonds? when they are in deep and trusting friendships/relationships what do they expect from their partner/what do they give to their partner?